DRDO, PSU and Private Defence Sector News

[vishnugupt]

I don't know where to put this...


I hope that history doesn't repeat, atleast in nag's context. Sorry if already posted.

If you see status of QRSAM, Helina, Nag, Bombs, LCH, Astra ( recently cleared )many mores, on DRDO website all are being inducted despite of no orders from Armed forces. Once developmental trials done DRDO can safely tell that product is being inducted but in reality, this process may take 100 years.

Armed forces now change the game rules. Initially (1960-70) they used to reject any proposal by DRDO Then they tried sabotage methods they used to kill projects, delaying GSQR, No clear requirements, Buying manufacturing units. after 2000, they start supporting indigenous project but keep them in trials for decades until product becomes outdated, keep giving small small demands.
After Modi They support Indigenous, Do trials, Verbally supports them but never order or if orders ? then only after exhausting all import options. DRDO also happy they completed project and Armed forces also happy Win -win situation for both but Manufacturing units are crying

Thanks for putting some facts.
Even today, They are same. Armed force buy Indian either due to desperation or shoved by GOI.
Armed forces was sitting on Software define radio from 2012 but it took them 27-Feb Humiliation to buy a SDR. Before that... Trials trials trials trials

 

[Tuco]

Thanks for putting some facts.
Even today, They are same. Armed force buy Indian either due to desperation or shoved by GOI.
Armed forces was sitting on Software define radio from 2012 but it took them 27-Feb Humiliation to buy a SDR. Before that... Trials trials trials trials

Add this to the list.

 

[Karthi]

CHINA – INDIA Military Balance,Ballistic Missiles.

Introduction Ballistic missiles are rocket-propelled, self-guided vehicles that follow a ballistic trajectory to deliver nuclear or conventional weapons. They can be launched from aircraft, ships,...

fullafterburner.weebly.com

Recommend a read

 

[fire starter]

 

[Akula]

New missile with AD-1 and AD-2.

 

[fire starter]

finally sense prevailed.

 

[fire starter]

 

[Tuco]

I have a question regarding Nag ATGM. If the point of failure is mostly due to the failure of seeker to get a lock on targets due to high desert ambient temperatures, the said issue has been taken care off as per reports, what is stopping the army from acquiring it for other sectors as usage is not limited to deserts only. It should work well in plains of Punjab. Is there some fault that we do not know off, Bhadraji mentions minimum range is not satisfactory.

 

[noobmaster69]

I have a question regarding Nag ATGM. If the point of failure is mostly due to the failure of seeker to get a lock on targets due to high desert ambient temperatures, the said issue has been taken care off as per reports, what is stopping the army from acquiring it for other sectors as usage is not limited to deserts only. It should work well in plains of Punjab. Is there some fault that we do not know off, Bhadraji mentions minimum range is not satisfactory.

Hasn't that been rectified since? In one youtube video from the youtube channel "Defence Matrix", the guy says that the missile outperform the Spike in identifying the target at 4 km range in hot desert but no orders are being placed because there's some issue with production which the DRDO is working on to resolve. Those are his words though, would love someone with more knowledge on the topic to chime in.

 

[vishnugupt]

I have a question regarding Nag ATGM. If the point of failure is mostly due to the failure of seeker to get a lock on targets due to high desert ambient temperatures, the said issue has been taken care off as per reports, what is stopping the army from acquiring it for other sectors as usage is not limited to deserts only. It should work well in plains of Punjab. Is there some fault that we do not know off, Bhadraji mentions minimum range is not satisfactory.

Because DRDO doesn't offer kick back money or foreign tours . Compare this with Barak 8 missiles. How many trials they did to a Newly Israeli missile ?? maximum 8 or 10 and how much we know about their drawbacks ?? Zero, Because Israeli had paid enough money to take care about that.
If it was an Indian missile Armed force will do at least 50 missiles test and top on that they will ask 50 LSP just to check its efficacy and production quality from that same company which is also manufacturing Barak-8 ( BDL )

 

[vishnugupt]

Hasn't that been rectified since? In one youtube video from the youtube channel "Defence Matrix", the guy says that the missile outperform the Spike in identifying the target at 4 km range in hot desert but no orders are being placed because there's some issue with production which the DRDO is working on to resolve. Those are his words though, would love someone with more knowledge on the topic to chime in.

Production issue?? Huhh, Before this army person could have tell us what was that manufacturing issue is, His tongue bitten by scorpion.
first, Production issue does not come under DRDO ambit once they successfully demonstrated weapons during trials their job is done. Secondly, Production matters come under manufacturing units ( Some time Manufacturer take consultancy from designers ) but how they had manufactured testing units of NAG for trials which they can't manufacture now ??
Moreover, how this stupid army guys come to know about manufacturing issue?? had they given any orders of NAG?? Where manufacturing is going on without any order??

 

[Raj Malhotra]

Because DRDO doesn't offer kick back money or foreign tours . Compare this with Barak 8 missiles. How many trials they did to a Newly Israeli missile ?? maximum 8 or 10 and how much we know about their drawbacks ?? Zero, Because Israeli had paid enough money to take care about that.
If it was an Indian missile Armed force will do at least 50 missiles test and top on that they will ask 50 LSP just to check its efficacy and production quality from that same company which is also manufacturing Barak-8 ( BDL )

Let me tell you, the USD 365 Million + USD 2.2 Billon ie Rs. 20,000 crore Initial missile Deal for Barak-8 provided for ZERO TESTS IN INDIA OR ISRAEL.

Later on 3 tests were incorporated conducted around 9 years after the contract.

 

[no smoking]

From Nashik to Thiruvananthapuram: Mammoth truck covers 1,700km in 10 months.

A 74-tyre truck carrying machinery weighing 70 tonnes finally reached the Vikram Sarabhai Space Centre (VSSC) in Thiruvananthapuram on Saturday 10 months after it began its journey from Maharashtra’s Nashik, around 1,700 km away, to the country’s premier research institute.
...........

They are not comparable at all. The difference between the one showed in your picture and TEL is as big as Tejas vs a light propeller plane for tourists.

TEL is generally equipped cutting-edge technologies to protect missile, from quake-proof to temperature control. Also, the missile itself is structural strengthened to deal with long time road travel. I believe neither the truck, nor the machinery has this requirement.

For example, the Russian Topol-M TEL is said to travel at 45km/h and it could be much higher in emergency ( war).

I posted this here cos how our ICBMs like Agni 5&6 will manuver in our narrow roads . May be they will only assemble the missile when arrive at the launch site .

No you can't assemble it at the launch site. Just like the those missiles in silos, the best opportunity to destroy these road maneuver missiles are either in the storage/base, or the launch site. In other words, when these missile trucks stop. The longer you stop at one place, the more dangerous for you.

That is why Russians and Chinese spent so much to put their missiles on TEL (Topol-M and DF-41) instead of MEL (DF-31 and Agni). The advantages of TEL are:
1. It integrates the status checking system, the whole checking process can be done in the running. So, unlike MEL, you don't need to do the check again once you stop to launch;
2. It has self navigation and targeting systems. Once you stop, the on-board systems can calculated all the necessary parameters for targeting in shortest time;
3. It has specifically designed balancing system help the missile launching from not-so-harden ground. Adding the systems in note 2, you basically can launch the missile from any ground instead of the pre-set launch site.

With all these systems together, the TEL can shoot the missile within 15-20 minutes after stopping, which is much shorter than MEL.

 

[Akula]

They are not comparable at all. The difference between the one showed in your picture and TEL is as big as Tejas vs a light propeller plane for tourists.

TEL is generally equipped cutting-edge technologies to protect missile, from quake-proof to temperature control. Also, the missile itself is structural strengthened to deal with long time road travel. I believe neither the truck, nor the machinery has this requirement.

For example, the Russian Topol-M TEL is said to travel at 45km/h and it could be much higher in emergency ( war).



No you can't assemble it at the launch site. Just like the those missiles in silos, the best opportunity to destroy these road maneuver missiles are either in the storage/base, or the launch site. In other words, when these missile trucks stop. The longer you stop at one place, the more dangerous for you.

That is why Russians and Chinese spent so much to put their missiles on TEL (Topol-M and DF-41) instead of MEL (DF-31 and Agni). The advantages of TEL are:
1. It integrates the status checking system, the whole checking process can be done in the running. So, unlike MEL, you don't need to do the check again once you stop to launch;
2. It has self navigation and targeting systems. Once you stop, the on-board systems can calculated all the necessary parameters for targeting in shortest time;
3. It has specifically designed balancing system help the missile launching from not-so-harden ground. Adding the systems in note 2, you basically can launch the missile from any ground instead of the pre-set launch site.

With all these systems together, the TEL can shoot the missile within 15-20 minutes after stopping, which is much shorter than MEL.

The truck was carrying an autoclave.

 

[Karthi]

They are not comparable at all. The difference between the one showed in your picture and TEL is as big as Tejas vs a light propeller plane for tourists.

TEL is generally equipped cutting-edge technologies to protect missile, from quake-proof to temperature control. Also, the missile itself is structural strengthened to deal with long time road travel. I believe neither the truck, nor the machinery has this requirement.

For example, the Russian Topol-M TEL is said to travel at 45km/h and it could be much higher in emergency ( war).



No you can't assemble it at the launch site. Just like the those missiles in silos, the best opportunity to destroy these road maneuver missiles are either in the storage/base, or the launch site. In other words, when these missile trucks stop. The longer you stop at one place, the more dangerous for you.

That is why Russians and Chinese spent so much to put their missiles on TEL (Topol-M and DF-41) instead of MEL (DF-31 and Agni). The advantages of TEL are:
1. It integrates the status checking system, the whole checking process can be done in the running. So, unlike MEL, you don't need to do the check again once you stop to launch;
2. It has self navigation and targeting systems. Once you stop, the on-board systems can calculated all the necessary parameters for targeting in shortest time;
3. It has specifically designed balancing system help the missile launching from not-so-harden ground. Adding the systems in note 2, you basically can launch the missile from any ground instead of the pre-set launch site.

With all these systems together, the TEL can shoot the missile within 15-20 minutes after stopping, which is much shorter than MEL.

No sir this is serious problem indeed , As an example Agni 5 50 T weight,17 m in length , Agni 6 70-80 tonnes 17-18 m length . Both Agni 5&6 much bigger than the autoclave , I myself witnessed ISROs booster were stuck in a traffic jam . Our Missile bases are in Assam , Maharashtra , Hyderabad Pune etc is notoriou in traffic jam . Village roads are in poor condition . As what porky kicker said predefined path's are vulnerable to counter attack . If we block roads for easy transportation it will immediately alert the opponents and using Satellite's they can easily find it out . We need to improve our Infrastructure , I think We are opted for SLBM over land based ICBM .and all Agni missiles are road /rail TEL based systems

 

[noobmaster69]

Production issue?? Huhh, Before this army person could have tell us what was that manufacturing issue is, His tongue bitten by scorpion.
first, Production issue does not come under DRDO ambit once they successfully demonstrated weapons during trials their job is done. Secondly, Production matters come under manufacturing units ( Some time Manufacturer take consultancy from designers ) but how they had manufactured testing units of NAG for trials which they can't manufacture oreover, how this stupid army guys come to know about manufacturing issue?? had they given any orders of NAG?? Where manufacturing is going on without any order??

Hadn't an initial production batch been cleared in 2018? What happened to that? Did it not go through? https://m.economictimes.com/news/de...h-over-rs-3600-crore/articleshow/63942467.cms

 

[patriots]

Army is more interested in a man portable atgm.....that may be the sole reason....
The seeker issue of nag atgm rectified
Spike atgm was unable to recognise it's target in hot desert condition,which nag easily hits...
I have come across some reason s given by friends in sm and here too..... trying to refute their claims

1.some says that nag is over weight
My point is nag is not a mpatgm,it has its own carrier namica.
2.some says namica is tin can,can't move

When nag and namica developed ,only bmp2 was available,and only bmp2 is the only amphibious platform available with army
If bmp2 is a tin can they why army recently ordered more bmp2s
3.Nag has problem with seeker
Spike was unable to recognise target s,in hot desert condition,but nag atgm achieved bulls eye,in previous test mpatgm variant of nag also struck it's target in desert.Then it has problem,how nag cleared trials
4.Nag has production issue
How many nags ordered,

Helina
1.Helina is not good as helifire
Ok helina is not good as helifire,is not helina cheaper than helifire


Then I too believe some improvement s should be done.
1.The namica carrier should have latest bmp2 update s
2.whap with nag atgm should be developed

Again ia didn't have a similar platform ,so nag should be inducted
I have seen people crying here tejas doesn't have this....that....
Now Tejas ioc is flying with bvrs.....
So without armed forces support.... Atmanirbhar bharat will not............ possible

Because DRDO doesn't offer kick back money or foreign tours . Compare this with Barak 8 missiles. How many trials they did to a Newly Israeli missile ?? maximum 8 or 10 and how much we know about their drawbacks ?? Zero, Because Israeli had paid enough money to take care about that.
If it was an Indian missile Armed force will do at least 50 missiles test and top on that they will ask 50 LSP just to check its efficacy and production quality from that same company which is also manufacturing Barak-8 ( BDL )

 

[utubekhiladi]

@porky_kicker

bro, any latest updates on k-15, k-4, k-5, k-6 and astra?

 

[Akula]

Akash

Army is more interested in a man portable atgm.....that may be the sole reason....
The seeker issue of nag atgm rectified
Spike atgm was unable to recognise it's target in hot desert condition,which nag easily hits...
I have come across some reason s given by friends in sm and here too..... trying to refute their claims

1.some says that nag is over weight
My point is nag is not a mpatgm,it has its own carrier namica.
2.some says namica is tin can,can't move

When nag and namica developed ,only bmp2 was available,and only bmp2 is the only amphibious platform available with army
If bmp2 is a tin can they why army recently ordered more bmp2s
3.Nag has problem with seeker
Spike was unable to recognise target s,in hot desert condition,but nag atgm achieved bulls eye,in previous test mpatgm variant of nag also struck it's target in desert.Then it has problem,how nag cleared trials
4.Nag has production issue
How many nags ordered,

Helina
1.Helina is not good as helifire
Ok helina is not good as helifire,is not helina cheaper than helifire


Then I too believe some improvement s should be done.
1.The namica carrier should have latest bmp2 update s
2.whap with nag atgm should be developed

Again ia didn't have a similar platform ,so nag should be inducted
I have seen people crying here tejas doesn't have this....that....
Now Tejas ioc is flying with bvrs.....
So without armed forces support.... Atmanirbhar bharat will not............ possible

But NAG missile carrier "Namica" has already been redesigned. The previous version has 8 missile cells compared to current version's 6.

 

[porky_kicker]

@porky_kicker

bro, any latest updates on k-15, k-4, k-5, k-6 and astra?

No updates on k series

Nobody can give updates on k series unless officially released

Anyways
K5 might have a blunt nose cone with a possible retracted aerospike ( deployed after launch )