Civil war in Ukraine

Jimih

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@Akim

Putin never bothered to negotiate over the 2014 Crimea sanctions as he could have simply threatened to default on his debt to NATO and the US members which in 1998 nearly brought down the entire US financial system through just one vehicle called LTCM which collapsed then over the Russian default. He had a bargaining chip but he did not understand what he had or he was too weak to incur risk.

The bailout of LTCM required just about every US financial institution to bail it out. The US money center banks in New York City are tied into the 1.5 quadrillion dollar derivative market. These derivatives or synthetic instruments are used to manipulate markets by the Banksters draining trillions from the world financial system as parasites.

If you divide that by a world GDP this year of 90 trillion dollars, you have a multiple of derivatives of about 17. The LTCM default would have brought down the whole world system as their leverage was in the trillions of dollars. Another default in 2014 could have triggered a world crisis and no one could be sure what financial trip wires might be breached. It was a great negotiating chip.

Putin simply does not have Stalin’s strength or grasp to understand such possibilities.
 

Knowitall

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@asianobserve shame on you [email protected]

This is how the people you defend treat you.


'Do you ever think about me?': the children sex tourists leave behind
What shame?

@asianobserve would be proud of this and would probably promote this.

If it's white people it's probably right.

I couldn't give a damn is Russia wins or loses but this blatant shilling almost makes you wonder how low this man can go.
 

JBH22

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Soviet a force for good? Don't try to be funny comrade!

Tell that to the Poles, Czechs, Lithuanianians, and the rest of Eastern and Central Europeans that USSR effectively annexed after WW2.
Well if you consider the choice was clear cut dying under nazi sword or living under soviet boot. They could break free from Russia in a relatively peaceful way unlike Germans who had to be fought to near destruction
 

Optimistic Nihilist

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Well if you consider the choice was clear cut dying under nazi sword or living under soviet boot. They could break free from Russia in a relatively peaceful way unlike Germans who had to be fought to near destruction
It's easy for American shills to belabor the CIA propaganda points instead of looking at historical events in their context.

They always conveniently seem to forget the hundreds of millions of deaths the CIA has caused through funding death squads, regime changes, economic sanctions and the fact that America to this day provides weapons and military assistance to 3/4 of the world's dictators.

Again, if you look at Russia's actions post World War 2 from a balanced perspective, it makes a whole lot more sense.

To this day, Russia calls WW2 the Great Patriotic War. Tens of millions of their people died at the hands of Germans. Somehow they managed to muster up their spirit and fought back in the bleakest of conditions.

And it wasn't the first time. They had already suffered shit loads of invasions from the West, right from Napoleon to World Wars. The creation of Soviet buffer states post WW2 was for a reason.

Post Cold War the enemy completely dismantled their buffers and economy and began a process of absorbing them. To expect them not to be concerned about the West and NATO trying to militarize a country right on their borders is ridiculous.
 
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Tactical Doge

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Russian Mouthpiece RT have spoken
Hehee
 

Akim

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It's easy for American shills to belabor the CIA propaganda points instead of looking at historical events in their context.

They always conveniently seem to forget the hundreds of millions of deaths the CIA has caused through funding death squads, regime changes, economic sanctions and the fact that America to this day provides weapons and military assistance to 3/4 of the world's dictators.

Again, if you look at Russia's actions post World War 2 from a balanced perspective, it makes a whole lot more sense.

To this day, Russia calls WW2 the Great Patriotic War. Tens of millions of their people died at the hands of Germans. Somehow they managed to muster up their spirit and fought back in the bleakest of conditions.

And it wasn't the first time. They had already suffered shit loads of invasions from the West, right from Napoleon to World Wars. The creation of Soviet buffer states post WW2 was for a reason.

Post Cold War the enemy completely dismantled their buffers and economy and began a process of absorbing them. To expect them not to be concerned about the West and NATO trying to militarize a country right on their borders is ridiculous.
The Great Patriotic War is called because from September 17, 39 to June 22, 41, Stalin collaborated with Hitler. And the gasoline that was poured into German tanks when he stormed France was delivered from the Soviet Union.
 

Maharaj skandgupta

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The Great Patriotic War is called because from September 17, 39 to June 22, 41, Stalin collaborated with Hitler. And the gasoline that was poured into German tanks when he stormed France was delivered to the Soviet Union.
Delivered by the USSR
 

Optimistic Nihilist

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The Great Patriotic War is called because from September 17, 39 to June 22, 41, Stalin collaborated with Hitler. And the gasoline that was poured into German tanks when he stormed France was delivered from the Soviet Union.
You mean the German-Soviet Commercial Agreement, an intricate trade pact in which the Soviet Union would send Germany 650 million Reichmarks in raw materials in exchange for 650 million Reichmarks in machinery, manufactured goods and technology?

The Soviets were to receive the Hipper-class heavy cruiser Lützow, the plans to the battleship Bismarck, information on German naval testing, "complete machinery for a large destroyer", heavy naval guns, three 38.1 cm (15.0 in) twin turrets to defend ports, preliminary sketches for a 40.6 cm triple turret, working drawings for a 28 cm turret, other naval gear and samples of thirty of Germany's latest warplanes, including the Bf 109 fighter, Bf 110 fighter and Ju 88 bomber. Stalin believed the Lutzow to be important because of its new 20.3 cm naval guns, along with their performance characteristics. The Soviets would also receive oil and electric equipment, locomotives, turbines, generators, diesel engines, ships, machine tools and samples of German artillery, tanks, explosives, chemical-warfare equipment and other items.

Seems like a good agreement considering what happened later. Of course, no side is blameless here. Definitely some poetic justice lies in the fact that the tanks that would eventually invade the Soviet Union were indirectly funded by the Soviets.

That doesn't change the original point of them being invaded for centuries by the West, which to some extent explains their actions after WW2.
 

Akim

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You mean the German-Soviet Commercial Agreement, an intricate trade pact in which the Soviet Union would send Germany 650 million Reichmarks in raw materials in exchange for 650 million Reichmarks in machinery, manufactured goods and technology?

The Soviets were to receive the Hipper-class heavy cruiser Lützow, the plans to the battleship Bismarck, information on German naval testing, "complete machinery for a large destroyer", heavy naval guns, three 38.1 cm (15.0 in) twin turrets to defend ports, preliminary sketches for a 40.6 cm triple turret, working drawings for a 28 cm turret, other naval gear and samples of thirty of Germany's latest warplanes, including the Bf 109 fighter, Bf 110 fighter and Ju 88 bomber. Stalin believed the Lutzow to be important because of its new 20.3 cm naval guns, along with their performance characteristics. The Soviets would also receive oil and electric equipment, locomotives, turbines, generators, diesel engines, ships, machine tools and samples of German artillery, tanks, explosives, chemical-warfare equipment and other items.

Seems like a good agreement considering what happened later. Of course, no side is blameless here. Definitely some poetic justice lies in the fact that the tanks that would eventually invade the Soviet Union were indirectly funded by the Soviets.

That doesn't change the original point of them being invaded for centuries by the West, which to some extent explains their actions after WW2.
This is historical dregs. Of course, in the era of Empires, all countries existed by expansion. And the Russian Empire was not "white and fluffy" either. Together with Austria, they tore apart Poland and did not even notice.
The time was like that.
I was talking about the modern world, where technology is important.
And if for that collection (1 ton of grain per hectare) in the USSR they gave an order, now for such low indicators they will be expelled from work
 

Optimistic Nihilist

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This is historical dregs. Of course, in the era of Empires, all countries existed by expansion. And the Russian Empire was not "white and fluffy" either. Together with Austria, they tore apart Poland and did not even notice.
The time was like that.
Yeah, but again Russia had to deal with Polish insurgents and Austria was only barely able to keep its empire together with Russia's help against the Hungarian revolution. Austria, Russia, and Prussia all had large Pole minorities. So any kind of independent Polish state would become a beacon of organization and resistance among the Polish within their borders. So because of that the incidents with Poland happened.

Poland was already in decline through entire 18th century, it was quite weak for a while, far from being relevant like it was in 16th or first half of 17th century. It lived on borrowed time where it had to reform or perish, it was eventually caught in the perfect storm bordering three centralized kingdoms that could get shit done, Russia having a pro-German Empress, lots of internal issues ranging from traitors among nobility to being basically dysfunctional state.

Poland tried to reform itself after two partitions, but it was way too late at that point and three absolutist monarchies couldn't allow to have liberal monarchy on its doorstep seeing how everyone was already shitting themselves at the thought of what was happening in France.
 

Akim

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Yeah, but again Russia had to deal with Polish insurgents and Austria was only barely able to keep its empire together with Russia's help against the Hungarian revolution. Austria, Russia, and Prussia all had large Pole minorities. So any kind of independent Polish state would become a beacon of organization and resistance among the Polish within their borders. So because of that the incidents with Poland happened.

Poland was already in decline through entire 18th century, it was quite weak for a while, far from being relevant like it was in 16th or first half of 17th century. It lived on borrowed time where it had to reform or perish, it was eventually caught in the perfect storm bordering three centralized kingdoms that could get shit done, Russia having a pro-German Empress, lots of internal issues ranging from traitors among nobility to being basically dysfunctional state.

Poland tried to reform itself after two partitions, but it was way too late at that point and three absolutist monarchies couldn't allow to have liberal monarchy on its doorstep seeing how everyone was already shitting themselves at the thought of what was happening in France.
I am not defending Poland. Poles are good at defending themselves. There are different historical periods. And now the armed expansion is considered savagery. Russia simply has nothing to offer either technologically or economically, so it uses brute force.
I also believe that socialism and communism are the higher forms of development of society, but this does not apply to modern Russia.
 

Optimistic Nihilist

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I am not defending Poland. Poles are good at defending themselves. There are different historical periods. And now the armed expansion is considered savagery. Russia simply has nothing to offer either technologically or economically, so it uses brute force.
I also believe that socialism and communism are the higher forms of development of society, but this does not apply to modern Russia.
This is something that's true. Modern Russia is controlled by ultra-capitalist oligarchs, there is no socialism involved anywhere.
 

asianobserve

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I am not defending Poland. Poles are good at defending themselves. There are different historical periods. And now the armed expansion is considered savagery. Russia simply has nothing to offer either technologically or economically, so it uses brute force.
I also believe that socialism and communism are the higher forms of development of society, but this does not apply to modern Russia.
Communism is a utopia. It only exists in the fertile minds of some people.
 

pipebomb

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Soviet a force for good? Don't try to be funny comrade!

Tell that to the Poles, Czechs, Lithuanianians, and the rest of Eastern and Central Europeans that USSR effectively annexed after WW2.
After all the countless Indian lives commies have taken, after complete plunder/revision of our centuries old history & culture, it is simply baffling going through this thread on an Indian forum. Its is one thing to deal with Soviets/Russian in realpolitik but to to sing praises of commies is mind boggling.
 

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