Dassault named leader of future European Fighter

Armand2REP

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France takes the reigns of the future European fighter
By Michel Cabirol | 26/04/2018


"When there is (industrial) cooperation, the nations must decide, there is always a nation leading (...) for SCAF it will be France", announced the German Defense Minister, Ursula Von der Leyen ( Credits: Air Force)


Dassault Aviation has been named the leader of the European Future Air Combat System (SCAF) program.

Minister of the Armed Forces Florence Parly and her German counterpart Ursula von der Leyen signed Thursday in Berlin an agreement to launch the project of future Franco-German combat aircraft. France will play the role of "leader". The European Future Air Combat System (SCAF) is the centerpiece of the Paris and Berlin strategy to ensure European sovereignty in defense. "This agreement on the air combat system of the future is a new step, a new acceleration for Europe of defense,"said Florence Parly.

"SCAF will revolutionize the combat mode and our equipment and allow more ambitious investments and innovations, the SCAF, they are more powerful and more operational armies", summarized Florence Parly at a joint press conference in Paris. ILA, the international aerospace fair in Berlin.

The are two countries can offer a credible European alternative to the American F-35. This combat aircraft will replace by 2040 their current fleets of respective fighter jets, the Eurofighter and the Rafale, indicates the "Requirements Expression Sheet" (FEB), the document signed by ministers, nine months after the first mention of this project by the two capitals.

Dassault Aviation, leader of the program
The future combat aircraft will be developed by Dassault Aviation, which will take the control of the program, said the German minister. Which was legitimate in view of the past of the two groups in the field of combat aviation. "When there is (industrial) cooperation, the nations must decide, there is always a leading nation (...) for the SCAF it will be France" , besides recognized Ursula Von der Leyen. In its presentation, the Ministry of the Armies confirmed, as Florence Parly had explained to La Tribune , that "the idea is to build a program by capitalizing on existing skills" .

The SCAF is designed as a complete system combining a new generation fighter, drones, existing aircraft still in service after 2040, future cruise missiles and swarming drones. It will be connected to aircraft, satellites, NATO, European Union and land and naval combat systems in offensive and defensive operations. The future air combat system will be able to act autonomously or within a system of systems, in order to face the challenges of future operational environments.

What operational needs?
SCAF will have to meet the requirements of all air-to-air missions. The survivability of SCAF will enable it to cope with all future threats. Thus, it must have air superiority capabilities against future air threats and must be able to engage all targets of interest for air surface operations. In addition, it must be able to operate in a disputed air environment and engage all types of air defense systems. In this context, it will have an increased need for connectivity and real-time data fusion capability. Finally, the SCAF must be navalisable for the French needs.

https://www.latribune.fr/entreprise...du-futur-avion-de-combat-europeen-776864.html
 

Armand2REP

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The Airbus-Dassault alliance confirms that BAE is out of FCAS
April 27, 2018 Madrid


If nothing changes the future European fighter plane will have as central pillars Germany and France and will leave out the United Kingdom. The British company BAE Systems does not participate in the alliance signed on Wednesday between the French company Dassault Aviation and the French-German, and to a lesser extent, Spanish Airbus, to undertake the production of the European fighter FCAS (abbreviations in English of Air Combat System from the future). This industrial movement confirms a disagreement that does not seem to worry BAE Systems, based on what its military aviation chief, Chris Boardman, already pointed out last summer.

Before the announcement in July that France and Germany had chosen to develop a combat aircraft jointly, the British company recalled that it already has its own plan to develop a fifth generation fighter in relation to Turkey. Boardman assured that it is a "more advanced" project than the Franco-German one.

However, Boardman has also shown his "absolute conviction that we, the United Kingdom and BAE Systems, will participate in one way or another" in the new European hunting project. The CEO of Airbus Defense and Space, Dirk Hoke, in charge of sealing the agreement on Wednesday with the CEO of Dassault, Eric Trappier, has pointed out that the inclusion or exclusion of "United Kingdom in certain projects depends on how Brexit progresses" .


Replacement of the Eurofighter and the Rafale

The commitment of development and production of the FCAS subscribed by Airbus and Dassault supposes complementing and later replacing the current generation of combat aircraft Eurofighter and Rafale between the years 2035 and 2040. The Eurofighter is a European program in which , along with Germany, Italy and Spain, the United Kingdom participates through BAE Systems, and Dassault left at the time to develop its own fighter aircraft, precisely the Rafale, which is the largest competitor of the Eurofighter.

Airbus participates in a 46 percent ownership of Eurofighter, BAE Systems has 33 percent and the Italian Leonardo (formerly known as Finmeccanica) has the remaining 21 percent.

The FCAS, now called to be the heir of both the Eurofighter and the Rafale, will be a system of systems that will include unmanned aerial vehicles connected to the main fighters. The planned schedule includes proposals for the development of prototypes for this program "from 2025".

In the words of Eric Trappier, the FCAS program "will strengthen the political and military ties between the key nations of Europe and that will revitalize its aerospace industry."


http://www.infodefensa.com/mundo/20...ss&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=rss-mundo
@Sancho
 
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sthf

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I don't have much faith in this project. Germans are deliberately killing their armed forces and I don't see that changing any time soon. Also Muricans will offer F-35 at far lower prices than anything Dassault-Airbus can produce.

In an ideal world, I would have loved to see AMCA as a collaborative project between India and France but I don't see that happening.
 

Armand2REP

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I don't have much faith in this project. Germans are deliberately killing their armed forces and I don't see that changing any time soon. Also Muricans will offer F-35 at far lower prices than anything Dassault-Airbus can produce.
Buying the F-35 is giving up on European defence and in principle, the EU itself. It would take a radical change in government for Germany to turn away from that. Not to mention the industrial importance of it. With France running the project we don't have to worry about German inadequacies in any particular area, we have the competency in all areas. The only thing we need is a bankroll and it looks like they are willing to put their money where their mouth is for the good of Europe.

In an ideal world, I would have loved to see AMCA as a collaborative project between India and France but I don't see that happening.
Look at it this way, if India joins the SCAF project like it was going to do FGFA, it could use the components of SCAF as the basis of an AMCA offshoot. You get France and Germany funding the fundamentals, all India has to do is integrate into their own fighter and they get the SCAF as the stopgap as FGFA would have been.
 

Haldiram

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India shoudnt get into any defence contract that has Germany in it.

German arms company Heckler & Koch to ‘no longer supply undemocratic, corrupt countries

https://www.google.co.in/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/heckler-koch-saudi-arabia-german-arms-trade-undemocratic-corrupt-nato-a7444981.html?amp
The so called undeveloped, corrupt third-world countries is where all the wars are being fought. If not for these wars, the Western defense establishment wouldn't even exist. All of their wealth is from genocide and war profiteering. It's quite rich that they want to sermonize their old clientele.

Germany has previously blacklisted India from acquiring the MP5 in 2010 when the military went all out against Naxals. Interestingly, the Naxals are backed by the Lutheran church which has its origins in Germany. Its followers are known as Protestants (who also happen to be in a dominating position in the US). All the Hindu-hating ideology coming out of the Christian world has its origins in the Lutheran church. Protestant-ism is akin to Political Islam.

 

Tactical Frog

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Tactical Frog

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The so called undeveloped, corrupt third-world countries is where all the wars are being fought. If not for these wars, the Western defense establishment wouldn't even exist. All of their wealth is from genocide and war profiteering. It's quite rich that they want to sermonize their old clientele.

Germany has previously blacklisted India from acquiring the MP5 in 2010 when the military went all out against Naxals. Interestingly, the Naxals are backed by the Lutheran church which has its origins in Germany. Its followers are known as Protestants (who also happen to be in a dominating position in the US). All the Hindu-hating ideology coming out of the Christian world has its origins in the Lutheran church. Protestant-ism is akin to Political Islam.

Oh ... Did not know about this MP5 story
The so called undeveloped, corrupt third-world countries is where all the wars are being fought. If not for these wars, the Western defense establishment wouldn't even exist. All of their wealth is from genocide and war profiteering. It's quite rich that they want to sermonize their old clientele.

Germany has previously blacklisted India from acquiring the MP5 in 2010 when the military went all out against Naxals. Interestingly, the Naxals are backed by the Lutheran church which has its origins in Germany. Its followers are known as Protestants (who also happen to be in a dominating position in the US). All the Hindu-hating ideology coming out of the Christian world has its origins in the Lutheran church. Protestant-ism is akin to Political Islam.

Man, sorry but this is just crazy conspirationism at work there . I have no idea why a lutheran church would support maoists.
On second thought ...the Swedes too are Lutherans ... please blacklist Saab fast :tongue2:
 

Armand2REP

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India shoudnt get into any defence contract that has Germany in it.

German arms company Heckler & Koch to ‘no longer supply undemocratic, corrupt countries

https://www.google.co.in/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/heckler-koch-saudi-arabia-german-arms-trade-undemocratic-corrupt-nato-a7444981.html?amp
H&K is a private company, if it wants to set its image as a NATO only country that is its marketing preference. The decision had nothing to do with the German government or any state decision for an export control ban on India. As far as the German government is concerned, India is good. Any project France and Germany are developing is a state project not subject to a boards marketing whims.
 

Haldiram

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I have no idea why a lutheran church would support maoists.
On second thought ...the Swedes too are Lutherans ... please blacklist Saab fast :tongue2:
Because they don't have to believe in Mao to use Maoism as a camouflage. It serves as a very convenient cover.

Overseas support to Naxals alarms govt

The last year's convention of ICSPWI at Hamburg in Germany is learnt to have generated much support for the Indian guerrillas in the international arena as the participants called India as a 'prison house of people's movement'. The convention, allegedly attended by Delhi professor GN Saibaba- now under police scanner-also decided to observe January 25 this year as the International day of solidarity and struggle.

In Sweden, the movement to support the rebels is being spearheaded by leftist thinker Jan Mydal's daughter Eva, who is at the helm of 'Campaign against war on people in India'. The movement is now learnt to have spread to Sweden's neighbour Norway. Indian intelligence agencies have several evidence of Jan visiting Naxal bastion 'Abhujmadh' in Chhattisgarh.

 

Bhumihar

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Man I say fuck Germnay let's make their refugee crisis even worse by sending some of our own mullahs there.
That countries people are guilt trapped and brainwashed military grade cucks they can't think for themselves. When the people become useless that country becomes a weapon in hands of globalist leaders.
Where do u think that nigga Dhurv Rathee on YouTube stays, yeah that's right he lives in Frankfurt.
 

bose

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But Bhumihar, India isn’t undemocratic and isn’t classified as corrupt either :confused1:

Germans would love selling their submarines to India. Really.
The logic is simple here ... just like Germans or French or British or whatever have their so called tags for undemocratic bla bla for doing business ... India do have some of its own, not to get into into dealing with those that put unfair conditions...

It is not the case for Indian being undemocratic or democratic ... a matter pf principle ...

there will always be other guy to sell the same stuff ... it is a buyer's world ...
 
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jadoogar

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Oh ... Did not know about this MP5 story


Man, sorry but this is just crazy conspirationism at work there . I have no idea why a lutheran church would support maoists.
On second thought ...the Swedes too are Lutherans ... please blacklist Saab fast :tongue2:
This is Kalyug and nothing is what is seems :smile:. Seems like this chap Haldi is from the PRC as are kshitji, Yggdrasil and I am sure other screen names. You will have to think about the logic for a bit and put 2 and 2 together to reach this conclusion.

Of course Haldi may be right that some Church groups in Germany or Scandinavia are funding the Maoists - and may even be right on the forces backing those Church groups. Or maybe Haldi's bosses are funding the church groups!! It is a complex world.
 
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sthf

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Buying the F-35 is giving up on European defence and in principle, the EU itself. It would take a radical change in government for Germany to turn away from that. Not to mention the industrial importance of it. With France running the project we don't have to worry about German inadequacies in any particular area, we have the competency in all areas. The only thing we need is a bankroll and it looks like they are willing to put their money where their mouth is for the good of Europe.



Look at it this way, if India joins the SCAF project like it was going to do FGFA, it could use the components of SCAF as the basis of an AMCA offshoot. You get France and Germany funding the fundamentals, all India has to do is integrate into their own fighter and they get the SCAF as the stopgap as FGFA would have been.
The once feared German Army is running around with black painted sticks instead of machine guns not because the people who created arguably the finest machine gun ever suddenly forgot how to make a new MG but because they don't give a rat's ass about their military's funding.

Germans are finding it difficult to fund their present requirments, expecting them to give money to France is a distant dream.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...-eurofighters-are-combat_ready-–-spiegel.html

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...icopter-licenses-for-lack-of-flight-time.html


SCAF which will enter service two decades from now is nobody's stop gap.
 

Armand2REP

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The once feared German Army is running around with black painted sticks instead of machine guns not because the people who created arguably the finest machine gun ever suddenly forgot how to make a new MG but because they don't give a rat's ass about their military's funding.

Germans are finding it difficult to fund their present requirments, expecting them to give money to France is a distant dream.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...-eurofighters-are-combat_ready-–-spiegel.html

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...icopter-licenses-for-lack-of-flight-time.html
The Germans aren't interested in their defence so they pay us to do it and develop it for them... works for me.
 

sthf

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The Germans aren't interested in their defence so they pay us to do it and develop it for them... works for me.
Germans don't like to spend money for defence. At ~1% of GDP, it is not working for Germany and sure as hell not going to work for France.
 

Armand2REP

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Germans don't like to spend money for defence. At ~1% of GDP, it is not working for Germany and sure as hell not going to work for France.
1.2% of German GDP is a fair amount of money. They are hiking it to 2% and France will get a piece of it as we develop their weapons and command their troops.
 

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