Civil war in Ukraine

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jouni

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Putin gave a very moderate speech. New tactics or is he willing to drop support of separatists and make peace possible
 

parijataka

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Russia's food embargo making EU squeal even louder

Russia gets back at US sanctions !

Russia's food embargo making EU squeal even louder

Austria is warning of catastrophic falling prices, and the Netherlands is saying losses could be triple initial estimates. A third of Lithuanian milk producers say they are facing problems.

The wholesale price of a kilogram of fruit or vegetables could halve due to excess supply, the Austrian newspaper Salzburger Nachrichten cites Rupert Gsols, a federal coordinator of the Austrian Union of Market Gardeners.

There is a bumper crop of European apples in 2014; around 12 million tons against the normal 10-11 million tons. About 370,000 tons are harvested in Poland.

The economic damage to the Netherlands from the Russian boycott could be triple the original estimate and reach €1.5 billion, Dutch News cites Hans de Boer, the chief of VNO-NCW Dutch employers' organization.

"That calculation did not take into account the Dutch dealers who operate from Eastern Europe," de Boer said.

In Lithuania, Russian countermeasures to Western sanctions are hitting milk producers the hardest, as about a third of firms face problems in finding alternative markets, RIA cites Jurate Dovydeniene, the head of the Lithuanian Association of Agricultural Cooperatives.

Pieno Zvaigzdes, one of Lithuania's five largest milk processing plants, suspended buying milk from farmers in the middle of month.

Even those who didn't supply the products to Russia will suffer, Andriejus Stancikas the head of the Agricultural Chamber of Lithuania said.

"The situation became too dangerous especially for the agricultural sector, as the blockade is imposed not only on Lithuania, but to all the European Union. It would be difficult to reorient the deliveries to the West, these markets will be filled with their own production," Stanchikas explained

Even though Russia was a risky market, it was one of the most lucrative and consumers highly appreciated Lithuanian products, he added.
 

pmaitra

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Re: Russia's food embargo making EU squeal even louder

Didn't the EU ban fruit imports from India because of fruit-flies? Now, they can fill their shortages with the fruits they will not be exporting to Russia.

Moreover, why are they cribbing? Can't they just sit on their hunches and chomp onto their apples, and cabbages? After all, many of them are "wealthy" G7 countries.
 

asianobserve

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So it seemed the much touted humanitarian convoy is a smoke screen for an invasion... (a creeping one)?

Russian Military Vehicles Enter Ukraine as Aid Convoy Stops Short of Border

The white trucks of humanitarian aid rumbled through Russia in a convoy stretching for miles, moving slowly southwards on the M4 highway, amid a landscape of fertile fields and Ladas stopped at the roadside – their boots overflowing with watermelons for sale.

But, while the trucks came to a halt well short of Ukraine's border, a different Russian convoy did make the crossing into Ukrainian territory late on Thursday evening.

The Guardian saw a column of 23 armoured personnel carriers, supported by fuel trucks and other logistics vehicles with official Russian military plates, travelling towards the border near the Russian town of Donetsk – about 200km away from Donetsk, Ukraine.

After pausing by the side of the road until nightfall, the convoy crossed into Ukrainian territory, using a rough dirt track and clearly crossing through a gap in a barbed wire fence that demarcates the border. Armed men were visible in the gloom by the border fence as the column moved into Ukraine. Kiev has lost control of its side of the border in this area.

The trucks are unlikely to represent a full-scale official Russian invasion, and it was unclear how far they planned to travel inside Ukrainian territory and how long they would stay. But it was incontrovertible evidence of what Ukraine has long claimed – that Russian troops are active inside its borders.

It was also ironic given the attention to the huge convoy of humanitarian aid that moved slowly southwards on the M4 highway on Thursday. As the convoy moved closer to the stretch of border controlled by pro-Russian rebels it was hard to escape the feeling that Moscow's aid convoy had the potential to turn into a slow-motion disaster, perhaps even prompting a moment that could push Ukraine and Russia out of the messy conflict fought by proxies into full-blown, open engagement.

According to Moscow, the convoy is a goodwill gesture, packed with much-needed aid for the residents of eastern Ukraine. In Kiev's view, the convoy is at best a cynical ploy; at worst, a kind of Trojan centipede, winding its way into the country at a border point no longer controlled by Ukrainian forces, the nature of its cargo taken only on trust.

The humanitarian convoy stalled for 24 hours in the city of Voronezh during Wednesday, but set out at dawn on Thursday.

At one point, with President Vladimir Putin more than two hours late to address a gathering of top Russian officials in newly annexed Crimea, and the first lorries in the convoy taking the turnoff from the main M4 highway towards rebel-controlled Luhansk in Ukraine, there were whispers that perhaps Putin's announcement was being delayed to announce that the trucks would enter Ukraine whether or not the country's authorities gave the green light, a move Kiev has said would be seen as an invasion.

In the end, the convoy ground to a halt shortly after the turnoff, still about 20 miles from the border and, over a period of two hours, the vehicles parked in neat lines, throwing up clouds of dust.

Russia's foreign ministry has said there are 262 vehicles in the convoy, including 200 carrying aid. Some of the drivers put the number at 270. Already, the start of a field camp had been erected on the site, with a dozen large tents and a shower area where the men could wash off the grime and sweat of the long journey.

The trucks could be stacked with weapons, some said. Others claimed they could be carrying advance supplies for a later Russian invasion using the ground troops that have hovered in border areas. There was also a suggestion that the circus around the mysterious convoy could distract attention from other Russian moves, a fear apparently justified given the military column that crossed the borderon Thursday night.

The hundreds of men driving the trucks in the convoy were all dressed in identical khaki T-shirts, shorts and caps, and there was certainly something military about their bearing.

For some observers, the large convoy moving with obvious top-level coordination and accompanied by numerous vehicles with official Russian military plates brought back memories of the "little green men" involved in the annexation of Crimea back in March. Wearing green uniforms without insignia, those men claimed to be local volunteers, although they were clearly highly trained Russian special operatives. Despite denying their presence all through the annexation, Putin later admitted that Russian military units had been involved.

But, with their easy manner, lack of discipline and in some cases physiques that hinted more at beer halls than special forces training grounds, the "little brown men" of the aid convoy are clearly not the highly trained elite troops used in the annexation of Crimea.

In general, the men did not want to speak about who they were or how they had come to be involved in the convoy. One said he was a volunteer from a non-governmental organisation, but clammed up when asked for the name of the organisation.

"I'm being paid to do a job here, not to stand around talking to journalists," he said when pressed, and then looked sheepish when reminded he had just claimed to be an unpaid volunteer.

Others said they were military veterans but claimed not to be serving currently. It is possible the convoy was assembled using the semi-official method Russia has used to find volunteers to fight for rebel separatists in eastern Ukraine – phone calls from military veterans' organisations offering work.

Those at the site were dismissive of fears in Ukraine that the convoy may be carrying secret military cargo. Two of the men in brown, who would not give their names but said they were "in charge of the cargo", offered to open any of the trucks picked at random and show what was inside. Men scrambled to untie the cords securing the tarpaulin on two of the trucks chosen by the Guardian and other journalists at the site.

Inside one were white sacks filled with buckwheat, while the other contained stacked cardboard boxes. Three men pulled the tape from one of the boxes to reveal newly packed sleeping bags. As the tarpaulin was pulled away, the original military green of the trucks was revealed; their exteriors apparently only recently painted white.

Nobody would say how long they planned to be there: a few hours or several days. Neither was it clear whether a decision had been taken in Moscow to move only with approval from the International Committee of the Red Cross, or whether a decision would be made to move ahead regardless, if diplomatic wrangling takes too long.

A lone car with diplomatic plates and Red Cross insignia arrived at the location of the convoy on Thursday afternoon. Two men inside confirmed they were Red Cross officials based in Moscow but refused to give any further information about whether they had travelled with the convoy, what plans there were for inspection, or whether more representatives were on the way. On Thursday evening, the organisation tweeted that "initial contact" with the convoy had been made, and there were "many practical details to be clarified".

The trucks do indeed appear to contain humanitarian aid, and there is undoubtedly a grim situation in major towns in eastern Ukraine, as thousands don't have water and electricity, and are sheltering in basements to avoid shelling. Nevertheless, Kiev's concern about the convoy, with its thinly disguised military undertones, is understandable. Two military helicopters accompanied the convoy south, and flew just a few dozen metres from the ground as it came to a halt. The head and tail of the convoy included a number of vehicles with official Russian military plates.

Separately, there were several military transporters loaded with artillery and tanks visible on the main M4 road during the day. Locals say the sightings have been ever more frequent in recent months, with Ukraine accusing Moscow of shelling its territory from inside Russia, and transporting heavy weaponry across the border, including perhaps the BUK missile system which is believed to have been used to shoot down a Malaysian Airlines passenger jet last month.

The armoured column seen by the Guardian appeared to be further evidence of Russia's incursions, which the Kremlin has repeatedly denied.
Russian military vehicles enter Ukraine as aid convoy stops short of border | World news | The Guardian
 

pmaitra

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So it seemed the much touted humanitarian convoy is a smoke screen for an invasion... (a creeping one)?



Russian military vehicles enter Ukraine as aid convoy stops short of border | World news | The Guardian
Looks like taken out of US State Department hand-out.

The Guardian saw a column of 23 armoured personnel carriers, supported by fuel trucks and other logistics vehicles with official Russian military plates, travelling towards the border near the Russian town of Donetsk – about 200km away from Donetsk, Ukraine.
Where was this? Inside the territory of the Russian Federation? This is non-news. They can travel towards the border, or away from the border, as long as they are inside the territory of the Russian Federation. If "The Guardian" can present a video or picture of them crossing into Ukraine, we can talk. Till then, this article gets tossed into "pending further verification by a neutral source" category.
 

asianobserve

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Looks like taken out of US State Department hand-out.
It's from the Guardian, not Voice of America. If you don't know the background of Guardian then you better not talk.


Where was this? Inside the territory of the Russian Federation? This is non-news. They can travel towards the border, or away from the border, as long as they are inside the territory of the Russian Federation. If "The Guardian" can present a video or picture of them crossing into Ukraine, we can talk. Till then, this article gets tossed into "pending further verification by a neutral source" category.
I already highlighted the important part of the article and yet you missed it?

I expect more details of this report to come in the coming hours or next day.
 

pmaitra

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It's from the Guardian, not Voice of America. If you don't know the background of Guardian then you better not talk.




I already highlighted the important part of the article and yet you missed it?

I expect more details of this report to come in the coming hours or next day.
You keep posting such ridiculous news.

I will keep poking holes into their sub-standard (or malicious) journalism.

Also, I don't care what you highlight. I will look at whatsoever paragraph I please.

The trucks are unlikely to represent a full-scale official Russian invasion, and it was unclear how far they planned to travel inside Ukrainian territory and how long they would stay. But it was incontrovertible evidence of what Ukraine has long claimed – that Russian troops are active inside its borders.
The trucks are going under the aegis of the Red Cross, and OSCE observers will be there. The trucks are unlikely to represent a full scale invasion. The trucks are also unlikely to represent a half-scale invasion. The trucks are also unlikely to represent a quarter-scale invasion. Yes, it was unclear how they planned to travel inside Ukrainian territory. In other words, The Guardian is clueless.
 

asianobserve

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You keep posting such ridiculous news.

I will keep poking holes into their sub-standard (or malicious) journalism.
This media company is leftist and has a solid history of going against American foreign policies. It has vocally opposed the 2003 Iraqi invasion, exposed American abuses in Iraq and Afghanistan, exposed the Manning files and exposed Snowden files. Guardian has contributed a lot to the bad image America is getting all over the World lately.

But I know that will not be enough credentials to you since it does not sing praises to Putin and Russia. Well, that's your fault not their's.


Also, I don't care what you highlight. I will look at whatsoever paragraph I please.

It amazes me how Putin sycophants are blind to everything except Putin praise releases...

You were pointing out that the article does not say the Russian military convoy has intruded into Ukrainian territory and yet the phrase that I already highlighted clearly says that they did. Wow, your tunnel vision is the worst.


The trucks are going under the aegis of the Red Cross, and OSCE observers will be there. The trucks are unlikely to represent a full scale invasion. The trucks are also unlikely to represent a half-scale invasion. The trucks are also unlikely to represent a quarter-scale invasion. Yes, it was unclear how they planned to travel inside Ukrainian territory. In other words, The Guardian is clueless.
Again, you did not understand what you read, or did you really read the article. It did not mention only about Russian military trucks, it also mentioned about Russian APCs and other logistics vehicles.

And don't try to make your own version of this Guardian news article for it did not mention about this particular Russian military incursion being sanctioned by the Red Cross and OSCE.
 

pmaitra

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This media company is leftist . . . :blah: :blah: :blah:
Obama is also leftist. Half the US Congress is leftist. So what?
Also, I don't care what you highlight. I will look at whatsoever paragraph I please.
Doesn't bother me. I am criticizing The Guardian, and it is you who was trying to get me to look at what you highlighted. What is important to you, could be useless to me.
And don't try to make your own version of this Guardian news article for it did not mention about this particular Russian military incursion being sanctioned by the Red Cross and OSCE.
Guardian news? Or speculation? What is the need to talk about Russian military vehicles traveling on Russian territory, in an article that talks about an aid convoy going to Ukraine? Of course this is a malicious mind-seeding article. I am doing my job pointing that out.
 

asianobserve

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This is what people do when they lose an argument... they shut dwon reasonable discussion and just put up a nonsensical retort.
 

pmaitra

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This is what people do when they lose an argument... they shut dwon reasonable discussion and just put up a nonsensical retort.
Look, who is talking about "reasonable argument." :lol:

Yes, you crown yourself the winner, and bask in your self glory. I will continue to point out the mind-priming campaign the western media is engaged in. End of story.
 

asianobserve

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Look, who is talking about "reasonable argument." :lol:

Yes, you crown yourself the winner, and bask in your self glory. I will continue to point out the mind-priming campaign the western media is engaged in. End of story.

Please don't be a sore loser, after all this is only an academic discourse for you.
 

pmaitra

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Please don't be a sore loser, after all this is only an academic discourse for you.
Not with you.

With you, it is this constant struggle not to retaliate with the kind of language and ad hominem attacks you engage in, not least, the deliberate going off on a tangent to obfuscate when cornered with arguments.

Look at the recent conversation. This has nothing to do with Putin, but you dragged him in. I replaced all of that irrelevant gibberish with :blah: :blah: :blah:.

Anyway, you were saying something about "leftist." I am still eagerly waiting for you to articulate your point, if you have any at all, i.e.. :lol:
 
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