Demolished : claims of islamic golden age

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Credit* : This thread has been compiled out of information gathered from multiple sources documentations etc. The works of Sanjay Dixit The Jaipur Dialogues ,RAJ VEDAM and NS RAJARAM, SANGAM TALKS and INDICTALES,Intellectual Kshatriya. PRACHYAM, Abhijeet CHAVDA. N. Kazanas.
The works of S KALYANARAMAN, ARJUNAN PANDIAN, Koenraad Elst.Neeraj Atri, Rajiv Malhotra including apostate mohamed, SWADESHI INDOLOGY and DHARMA Dispatch networks finally The Sanskrit Channel and Mr. Sanjeev Sanyal etc also Syed kamran mirza and probably to all those hundred more authors and scholars who work tirelessly without bias continue to put forth the light of truth.


The period of 7th to 13th century ad is often quoted by many psychotic muslimes on how deen of allah forged the way for all the science and everything good that exists in this universe.This never-ending delusion is so deep rooted in their minds that it acts like incurable disease, such as cancer. These dolts keep bragging about many muslims-born luminaries (who brought the so called “islamic golden age”) and enthusiastically color them as islamic "scientists” and call their achievements as the islamic "science”. According to them, these ancient muslim-born luminaries were the product of religion of islam and those ancient luminaries were devout muslims, and their success was only because of allah lulz. They want to use this as the clear proof that—islam is trooo and what not.

A critical analyses rather shows entirely different picture.

Although there is no arguing that the muslim world was relatively more advanced during this particular era than the christian world that was propelled into dark ages lasting as long as 1000 years (after church started persecution banned all transfer of knowledge from other parts of the world especially from Bharat and labeling all of such existing knowledge systems thesis etc as handiwork of satan) that is not the subject of this thread.

DHARMA triumph15.JPG



The fundamental topic of this thread is to look at the reasons for this so called claims behind 'islamic golden age' which had absolutely nothing to do with deen of allah - other than being mandate for military jihad. It is a lie that is fed to you. One basic claim extensively used by muslim apologetics is that pre islamic arabia was a backward society. This claim has no foundations now. We know arabia before islam was infact in no way a backward country. Just take the example of khadija who was married to muhammad ibn abdullah. She was a well known businesswoman,much older than muhammad and was divorced multiple times. This shows that the women had rights and liberty in pre islamic arabian society and trade with neighbor empires was thriving.

Since this is mere the introductory post so we are not going into much details regarding pre islamic arabia.

On to the topic so yeah the muslim world benefited greatly from the Greek sciences and as well Hindus and persians , which were translated for them by dhimmi christians polythiest persians and jews living in subjugation of subhuman shariah plague. The only credit being muslim did a better job of preserving Greek texts and different manuscripts than many others at that time, and this became the foundation for so called islamic 'science' . (Although one large reason is that access by christians to this part of their world was cut off by muslim slave ships and coastal raids that dominated the Mediterranean during this era).

DHARMA triumph.JPG


It is however also true that scholars and engineers (from various faiths: Hindus, Christian, Jews, etc.) of the islamic world contributed enormously to the arts, literature, philosophy, sciences and technology both by preserving and building upon earlier traditions and by adding their own inventions and innovations. The irony is that their contribution is labelled and shamelessly propagandized as something 'muslim'.

We are also aware of many muslim arab persian philosophers and poets artists and scientists laborers basically arab culture that has influenced societies on every continent. Neverthless the question must be asked what was the real dynamic force behind the making of this 'so called golden age'? It was clearly not the scriptural dictums of al kitab —the blind-faith on Allah. In fact the deen of al kitab is the only faith, which pretends to Claim all the goodies of this planet as its own. Its adepts consider islam is the best/true faith from Allah and muslims are best of people in al imran ayat 110 and calls kafirs the worst of creatures in al bayyinah in a racist subhuman bigoted way. Most devout fanatical muslims in particular, as well as, a good percentage of gullible muslims in general, express insane nostalgia and demented psychosis about the so called ‘islamic golden age’. Coomers go on to blame Hindus jews christians and other polythiests for all of their problem and lurk behind the hijab of islamophobia which is nothing but a tool to silence the speakers of truth !


The matter of fact being :

Many of the scientific advances credited to islam were actually “borrowed” from other cultures conquered by the muslim arabs. The algebraic concept of “zero”, for example, is erroneously attributed to deen of allah when it was, in fact, a HINDU discovery that was merely introduced to the amreeka and elsewhere by arab.


DHARMA Triumph15.JPG


The hard hitting fact being the conquered populations contributed greatly to the history of “islamic golden age" until gradually being decimated by conversion to the desert cult (under the pressures of dhimmitude). Mark steyn puts it...

"When admirers talk up islam and the great innovations and rich culture of its heyday, they forget that even at its height muslim were never more than a minority in the muslim world, and they were in large part living off the energy of others."

Raziatoppelislamicbs.jpg


For example the accomplished scientists and cultural icons who were so muslims were often considered heretics in their day, sometimes with good reason. One of the greatest achievers to come out of the muslim world was the Persian scientist and philosopher, Muhammad ibn Zakariya al-Razi. His impressive works are often held up as 'proof' of muslim accomplishment. But what retards often leave out is that al-Razi was denounced as a blasphemer for following his own religious beliefs – which were in total contradiction to traditional shitlamic bs.


Khayyamdemolishedislamicbs.JPG


Then observatory of Taqi al-Din in freshly conquered istanbul is yet another example often neglect to mention that it was quickly destroyed by the shariah enforcing caliphate.

Two books on the history of mathematics. One called “History of Mathematics” by Boyer and Merzbach and “God created the integers” edited by Hawking alone contain more than enough nightmare fuel for islamic science.

However, it would be unfair not to mention some of those great muslim scholars, though very few in number, who genuinely contributed in the development of philosophy and science the irony is they all were shunned trolled cursed persecuted by the jihadi caliphates and its vermin rulers.

  1. Al-Razi (865 – 925 ce) from Persia, the greatest of all muslim physicians, philosophers and alchemists wrote 184 articles and books, dismissed revelation and considered religion a dangerous thing. Al-Razi was condemned for blasphemy and almost all his books were destroyed later.
  2. Ibn-e-Sina or Avicinna (980-1037ce), another great uzbek physician, philosopher and scientist. Avicenna held philosophy superior to theology. His views were in sharp contrast to central islamic doctrines and he rejected the resurrection of the dead in flesh and blood. As a consequence of his views, he became main target of Al-Ghazali and was labeled an apostate.
  3. Ibn-e-Rushd (1126-1198 ce) or Averroes from Spain was a philosopher and scientist who expounded the al kitab in Aristotelian terms. He was found guilty of heresy, his books burnt, he was interrogated and banished from Lucena.
  4. Al-Bairuni (973-1048 ce), the father of Indology and a versatile genius, was of the strong view that quran has its own domain and it does not interfere with the realm of science. [NS RAJARAM: Al-Bairuni, or Al-Biruni as he is better known in BHARAT, makes it clear that the islamic invasions made Hindu (and Buddhistic) centers of learning their special targets. In his words: “…Hindus became like atoms of dust scattered in all directions. …This is the reason too why Hindu sciences have retired far away from those parts of the country conquered by us, and have fled to places which our (muslim) hands cannot reach.” The last great center of mathematics was in Kerala, from their reach.]
  5. Al-Khawarazmi (780-850 ce) was another Persian mathematician, astronomer and geographer. The historian Al-Tabari considered him a Zoroastrian while others thought that he was a muslim. However nowhere in his works has he neither acknowledged nor linked any of his findings to al kitab.
  6. Omar Khayyam (1048-1131 ce), one of the greatest mathematicians, astronomers and poets was highly critical of religion, particularly Islam. He severely criticized the idea that every event and phenomena was the result of divine intervention. [NS RAJARAM: Omar Kyayyam is known to the world mainly as the author of the Rubayiyat (in its English translation by Fitzgerald), but native Persians see him as a minor poet but a great scientist. Like all free thinkers he was denounced as a heretic.]
  7. Al-Farabi (872-950 ce), another great muslim philosopher, highly inspired by Aristotle, considered reason superior to revelation and advocated for the relegation of prophecy to philosophy.Was shunned by muslim.
  8. Abu Musa Jabir- bin- Hayan or Geber (721-815 ce) was an accomplished muslim alchemist cum pharmacist. Although he was inclined towards mysticism, he fully acknowledged the role of experimentation in scientific endeavors. Was persecuted by muslims.
  9. Ibn-ul-haitham or Hazen (965-1040 ce) was an outstanding physicist, mathematician, astronomer and an expert on optics. He was ordered by Fatimid King Al-Hakim to regulate the floods of the Nile, which he knew was not scientifically possible. He feigned madness and was placed under house arrest for the rest of his life.

The origin of coffee as muslim invention is also a debatable topic.

I am opening this thread with an open question before you all.....

When ever in the history of human kind has islam experienced the enlightenment?
Lets be honest that islam cannot experience any enlightenment.
Why because islam cannot tolerate critical, independent thought then how could it ever contribute in any sort of "golden age" ?


In fact deen of allah tends to discourage knowledge outside of itself al mayda which is why the most prolific muslim scholars are mostly students of deen rather than science.
As the Saudi Grand Mufti bluntly put it in 2010, "The Quran with its stories and knowledge are sufficient for us... we don't need the torah, or gospels, or any other book.


Probably best arab non muslim poet...
- A Little Doubt is Better -
Traditions come from the past, of high import if they be True; Ay, but weak is the chain of those who warrant their truth.
Consult thy reason and let perdition take others all: Of all the conference Reason best will counsel and guide.
A little doubt is better than total credulity: O fools, awake! The rites you sacred hold Are but a cheat contrived by men of old, Who lusted after wealth and gained their lust And died in baseness—and their law is dust.
(Al-Ma'arri)
 
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asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Continued from introductory post :

The Myth of Islamic Science : N S RAJARAM
(Among NS RAJARAM has numerous books, the “The Dead Sea scrolls and the crisis of Christianity” is widely acclaimed. )


It is widely believed and taught, including in India, that there was a Golden Age of Islamic learning that made a major contribution to science and the arts. In India we are told that this ‘synthesis’ between Hindu and Muslim thought gave rise to a great ‘syncretic’ civilization that was suppressed and eventually destroyed by the British. However, this flies in the face of the fact that not a single name of a major scientist from the five-plus centuries of Islamic rule of India has come down to us. We have to go to pre-Islamic India to invoke names from the past— names like Aryabhata, Varahamihira and the like.


AlBeruni
Al Biruni, eyewitness to the destruction of Indian learning

It is a similar story when we look at universities or centers of learning. Pre-Islamic India was renowned for its universities: Takshashila, Vikramashila, Nalanda, Ujjain and other places attracted students and scholars alike from far and wide, much like the United States of today.


After the establishment of the Delhi Sultanate, not a single center of learning (other than Islamic seminaries) was established for over seven centuries. The first modern universities came to be established only during the British rule.


Also worth noting is the fact that the so-called ‘synthesis’ of learning took place before Islamic invasions engulfed both India and Persia in a Dark Age. The Sassanid emperor Kosrau I deserves much of the credit for work that is wrongly credited to Islamic rulers and scholars.


Khosrau I (reigned 531–79) known as Anushirvan or ‘the immortal soul’ was a great patron of philosophy and knowledge. He gave refuge to scholars from the Eastern Roman Empire when the bigoted Christian Emperor Justinian closed down the neo-Platonist schools in Athens in 529 AD. Earlier, in 415 AD, Christian goons led by ‘Saint’ Cyril burnt down the great library in Alexandria and murdered the neo-Platonic scholar Hypatia who taught there, because another ‘saint’ Paul had decreed that women must keep their silence.


Khosrau was greatly interested in Indian philosophy, science, mathematics, and medicine. He sent multiple embassies and gifts to the Indian court and requested them to send back philosophers to teach in his court in return. Khosrau made many translations of texts from Greek, Sanskrit, and Syriac into Middle Persian. He was lauded as “Plato’s Philosopher King” by the Greek refugees that he allowed into his empire because of his great interest in Platonic philosophy.


A synthesis of Greek, Persian, Indian, and Armenian learning traditions took place within the Sassanian Empire. One outcome of this synthesis created what is known as bimari-stan (‘home for the ailing’), the first hospital that introduced a concept of segregating wards according to pathology. Greek pharmacology fused with Iranian and Indian traditions resulted in significant advances in medicine.


Regrettably this pre-Islamic era of learning came to an abrupt end following the Arab (Muslim) invasions and the defeat of Sassanid Persia The reality is that most of this ‘synthesis’ took place in the pre-Islamic period until Islamic invasions sank both Persia and India into a Dark Age lasting centuries.


IndiaFacts is grateful to the author Waseem Altaf and the publication Viewpointsonline.net for the article. No photograph of the author is published out of concern for the author’s safety. Here is his essay.


Science in the Islamic world


Rational thought in the Muslim world developed during the reign of liberal Muslim rulers of the Abbasid dynasty. However it was after the rise of scholars like Al-Ghazali that all scientific reasoning came to an end in the 13th century. As we remain enamored by our past achievements in the sciences, we forget that there is very little “original” we as Muslims can celebrate and be proud of.


It was during the reign of the early Abbasid caliphs, particularly Mamun-ur-Rashid (around 813 CE) that in his Dar-ul-Hikmah (the house of wisdom) in Baghdad, Muslim scholars would begin translating the classic Greek works, primarily toeing the Aristotelian tradition. In addition, they were heavily relying on Persian and Indian sources. They also penned huge commentaries on works by Greek philosophers. However, the Muslim translators were small in number and were primarily driven by curiosity. More than ninety nine percent Arabic translations of works of Greek philosophers were done by either Christian or Jewish scholars. It is interesting to note that Islamic astronomy, based on Ptolemy’s system was geocentric. Algebra was originally a Greek discipline and ‘Arabic’ numbers were actually Indian.


Al Ghazali
Al-Ghazali put an end to free thinking

[N.S Rajaram: Indians invented algebra, calling it bija-ganita. Greeks considered some special cases in number theory like Diophantine Equations, also known to the Indians. The cumbersome letter-based notation (like the later Roman numerals) did not lend itself to problems in algebra. The major Greek contributions were the concept of proof (known also to Indians) and above all the axiomatic method at which they excelled. The Arabs themselves never denied their indebtedness to the Hindus in astronomy, medicine and mathematics. They called their numbers ‘Hindu numerals’. As noted in the Editor’s Introduction, much of this took place in pre-Islamic Iran, especially under Khusro I.]


Most of these works were available to the West during 12th century when the first renaissance was taking place. Although Western scholars did travel to Spain to study Arabic versions of classical Greek thought, they soon found out that better versions of original texts in Greek were also available in the libraries of the ancient Greek city of Byzantium.

Contribution of unorthodox thinkers


As we go through the life histories of these great men we find that they were influenced by Greek, Babylonian or Indian contributions to philosophy and science, had a critical and reasoning mind and were ‘not good’ Muslims or even atheists. A significant number of them were reluctant to even reveal the status of their beliefs for fear of reprisal from the fanatics. They never ascribed their achievements to Islam or divinity. And they were scholars and scientists because of a critical mind which would think and derive inspiration from observation and not scriptures which set restrictions on free thinking and unhindered pursuit of knowledge.


Avicenna author of the famous Canon of Medicine
Avicenna author of the famous Canon of Medicine




Hence bringing in Islam to highlight achievements of Muslim scientists is nothing but sheer rhetoric as these men did not derive their achievements out of Islam or flourished due to Islam. And we find that whatever little contribution to science was made can be owed to ‘imperfect Muslims’.


[NS Rajaram: Muslims are not alone in this. Many Hindu scholars also make extravagant claims in the name of ‘Vedic science’ and the like that have no basis. Considering their numbers, the Hindus don’t have a particularly good record, compared to say, the Jews. India and Israel became independent countries around the same time but in science there is no comparison. Retreat into religion in the name of ‘spirituality’ must take its share of the blame. Hindu moneybags spend lavishly on religious endowments and dubious holy men, but are measly when it comes to supporting temples of learning. And the few they do (like the Hindu University of America) are an embarrassment and get bogged down in obscurantism and mismanagement.]




Putting ‘God’s hands in chains’

However it was the ‘perfect Muslim’, the Islamist, from the 12th century who was to give the biggest blow to scientific thought in the Muslim world.


Imam Ghazali (1058-1111 CE) who still occupies a centrestage among Muslim philosophers openly denounced the laws of nature and scientific reasoning. Ghazali argued that any such laws would put God’s hands in chains. He would assert that a piece of cotton burns when put to fire, not because of physical reasons but because God wants it to burn. Ghazali was also a strong supporter of the Ash’arites, the philosophers who would uphold the precedence of divine intervention over physical phenomena and bitterly opposed the Mu’tazillites— or the rationalists who were the true upholders of scientific thought.




In other words Ghazali championed the cause of orthodoxy and dogmatism at the cost of rationality and scientific reasoning. Today we find that all four major schools of Sunni Islam reject the concept of ‘Ijtehad’ which can loosely be translated as ‘freedom of thought’. Hence there is absolutely no room for any innovation or modification in traditional thought patterns.


We also find that as Europe was making use of technology while transforming into a culture of machines, the acceptance of these machines was extremely slow in the Islamic world. One prime example is that of the printing press which reached Muslim lands in 1492. However, printing was banned by Islamic authorities because they believed the Koran would be dishonored by appearing out of a machine. As a result, Arabs did not acquire printing press until the 18th century.


Khusro Anivarshan known as the ‘Just’
Khusro Anivarshan known as the ‘Just’

It also stands established that science is born out of secularism and democracy and not religious dogmatism. And science only flourished in places where religion had no role to play in matters of state. Hence there is an inverse relationship between religious orthodoxy and progress in science. Rational thought in the Muslim world developed during the reign of liberal Muslim rulers of the Abbasid dynasty who patronized the Mu’tazillites or rational thinkers.


However it was after the religious zealots’ compilation of the ahadis and the rise of scholars like Al-Ghazali that all scientific reasoning came to an end in the 13th century. As a consequence, Muslims contributed almost nothing to scientific progress and human civilization since the dawn of the 13th century. And while science and technology flourish in the modern world, a vast majority of Muslims, engulfed by obscurantism, still find solace in fantasies of a bygone era——the so called ‘golden age’ of Islam.


Concluding comments by Dr. N.S. Rajaram


Whether one agrees with the author’s radical conclusions or not, it is undeniable that the contributions to science under the great Islamic empires was disproportionately small considering their wealth and power. We already saw that their record in India even during the supposedly ‘great’ Mogul empire was dismal. Part of the problem was that Islamic rulers, instead of encouraging learning, hired foreigners and mercenaries— like Hindus in India and Jews and Christians in the Ottoman Empire.


Indian Muslim historians like Irfan Habib have tried to explain this intellectual vacuum of the Islamic period in India claiming that its rulers were mainly nomadic tribes from Central Asia (like Turks) who were more interested in military exploits than learning or scholarship. But why only under Islam in a belt from India to Turkey and beyond, and that too only after the coming of Islam?


One has to agree with the author Waseem Altaf that Islam (like Medieval Christianity) was mainly responsible for this continuing backwardness. Others, notably Hindus should learn from this and avoid getting trapped in the past.
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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During the Abbasid’s rule many great writers and poets started to appear in Syria and Iraq. I am only going to briefly mention some of the best known names to see what they thought of the al kitab.
Abu Nawas (750-810) was close to the famous Caliph Harun Alrashid, and is well known by his poetry that celebrated wine and male homosexuality. Obviously the Quran didn’t mean much to this great poet.
Al Mutanabbi (915-965) is largely considered to be the most famous Arab poet of all time. How are we supposed to believe that this man had admired the al kitab, especially that we know he authored his own al kitab and claimed to be a prophet (hence his name). Almutanabbi apologized later to save his life. As would be expected, none of his ‘al kitab’ reached us.
Abu Al Alaa Al Maarri (973-1057) was a blind Syrian philosopher and poet who is considered by many as the best Arabs poet. Abu Al Alaa was even more outspoken in his criticism to islam and the al kitab, his writings leave no doubt that he was too intelligent to subscribe to an ideology like Islam. Consider. He also authored some verses similar to the al kitab to a group of Arabs. When one of the men commented that the verses didn’t have that familiar resonance of the al kitab’ Abu Al Alaa responded:“when you read it days and nights for years, it will”.
Ibn Rushd (1126-1198) philosopher and writer shunned by allah.
Ibn Al Rawandi (An Author and outspoken critic of islam, rejected muhammad’s claims of being a prophet).
Ibn Al Mukafaa ( writer and translator, murdered by the jihadis in 755 ad.
Al Razi (865-925 Physician and writer) persecuted by jihadis.
Abu Al Alaa Al-Maʿarri - Philosophy

He was skeptic in his beliefs and denounced superstition and dogmatism in religion. Thus, he has been described as a pessimistic freethinker, some argue that he might have been a deist. One of the recurring themes of his philosophy was the rights of reason against the claims of custom, tradition and authority.

Al-Maʿarri taught that religion was a "fable invented by the ancients,worthless except for those who exploit the credulous masses.

Do not suppose the statements of the prophets to be true; they are all fabrications. Men lived comfortably till they came and spoiled life. The sacred books are only such a set of idle tales as any age could have and indeed did actually produce.

Al-Maʿarri criticized many of the dogmas of Islam, such as the Hajj, which he called, "a heathen’s journey."[9]
He rejected claims of any asmaani revelation.

His creed was that of a philosopher and ascetic, for whom reason provides a moral guide, and virtue is its own reward.

Al-Maarri's fundamental pessimism is expressed in his recommendation that no children should be begotten, so as to spare them the pains of life. In an elegy composed by him over the loss of a relative, he combines his grief with observations on the ephemerality of this life.

Soften your tread. Methinks the earth’s surface is but bodies of the dead,
Walk slowly in the air, so you do not trample on the remains of God’s servants.

His skepticism and positively anti deen views are expressed in a poem which states

"The inhabitants of the earth are of two sorts: those with brains, but no religion, and those with religion, but no brains."
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslims-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottomline being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.


  • Al-Razi or Rhazes (865-925):
    Al-Razi (Rhazes) portrait

    Al-Razi was the preeminent physician, alchemist and chemist, philosopher, and scholar of his time. has been described as the father of pediatrics. He was also a pioneer of ophthalmology.
    Abū Bakr Muhammad ibn Zakariyā al-Razi, known as Rhazes or Rasis after medieval Latinists, was a Persian physician, philosopher, alchemist and chemist, and scholar. According to al-Biruni he was born in Ray, present-day Iran the year 865 AD and died there in 925 AD. He was “undoubtedly the greatest physician of the Islamic world and one of the great physicians of all time”. Edward Granville Browne considers him as "probably the greatest and most original of all the physicians, and one of the most prolific as an author" and Chaucer referred to him as one of the fifteen great sources of knowledge. Al-Razi made fundamental and enduring contributions to the fields of Medicine, alchemy, and philosophy, recorded in over 184 books and articles in various fields of science.Numerous“firsts” in medical research, clinical care, and chemistry are attributed to him, including being the first to differentiate smallpox from measles, and the discovery of numerous compounds and chemicals including kerosene, among others. Razi was the first to realize that fever is a natural defense mechanism, the body's way of fighting disease and was the first physician ever to write articles on allergy and immunology. He was the first to produce acids such as sulfuric acid., the first to introduce the use of alcohol (Arabic Al-Kuhl) for medical purposes and the first to use opium for anaesthesia. He was also a pioneer of ophthalmology.
    Razi is considered the "father of pediatrics" for writing "The Diseases of Children", the first book to deal with pediatrics as an independent field of medicine.
    He was well-versed in Greek and BHARTIYA Medical knowledge and added substantially to them from his own observations. He is the author of the monumental encyclopedia "al Hawi" — known in europe also as The Large Comprehensive or Continens Liber-, on which he worked for fifteen years. Because of this book alone, many scholars consider Razi the greatest medical doctor of the Middle Ages. Now, let us read what al-Razi thought about religions in general.
    On the cult of islam -Razi wrote three books dealin: (1) The Prophet's Fraudulent Tricks, (2) The Stratagems of Those Who Claim to Be Prophets (Arabic حيل المتنبيين), and (3) On the Refutation of Revealed Religions (Arabic مخارق الانبياء). He offered harsh criticism concerning religions, in particular those religions that claim to have been revealed by prophetic experiences.
    About those prophets al-Razi wrote:
    The prophets—these billy goats with long beard—cannot claim any intellectual or spiritual superiority. These billy goats pretend to come with a message from God, all the while exhausting themselves in spouting their lies, and imposing on the masses blind obedience to the "words of the master." The miracles of the prophets are impostures, based on trickery, or the stories regarding them are lies.
    The falseness of what all the prophets say is evident in the fact that they contradict one another: one affirms what the other denies, and yet each claims to be the sole depository of the truth; thus the New Testament contradicts the Torah, the Koran the New Testament. As for the Koran, it is but an assorted mixture of ‘absurd and inconsistent fables,’ which has ridiculously been judged inimitable, when, in fact, its language, style, and its much-vaunted ‘eloquence’ are far from being faultless.
    According to Albert Hourani, “he laid emphasis on reason as the sole guide, and dismissed revelation a false and religion a dangerous.”
    About God’s messenger, al-Razi continued:

    On what ground do you deem it necessary that God should single out certain individuals [by giving them prophecy], that he should set them up above other people, that he should appoint them to be the people’s guides, and make people dependent upon them?
    Al-Razi argued that,

    It would be illogical for God to reveal himself only to a selected few. God should not set some individuals over others, and there should be between them neither rivalry nor disagreement which would bring them to perdition.
    Concerning the link between violence and religion, Al-Razi expressed that

    God must have known, considering the many disagreements between different religions, that "there would be a universal disaster and they would perish in the mutual hostilities and fighting. Indeed, many people have perished in this way, as we can see.
    He was also critical of the lack of interest among religious adherents in the rational and analysis of their beliefs, and the violent reaction which takes its place:

    If the people of this religion are asked about the proof for the soundness of their religion, they flare up, get angry and spill the blood of whoever confronts them with this question. They forbid rational speculation, strive to kill their adversaries. This is why truth became thoroughly silenced and concealed. Al-name of so-and-so..
    Razi believed that common people had originally been duped into belief by religious authority figures and by the status quo. He believed that these authority figures were able to continually deceive the common people "as a result of [religious people] being long accustomed to their religious denomination, as days passed and it became a habit. Because they were deluded by the beards of the goats, who sit in ranks in their councils, straining their throats in recounting lies, senseless myths and "so-and-so told us in the name of so-and-so.."
    He believed that the existence of a large variety of religions was, in itself, evidence that they were all man made, saying,

    Jesus claimed that he is the son of God, while Moses claimed that He (God) had no son, and Muhammad claimed that he [Jesus] was created like the rest of humanity." and "Mani and Zoroaster contradicted Moses, Jesus and Muhammad regarding the Eternal One, the coming into being of the world, and the reasons for the [existence] of good and evil.
    In relation to the Hebrew's God asking of sacrifices, he said that "This sounds like the words of the needy rather than of the Laudable Self-sufficient one.”
    Asked if a philosopher can follow a prophetically revealed religion, al-Razi frankly replies:

    How can anyone think philosophically while listening to old wives' tales founded on contradictions, which obdurate ignorance, and dogmatism? Gentility of character, friendliness and purity of mind, are found in those who are capable of thinking profoundly on abstruse matters and scientific minutiae.
    About Quran, al-Razi said:

    You claim that the evidentiary miracle is present and available, namely, the Koran. You say: "Whoever denies it, let him produce a similar one." Indeed, we shall produce a thousand similar, from the works of rhetoricians, eloquent speakers and valiant poets, which are more appropriately phrased and state the issues more succinctly. They convey the meaning better and their rhymed prose is in better meter. ... By God what you say astonishes us! You are talking about a work which recounts ancient myths, and which at the same time is full of contradictions and does not contain any useful information or explanation. Then you say: “Produce something like it?!

    Custom, tradition, and intellectual laziness lead men to follow their religious leaders blindly. Religions have been the sole cause of the bloody wars that have ravaged mankind. Religions have also been resolutely hostile to philosophical speculation and to scientific research. The so-called holy scriptures are worthless and have done more harm than good, whereas the writings of the ancients like Plato, Aristotle, Euclid, and Hippocrates have rendered much greater service to humanity.
    About religious devotees al-Razi wrote:

    The people who gather round the religious leaders are either feeble-minded, or they are women and adolescents (suggestible). Religion stifles truth and fosters enmity. If a book in itself constitutes a demonstration that it is true revelation, the treatises of geometry, astronomy, medicine and logic can justify such a claim much better than the al kitab.
    His views on religion in general and islam in particular earned him public condemnation for blasphemy. Al-Razi’s hostility towards the islamic deen angered some of the prominent thinkers of the islamic world with liberal leaning, including Alberuni. Only bits and pieces of his refutation of revealed religion are left in a refutation of his book by an Ismaili author. From this, it is clear that the greatest mind of the Islamic golden age was not sympathetic towards Islam at all. Almost all of Al-Razi’s philosophical books were destroyed by the revival force of back to islamic darkness.

    Al-Razi directed his most vehement attack against the fan fiction of al kitab because he saw them as illogical and self-contradictory.
 
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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslims-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottomline being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.
  • Ibn Sina or Avicenna (973-1037):
    Avicenna's statue in Dushanbe, Tajikistan

    Ibn Sina was a great philosopher and physician whose philosophical writings greatly influenced scholasticism, and whose medical work "Qanun" was the greatest single influence on medieval medicine.
    The Uzbek born great philosopher, physician and scientist Abu Ali Ibn Sina, known as Avicenna in the West. His major contribution to medical science was his famous book "al-Qanun fi al-Tibb", known as the "Canon of Medicine". The Qanun fi al-Tibb is an immense encyclopedia of medicine extending over a million words. It surveyed the entire medical knowledge available from ancient and muslim sources. Due to its systematic approach, formal perfection as well as its intrinsic value, the Qanun superseded Razi's Hawi, Ali Ibn Abbas's Maliki, and even the works of Galen, and remained "supreme for six centuries". This book was a standard medical text in Europe and the Islamic world until the 18th century. Ibn Sina has often been referred to as the "father of modern medicine".
    His corpus also includes writing on philosophy, astronomy, alchemy, geology, psychology, Islamic theology, logic, mathematics, physics, as well as poetry. He is regarded as the most famous and influential polymath of the Islamic Golden Age.
    Avicenna's philosophy was based on a combination of Aristotelianism and Neoplatonism whic is (platonic influences from BHARAT as well). Contrary to orthodox islamic thought, Avicenna denied personal immortality, God's interest in individuals, and the creation of the world in time. He was holding philosophy superior to theology. In his commentary on theology, he dealt with God, creation, and angels etc. and many of his views on them stood in clear contradiction with their conception in the Islamic theology. He rejected the central Islamic doctrine of resurrection of the dead in flesh and blood. Ibn-Sina had also thoroughly rejected religions, including Islam, as lies. However, as Ibn Sina himself hailed from Khurasan, one cannot dismiss the possible influences of Buddhism, Zoroastrianism and Hinduism on his philosophy. Because of his views, Avicenna became the main target of an attack on such philosophy by the shitlamic al-Ghazali and was called “apostate”.
 
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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslims-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottomline being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.

Al-Ma'arri, (973-1057):


Abul al-Ala al-Ma'arri, from a statue in Aleppo, Syria

Abul ʿAla Al-Maʿarri was a blind Arab philosopher, poet and writer. He was a controversial rationalist of his time, attacking the dogmas of religion and rejecting the claim that islam possessed any monopoly on truth.

The greatest Syrian philosopher poet, skeptic and freethinker known as "Lucretius of the East", Al-Ma’arri was born in Syria and became blind at the age of five. Al-Ma’arri despised religions in general and Islam in particular. In condemnation of religions in general, he wrote his poetic verses:

“Religion are noxious weeds and fable invented by the ancients, worthless except for those who exploit the credulous masses.”


Hanifs (Muslims) are stumbling, Christians all astray
Jews wildered, Magians far on error's way.
We mortals are composed of two great schools
Enlightened knaves or else religious fools.


So, too, the creeds of man: the one prevails
Until the other comes; and this one fails
When that one triumphs; ay, the lonesome world
Will always want the latest fairytales.


Among the crumbling ruins of the creeds
The Scout upon his camel played his reeds
And called out to his people -- "Let us hence!
The pasture here is full of noxious weeds.

Ma’arri’s contempt of all religions and their prophets were expressed as:

“Do not suppose the statements of the prophets to be true. Men lived comfortably till they came and spoiled life. The "sacred books" are only such a set of idle tales as any age could have and indeed did actually produce.”


The Prophets, too, among us come to teach,
Are one with those who from the pulpit preach;
They pray, and slay, and pass away, and yet
Our ills are as the pebbles on the beach.


Mohammed or Messiah! Hear thou me,
The truth entire nor here nor there can be;
How should our God who made the sun and the moon
Give all his light to One, I cannot see.

Al-Ma’arri further states that the so-called sacred rites and creed are deceptive invention of dishonest and greedy men:


Oh fools, awake! The rites a sacred hold
Are but a cheat contrived by men of old
Who lusted after wealth and gained their lust
And died in baseness – and their law is dust.

Al-Ma'arri attacks many of the dogmas of Islam, particularly the Pilgrimage, which he calls "a heathen's journey":


Fortune is (so strangely) allotted, that rocks are visited
(by pilgrims) and touched with hands and lips,
Like the Holy Rock (at Jerusalem) or the two Angles of Quraysh,
howbeit all of them are stones that once were kicked.

Al-Ma’arri calls the sacred books out and out fiction and forgery and regards “reason” as the only means of uncovering the truth:


They recite their sacred books, although the fact informs me
that these are a fiction from first to last.
O reason, Thou (alone) speakest the truth
Then perish the fools who forged the religious traditions or interpreted them!

Here al-Ma'arri, while admiring the Indians BHARTIYAS more than the Muslim, and the BHARTIYA custom of cremation, still insists that death is not such a terrible thing, it is only a falling asleep. In his collection of poems known as the Luzumiyyat, al-Ma'arri clearly prefers this practice of cremation to the Muslim one of burial.


The holy fights by Moslem heroes fought,
The saintly works by Christian hermits wrought
And those of Jewry or of Sabian creed --
Their valour reaches not the Indian's deed
Whom zeal and awe religiously inspire
To cast his body on the flaming pyre.
Yet is man's death a long, long sleep of lead
And all his life a waking. O'er our dead
The prayers are chanted, hopeless farewells taken;
And there we lie, never to stir again.
Shall I so fear in mother earth to rest?
How soft a cradle is thy mother's breast!
When once the viewless spirit from me is gone,
By rains unfreshed let my bones rot on
 
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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslims-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottomline being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.
  • Omar Khayyam (1048-1122):
    Omar Khayyam portrait

    Omar Khayyám was a Persian polymath: philosopher, mathematician, astronomer and poet. He also wrote treatises on mechanics, geography, mineralogy, music, climatology and Islamic theology.
    Omar Khayyám was one of the greatest mathematicians, astronomers, and poets of Iran whose Ruba’iyat (quatrains) are translated into most of the languages of the world and who has earned a universal recognition by everyone. He was an epicurean philosopher, a rationalist skeptic and freethinker and follower of Greek philosophy, and scornful of religion and in particular of islam. His views on islam were in sheer contradiction with its fundamental precepts. He objected to the notion that every particular event and phenomenon was the result of the intervention of allah. He did not believe in resurrection, Judgment Day or rewards and punishments in an alleged afterlife. Instead he was a naturalist and maintained all phenomena of observed on earth were guided by the laws of nature.
    The following poem from his famous Rubayyat, will clearly highlight his mindset about his love of freethinking rational Greek philosophy against blind-faith theological Islamic doctrines:

    If Madrasahs of those drunks
    Became the educational institutes
    Of teaching philosophy of
    Epicures, Plato and Aristotle;
    If Abode and Mazars of Peer and Dervish
    Is turned into research institutes,
    If men instead of following blind faith of religion
    Should have cultivated ethics,
    If the abode of worships were turned into
    Centers of learning of all academic activities,
    If instead of studying religion, men
    Would have devoted to develop mathematics - algebra,
    If logic of science would have occupied the place of
    Sufism, faith and superstition,
    Religion that divides human beings
    Would have replaced by humanism…
    Then world would have turned into haven,
    The world on other side then would have extinguished
    The world would then become full of
    Love-affection-freedom-joy,
    And there is no doubt about it.
    Edward Fitzgerald sums up the delightful nature of Omar Khayyam and his philosophy thus:
    “...Omar’s Epicurean Audacity of thought and Speech caused him to be regarded askance in his own time and country. He is said to have been especially hated and dreaded by the Sufis, whose practice he ridiculed, and whose faith amounts to little more than his own, when strips of the Mysticism and formal recognition of Islamism under which Omar would not hide.”
    Khayyam did not believe in any other world except this one. He was more concerned to enjoy the simple pleasures of life than confused world of the unknown. He was an agnostic par excellence “preferring rather to soothe the soul through the senses into acquiescence with things as he saw them, than to perplex it with vain disquietude after what they might be.”
    Here are some examples Omar’s quatrains translated by Fitzgerald

    Some for the Glories of This World; and some
    Sigh for the Prophet’s Paradise to come;
    Ah, take the Cash, and let the Credit go
    Nor heed the rumble of a distant Drum!

    Why, all the Saints and Sages who discuss’d
    Of the Two Worlds so learnedly, are thrust
    Like foolish Prophets forth; their Words to Scorn
    Are scatter’d, and their Mouths are stopt with Dust.

    Dreaming when Dawn’s Left Hand was in the Sky
    I heard a Voice within the Tavern cry:
    ‘Awake, my Little ones, and fill the Cup
    Before Life’s Liquor in its Cup be dry.
 
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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslims-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottomline being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.
  • Ibn Rushd (1126-1198):
    Ibn Rushd portrait

    Ibn Rushd was an Andalusian polymath; a master of Aristotelian philosophy, islamic philosophy, islamic theology, Maliki law and jurisprudence, logic, psychology, politics, Arabic music theory, and the sciences of medicine, astronomy, geography, mathematics, physics and celestial mechanics. His school of philosophy is known as Averroism. He was condemned for heresy by the Christian, the Jewish and the Islamic orthodoxy.
    This great mind born in Andalusia, present-day Spain was an important philosopher and scientist, known as Averroes. But in the 13th and 14th century Averroism was as influential as was Marxism in the 19th century. Ibn Rushd also interpreted Greek philosophers such as Aristotle and Plato, making them accessible to Arabic culture. He considered Aristotle as ‘the Prefect Man’. He wrote extensive commentaries on Aristotle and earned the epithet of "The Commentator". “He expounded the Quran in Aristotelian terms. In many of his works, he also tried to mediate between philosophy and religion.
    Religious leaders did not always praise his works; he was condemned for heresy by the Christian, the Jewish and the Islamic orthodoxy and his works were frequently banished and burnt. Ibn Rushd fell out of favor with the Caliph due to the opposition that theologians had raised against his writings. He was accused of heresy, interrogated and banned to Lucena, close to Cordova. At the same time, the Caliph ordered the books of the philosopher to be burnt, with the exception of his works on Medicine, Arithmetic and Elementary Astronomy (around 1195). Somewhat later the Caliph revoked the banishment and called Ibn Rushd back to Marrakesh. The works of Ibn Rushd also aroused admirationamong those theologians who saw a danger for religious faith in his writings. In the 13th century, Ibn Rushd was condemned by bishops from Paris, Oxford and Canterbury for reasons similar to those that had caused his condemnation by the orthodox muslim jihadis in spain.
    Abu Yaqub, the Caliph of Morocco, called him to his capital and appointed him as his physician in place of Ibn Tufail. His son Yaqub al-Mansur retained him for some time but soon Ibn Rushd's views on theology and philosophy drew the Caliph's wrath. All his books, barring strictly scientific ones, were burnt and he was banished to Lucena. However, as a result of intervention of several leading scholars he was forgiven after about four years and recalled to Morocco in 1198; but he died towards the end of the same year. Ibn Rushd was a liberal, an exponent of liberation of women and regarded “much of the poverty and distress of the times arises from the fact that women are kept like “domestic animals” or house plants for purposes of gratification”, of a very questionable character besides, instead of being allowed to take part in the production of material and intellectual wealth, and in the preservation of the same.
 
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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslims-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottomline being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.
  • Muhammad ibn Musa al-Khwarizmi (780-850):
    al-Khwarizmi portrait

    Al-Khwarizmi was a Persian mathematician, astronomer and geographer, a scholar in the House of Wisdom in Baghdad. He worked greatly on alebra.
    Al-Khwarizmi was born in Khwarizm (now Khiva) in Uzbekistan. He worked most of his life as a scholar in the house of wisdom (established by Caliph al-Mamun) in Baghdad. He was a Persian mathematician, astronomer, astrologer and geographer. Some of his contributions were based on earlier Persian and Babylonian Astronomy, BHARTIYA numerals, and the Greek sources.
    His "Compendious Book on Calculation by Completion and Balancing" was the first book on the systematic solution of linear and quadratic equations. Consequently he was considered "father of algebra", a title he shares with Diophantus. Latin translations of his Arithmetic, on the Indian numerals, introduced the decimal positional number system to the Western world in the 12th century. He revised and updated Ptolemy’s Geography as well as writing several works on astronomy and astrology. His contributions not only made a great impact on mathematics, but on language as well.
    Most of the positional base 10 numeral systems in the world have originated from BHARAT which first developed the concept of positional numerology. The Indian numeral system is commonly referred to the as Hindu-Arabic numeral system, since it reached europe through the Arabs.
    History of Algebra: The Chinese, the Persians, and the people of BHARATA used algebra thousands of years ago. The Babylonians, Egyptians, and Greeks contributed to the early development of algebra. Al-Khwarizmi a teacher in the mathematical school in Baghdad, collected and improved the advances in algebra of previous HINDU and Arab scholars. His works included the translation of Greek and Sanskrit scientific manuscript. Owing their gratitude to the HINDUS DHARMICS, numerals were always called arqam hindiya in arabic, meaning the Hindu numerals.Interestingly, in conformity with Arabic tradition, these numerals were called HINDU all through the medieval and early renaissance periods in eurofags by their top scholars.Adelard of Bath (1116 – 1142 ad).Roger Bacon (1214 – 1292 ad).Leonardo Fibonacci (1170 – 1250 ad).said al-Andalus (1029 – 1070 ad).Ibn Ezra (11th century ad).Voltaire (1694 – 1778 ad).
    Some words reflect the importance of al-Khwarizmi's contributions to mathematics. "Algebra" is derived from al-jabr, one of the two operations he used to solve quadratic equations. Algorism and algorithm stem from Algoritmi, the Latin form of his name. His name is also the origin of (Spanish) guarismo and of (Portuguese) algarismo, both meaning digit.
    According to the historian al-Tabari, al-khwarizmi was an adherent of the old Zoroastrian religion. Others considered him as orthodox Muslim. Nevertheless, Al-Khwarizmi never indicated that he was influenced by religiosity or he received any scientific theory out of alkitab or hadis and was shunned by jihadis.
 
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asaffronladoftherisingsun

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I did read the thread and my point is the following
You haven't.

hinduism for all its good things like any other religions has had / still has its share of subjugation of free thought. look no further than the avg. dalit needing police protection to visit a particular temple in 2021.
I am afraid you are misinformed about Santana Dharma. All across the Upanishads, this spirit of inquiry, debate and refutation is present in full measure. Didnt expect you had used dalit card this soon lulz.
First learn about Maharshi Veda Vyasa and MahaRishi Valmiki. Who are Sant Thiruvalluvar Saint Ravidas Nam Deva all greatly esteemed saints then Maharaja Bijilipaasi. Dont need to take you much back into Itihas, just uptil 200 years back "dailts" were Yoddhas , Soldiers, Kings and what not. You don't really need to pull out some hippy bs from krantikari outlets buddy. Fyi Man Who Laid the First Stone for Lord RAMA Temple in 1989 was a dalit. ;)

there is no point in trying to patronize a particular religion, knowledge is gained and spread due to sheer human intellect. All religions (actually the so called leadership) will always stifle dissent.
Have you bothered to read what this thread about ? And where have I patronized anything? There are lot more aspects to knowledge. Intellect is just the capacity of humans to generalize experiences. Educational institutions focus on providing sheer knowledge, intelligence with no plan or program to develop the intellect and eventually overall intelligence. Tawhid of islame and christian church also works at the level of senses/intellect and btw cummynism was also invented by intellect of marx which is top lulz.

and there is definitely no point talking about 500-1000 years past, because in the present (and in the foreseeable future), we (with our apparent history and culture of innovation) are soooo far behind in anything. It was the secular nature of developed nations that allowed them to truly flourish and not any religion, not even their abrahamic roots.
If you dont know your history properly you will end up being a useful idiot at the hands of vermins.
Lulz what Secularism itself was essentially borne out of the church-state buttseks. Secularism is a national security threat to Bharat.
And whatever development in those nations you see is direct consequence of genocide of 4 continents "2 amreekas australia and Asia" not because of any superior ideals and ideas.

India is not an industrial powerhouse looking at the resources it commands. it has one fifth of humanity and contributes to c.3% of its manufacturing output. Its major exports are predominantly commodities and not high value finished goods.
I think you are misinformed about Bharat's economy as well. Re read my original argument. That 3% puts Bharat at 5th spot when it comes to global manufacturing. When it comes to most suitable manufacturing locations Bharat gets 3rd spot. I nowhere said that 3% is awesome we need to do more work on it and we are on it.
If you have any suggestions do share at.
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslims-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottomline being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.

  • Al-Biruni (973-1048):
    Al_biruni portrait

    Al-Biruni was a scholar and polymath of the 11th century. He is regarded as one of the greatest scholars of the medieval Islamic era and was well versed in physics, mathematics, astronomy, and natural sciences, and also distinguished himself as a historian, chronologist and linguist.
    Born in Khwarezm, Khorasan (now Uzbekistan) Abū al-Rayḥān al-Bīrūnī, (widely known as Al-Biruni or Alberonius in Latin) was a Persian-born muslim polymaths. He was a scientist and physicist, an anthropologist, an astronomer, an astrologer, an encyclopedist, a historian, a geographer, a geologist, a mathematician, philosopher, teacher, and a traveller. He was conversant in Chorasmian, Persian, Arabic, Sanskrit and Turkic, and also knew Greek, Hebrew and Syriac. In 1017 he traveled to the BHARATIYA subcontinent and became the most important interpreter of BHARTIYA science to the islamic world. He is given the titles the "founder of Indology" and the "first anthropologist". He was an impartial writer on custom and creeds of various nations, and was given the title al-Ustdadh ("The Master") for his remarkable description of early 11th-century Bharat. He also made contributions to Earth sciences, and is regarded as the "father of geodesy" for his important contributions to that field, along with his significant contributions to geography.
    Btw in islamic theology, al-Beruni assigned to the quran a separate and autonomous realm of its own and held that the quran does not interferes in the business of science nor does it infringe on the realm of science which is in direct contradiction to quran itself and rejected by muslim clerics.
 
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asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslim-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottom line being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.
  • Yaqub ibn Ishaq al-Kindi (c. 801–873):
    Al-kindi portrait

    Al-Kindi was an Arab philosopher, mathematician, physician, and musician. He was the first of the muslim peripatetic philosophers, and is unanimously hailed as the "father of Arabic philosophy" for his synthesis, adaptation and promotion of Greek and Hellenistic philosophy in the Muslim world.
    Al-Kindi was born in Kufa (modern Iraq) a muslim Arab polymath. He was a philosopher, scientist, astrologer, astronomer, chemist, mathematician, musician, physician and physicist who was well known for his utmost interest in Greek philosophy. He was the first prominent philosopher of the Islamic world and was a member of the former Christian Arab tribe of Al-Kinda and was the only pure blooded Arab philosopher. The Italian Renaissance scholar Geralomo Cardano (1501–1575) considered him one of the twelve greatest minds of the Middle Ages.
    Al-Kindi became a prominent figure in the House of Wisdom, and a number of Abbasid Caliphs appointed him to oversee the translation of Greek scientific and philosophical texts into the Arabic language. This contact with "the philosophy of the ancients" (as Greek philosophy was often referred to by Muslim scholars) had a profound effect on his intellectual development, and lead him to write a number of original treatises of his own on a range of subjects ranging from metaphysics and ethics to mathematics and philosophy and pharmacology. In the field of mathematics, al-Kindi played an important role in introducing Indian numerals to the Islamic and Christian world.
    His own thought was largely influenced by the Neo-Platonic philosophy of Proclus, Plotinus and John Philoponus, amongst others, although he does appear to have borrowed ideas from other Hellenistic schools as well. Earlier experts had suggested that he was influenced by the Mutazilite school of theology, because of the mutual concern both he and they demonstrated for maintaining the pure unity (tawhid) of God. However, such agreements are now considered incidental, as further study has shown that they disagreed on a number of equally important topics. Al-Kindi is regarded as the "father of Arabic philosophy" for his synthesis, adaptation and promotion of Greek and Hellenistic philosophy in the Muslim world.
    During his life, al-Kindi was fortunate enough to enjoy the patronage of the pro-Mutazilite Caliphs al-Ma'mun and al-Mu'tasim, which meant he could carry out his philosophical speculations with relative ease. This would change significantly towards the end of his life when al-Mutawakkil supported the more orthodox Asharite school, and initiated persecution of various unorthodox schools of thought, including the philosophers. He also engaged in disputations with the Mutazilites, whom he attacked for their belief in atoms. But the real role of al-Kindi in the conflict between philosophers and theologians would be to prepare the ground for debate. His works, says Deborah Black, contained all the seeds of future controversy that would be fully realized in al-Ghazali's "Incoherence of the Philosophers".
 
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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslim-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottomline being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.
  • Al-Farabi (870-950):
    Al-farabi portrait

    Al-Farabi was a renowned scientist. He was also a cosmologist, logician, and musician. He was known among medieval muslim intellectuals as "The Second Teacher", that is, the successor to Aristotle, "The First Teacher".
    Al-Farabi (known in the west as Alpharabius), the Kazakh thinker, was the greatest scientists and philosophers of the Islamic world. Among the scholars of the Middle Period - (tenth and eleventh centuries ad) al-Farabi was considered the foremost Aristotelian, and was indeed known as the "Second Teacher" (Aristotle himself being the First Teacher). He made notable contributions to the fields of mathematics, philosophy, medicine, sociology and music. He was inspired by the Platonism and Neo-Platonism and was a great exponent of the Aristotelian school of philosophy. He wrote rich commentaries on Aristotle and like al-Razi, he considered reason superior to alkitab and advocated for the relegation of nabuwat to philosophy. According to him as quoted by Nicholson, “…reason should govern and control the life of man. He definitely did not believe in the inherent doctrines of the islamic creed and wished it could be reformed guided by philosophy. He was also a major political scientist and may rightly be acclaimed as one of the greatest ofislamic philosophers of all time. While his name tends to be overshadowed by that of Ibn Sina, it is worth bearing in mind that the latter was less original than the former.
 
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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslim-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottom line being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.
  • Jabir or Geber (721-815):
    Geber portrait

    Geber was a prominent polymath: a chemist and alchemist, astronomer and astrologer, engineer, geographer, philosopher, physicist, and pharmacist and physician. He has been referred to as the "father of Arab chemistry".
    Geber, aka Abu Mūsā Jābir ibn Hayyān, was a prominent islamic alchemist, pharmacist, philosopher, astronomer, and physicist.The historian of chemistry Erick John Holmyard gives credit to Jābir for developing alchemy into an experimental science and he writes that Jābir's importance to the history of chemistry is equal to that of Robert Boyle and Antoine Lavoisier. His ethnic background is not clear; although most sources state he was an Arab, some describe him as Persian. Jabir was born in Tus, Khorasan, in Iran, which was at the time ruled by the Umayyad Caliphate. He was the son of Hayyan al-Azdi, a pharmacist of the Arabian Azd tribe who emigrated from Yemen to Kufa (in present-day Iraq) during the Umayyad Caliphate.
    Jabir is mostly known for his contributions to chemistry. He emphasised systematic experimentation, and did much to free alchemy from superstition and turn it into a science. He is credited with the invention of many types of now-basic chemical laboratory equipment, and with the discovery and description of many now-commonplace chemical substances and processes - such as the hydrochloric and nitric acids, distillation, and crystallization that have become the foundation of today's chemistry and chemical engineering. Jabir's alchemical investigations were theoretically grounded in an elaborate numerology related to Pythagorean and Neoplatonic systems. In his writings, Jabir pays tribute to Egyptian and Greek alchemists Hermes Trismegistus, Agathodaimon, Pythagoras, and Socrates.
    His books strongly influenced the medieval European alchemists and justified their search for the philosopher's stone. In spite of his leanings toward mysticism (he was considered a Sufi) and superstition, he more clearly recognised and proclaimed the importance of experimentation. Jabir became an alchemist at the court of Caliph Harun al-Rashid, for whom he wrote the Kitab al-Zuhra "The Book of Venus", on "the noble art of alchemy".
 
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airstrike99

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the original video was made by "sye ten". became so famous and the video was taken down by some pissful pisslims by appealing to youtube. some other channel reuploaded it.

i remembered it and found it after 5 years. thanks to the thread of debunking islam by @asaffronladoftherisingsun

 

cannonfodder

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@asaffronladoftherisingsun

Pardon that I only glanced over the entire thread. however, let me put my question: Abbasids encouraged rational thinkers outside their religious influence & hence were able to collate knowledge from different parts that led to period of betterment/wealth.

Some Indians( influnced with western thinking) may argue same is also true for Hindus. Sages like aryabhatta + many more actually whos ideas & mathematical knowledge was sold as inventions in Europe can be called as aberrations rather than mainline thinking/practice. My question is in brief how to counter this argument?? Hope you see where I am coming from.. . The only thing that has come close to countering this argument is Nilesh oaks usage of anumana, pramana and pratyaksha in establishing hypothesis to actual scientific discovery. Is this way of scientific inquiry or any other way passed on in as scriptures?
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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@asaffronladoftherisingsun

Pardon that I only glanced over the entire thread. however, let me put my question: Abbasids encouraged rational thinkers outside their religious influence & hence were able to collate knowledge from different parts that led to period of betterment/wealth.

Some Indians( influnced with western thinking) may argue same is also true for Hindus. Sages like aryabhatta + many more actually whos ideas & mathematical knowledge was sold as inventions in Europe can be called as aberrations rather than mainline thinking/practice. My question is in brief how to counter this argument?? Hope you see where I am coming from.. . The only thing that has come close to countering this argument is Nilesh oaks usage of anumana, pramana and pratyaksha in establishing hypothesis to actual scientific discovery. Is this way of scientific inquiry or any other way passed on in as scriptures?
Yes that is true abbasids encourage rational thinkers basically that 7th caliph al mamun for example took huge pains to obtain those manuscripts and the knowledge that was already present. He goes on to establish a darul hikmah which included folks scientists thinkers philosophers from all religions. However it was after the rise of coomers like Al-Ghazali that all scientific reasoning came to an end in the 13th century.
Indeed fictional jibraeel was not allowed to enter darul hikmah.

I believe the problem and ignorance on part of certain modern day idiots marxshits and jihadi apologetics is the retarded conclusions drawn out of all this. Coomers tend to attach anything slightly arabic to islam failing to realize that Kuffars polythiests language was also arabic. Arabic predated cult of islam. For example in this case look at this darul hikmah a library. They keep whoring that how mooslams started all this knowledge systems and attempt to take full credit of it despite having no contributions to it. Morons dont know that The Arab culture and language predated the cult of islam. More than ninety nine percent Arabic translations of works of Greek philosophers were done by either christian or Jewish scholars. It is interesting to note that islamic astronomy, based on Ptolemy’s system was geocentric. Algebra was originally a Greek discipline (knowledge was also available to Bhartiyas) there and ‘Arabic’ numbers were actually BHARTIYA.

The Arabs themselves never denied their indebtedness to the Hindus in astronomy, medicine and mathematics. They called their numbers ‘Hindu numerals’.

We acknowledge many arabs and persians before the cult of islam and to some extent during the cult of islam tried hard to push scientific knowledge free thinking rational thought which fuelled such golden age which was so short lived.The irony is that so called golden age of islamic cult has little or nothing to do with islam top lulz.

On your second question well it was mainline practices and that is the only reason why Bharat was largest industrial economical cultural center for well documented 2000 years. The Bhartiya Systems have always followed a multi-valued logic, beginning with the Vedas, which prescribed Chatushkoṭi, or the ‘four-valued logic’. The Nāsadiya Sūkta of RigVeda is a good example of such.

And meet Thomas Munro. He was true fren of Bharat.In 1820s did an extensive All India survey of the education system of the land and he confirmed the vibrant education system that prevailed in BHARAT.

Meet the rare friend of Bharat..jpg


 
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asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslims-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottomline being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.

Abu Al-Qasim or Abulcasis (936-1013):


Albucasis portrait

Abulcasis, was an Arab physician who lived in Al-Andalus. He is considered the greatest medieval surgeon to have appeared from the islamic World, and has been described by many as the father of modern surgery.

Abu al-Qasim Khalaf ibn al-Abbas Al-Zahrawi (known in the west as Abulcasis) was an Andalusian muslim Physician born in 936 A.D. in Zahra in the neighborhood of Cordova, Al-Andalus, present-day Spain. He became one of the most renowned surgeons of the Muslim era and was a court physician to the Andalusian caliph Al-Hakam II. After a long medical career, rich with significant original contribution, he died in 1013 A.D. He is best known for his early and original breakthroughs in surgery as well as for his famous Medical Encyclopedia called Al-Tasrif, which is composed of thirty volumes covering different aspects of medical science. He is considered the "father of modern surgery" and as the greatest medieval surgeon to have appeared from the Islamic World whose comprehensive medical texts, combining Arab medicine and Greco-Roman teachings. His greatest contribution to history is the Kitab al-Tasrif, a thirty-volume encyclopedia of medical practices he did not buy retardation full of ridiculous hadis.
 
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asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Now, we examine the life history of some very famous "scientists" of the so called islamic “Golden Age” to evaluate historical truth whether these muslim-born freethinkers were true believers of islam? No they were not.We will also examine whether the core teachings of islam had anyway influenced or contributed (as erroneously believed by most muslims) to the success of medieval muslim scientists. The bottomline being all of these famous scientists hated cult of islam were persecuted because of free thought and rational thinking.

This coomer is the immediate cause of downfall of 'golden age' attached to cult of islam.

1626756259346.png

Abu Hamid Al-Ghazali (1058-1111):

Al-Ghazali was a Persian momin theologian, jurist, philosopher, and mystic. He has sometimes been referred to by historians as the single most influential muslim after the Muhammad . Others have cited his movement from science to faith as a detriment to Islamic scientific progress.
Abu Hāmed Mohammad ibn Mohammad al-Ghazzālī aka Al-Ghazali or Algazel, Was born and died in Tus, in the Khorasan province of Persia (Modern day Iran). He was one of the greatest muslim theologians, jurist, philosopher and mystics of the 12th Century. He wrote on a wide range of topics including jurisprudence, theology, mysticism and philosophy.
Imam Al-Ghazali is widely known for his heroic role to defeat Mu‘tazilites (rationalized movement) and revived original cult of islam. While it is well known that Al-Ghazali himself intended to "shut the door of ijtihad" (the process through which Islamic scholars can generate new rules for Muslims) completely and permanently, which led the islamic societies to be "frozen in shiet". Works of critics of Al-Ghazali (such as Ibn-Rushd, a rationalist), as well as the works of any ancient philosopher, were practically forbidden in these "frozen societies" through the centuries. As a result, all chances were lost to gradually revitalize religion of Islam. His 11th century book titled “The Incoherence of the Philosophers” marks a major turn in islamic epistemology (study of the nature, methods, limitations, and validity of knowledge and belief) and marked a turning point in Islamic philosophy in its vehement rejections of Aristotle and Plato. The book took aimed bitter attack to the group of Islamic philosophers (from the 8-11 centuries) most notable Avicenna and Al-Frabi etc. who drew intellectually upon the Ancient Greeks. Ghazali bitterly denounced Aristotle, Socrates and other Greek philosophers and writers. And labeled those who adopted their methods and ideas as corrupters of the troo islamic faith. Coomer was working with hidayat of allah.
Another of Ghazali’s major work was: “Ihya ʿulūm al-din” (“The revival of religious sciences”) was widely regarded as the greatest work of muslims spirituality, and has, for centuries, been the most read work after the alkitab in the muslim world. In this book Imam Ghazali rejuvenated islamic dogmas (full of stupid hadiz and absurdities) only to push back muslim societies deep into the sewer of islamic radicalism. He mastered philosophy and then criticized it in order to Islamicize it. Philosophy declined in the Sunni world after al-Ghazali, and his criticism of philosophers who followed Aristotle, Pluto, Socrates etc certainly accelerated this decline. Nearly a century later, Ibn rushd made desperate efforts to resist the trend by refuting al-Ghazali’s Tahafut in his “Tahafut al-tahafut” (“The Incoherence of the Incoherence”) and “Fasl al-maqal” (“The Decisive Treatise”), but he could not stop it and the seeds of retardation were sown in the muslim world which continue till today in the cult of islam and its retarded followers.
 
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