Civil war in Ukraine

Tshering22

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As the saying goes: "Maybe rain or maybe snow, maybe yes or maybe no."
I do not want to comment on the words of the idiot who sat in the President's chair. He's just a teenager in politics with no experience.
Yatsenyukh was a seasoned politician and yet he didn't do much better. Ukraine has to think about less politics and more things to get done. Somewhat like India where people are highly politicized and need de-politicization.

The West is taking you for a long ride. They will never see you as their equal. Look at how Poland is treated even after so many years.
 

Akim

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Yatsenyukh was a seasoned politician and yet he didn't do much better. Ukraine has to think about less politics and more things to get done. Somewhat like India where people are highly politicized and need de-politicization.

The West is taking you for a long ride. They will never see you as their equal. Look at how Poland is treated even after so many years.
I know that, but we have no choice. Putin "burned all the bridges" when he annexed Crimea. We now have only two ways: either to win or disappear.
 

Tshering22

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I know that, but we have no choice. Putin "burned all the bridges" when he annexed Crimea. We now have only two ways: either to win or disappear.
What about staying like Sweden and consolidating power within Europe? Neutrality but with strength? Pretty sure that the EU will collaborate with you the way they did with Sweden. Falling into the US trap will only make you another Georgia and that is not going to get you anywhere since you share a huge, huge border with the Russians. Not to mention the eastern half of your country is Russian.

Antagonizing Russia by joining NATO where the latter will ditch you with a promise is not going to get you anywhere.
 

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I know that, but we have no choice. Putin "burned all the bridges" when he annexed Crimea. We now have only two ways: either to win or disappear.
American pansies are loath to sacrifice soldiers.. I am pretty sure, Americans will find a way to avoid direct conventional war with Russia, even if Russia captures the Baltic states which are NATO members by closing the suwalki gap..
And about the peace loving European pansies the lesser said the better.. I so hope Russia calls NATO bluff by capturing territory of a NATO country.. in the Baltics.. and I would love to watch as US pundits make excuses about how indefensible Baltic countries are..🙄
 

Akim

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What about staying like Sweden and consolidating power within Europe? Neutrality but with strength? Pretty sure that the EU will collaborate with you the way they did with Sweden. Falling into the US trap will only make you another Georgia and that is not going to get you anywhere since you share a huge, huge border with the Russians. Not to mention the eastern half of your country is Russian.

Antagonizing Russia by joining NATO where the latter will ditch you with a promise is not going to get you anywhere.
In 2014, we were neutral, but that did not stop Putin from attacking us. Georgia in 2008 was neutral too.
Personally, I am not a supporter of NATO. It is an amorphous and loose organization.
I don't even want to talk about nationality. Missiles and bombs from the RF not will be chosen according to this principle.
I know that the West does not consider us "its own". They just don't talk about it out loud. It is convenient for them when Putin is spending his energy on the war with Ukraine.
 
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Ukraine is playing itself to death.

When the Soviet Union broke up, Ukraine's GDP is 80 billion US dollars.Ukraine's GDP is $80 billion, a third of India's and a quarter of China's. possessionIt has the third nuclear weapon in the world.
It has the world's third largest nuclear weapons, advanced shipbuilding, aviation and heavy industry.It's the granary of Europe.

They listen too much to the sweet words of the United States and Europe,It should have been both ways:It was supposed to be a two-way street, attracting both Russia and the West,Maximize the realization of its own interests And Economic Growth.

But the reality is to listen to other people's sweet words, destroy nuclear weapons, destroy bombers, destroy shipbuilding industry, engage in political struggle, stand on the front line of the West and confront Russia. In the end, the West only used Ukraine as a tool to confront Russia, but never regarded Ukraine as one of its own.
 

Akim

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The West is very gentle. He does not want another big war in Europe, choosing between death and shame.
Since 14, there has been a "silent embargo" on the supply of weapons to Ukraine. It ended as soon as Ukraine made its counterparts.
The heart of the BTR-3 was the Mercedes engine. Germany has cut off supplies. Then Ukraine began to install its engines and supplies resumed.
We did not have modern ATGMs. The missile fuel and explosive filler were previously supplied by Russia. America and Europe refused to replace it. Then we ourselves were forced to develop everything. Now the army has hundreds of new complexes. After that, the United States began to offer its Javelins.
Now the situation is similar with the air defense update. Nobody is in a hurry to sell.
In 1.5 years there will be a new Ukrainian complex and other sellers will immediately come running.
Do you think I don’t see the hypocrisy of the West?

 

Akim

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@Akim

What Western fighter do you think will Ukraine buy to replace its Mig-29s and Su-27s?

Gripen, F-16 or Rafale?
Oh, this is not a quick process. Until 2035, we will operate an obvious aircraft fleet, gradually increasing and modernizing it. We have a lot of fighters in storage. 7 combat aircraft are returned to service a year.
And the most important thing. Ukraine has no money.
We need to update everything. Everything. These are huge sums and aviation is not in the first place now.
 

Akim

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Continuation
Now our fleet is being actively updated. Due to the annexation of Crimea, we lost 75% of the ships of the Ukrainian Navy and, most importantly, naval bases and berths. Today, two such bases are under construction.
The Americans gave us 2 Island-class patrol boats, this year +3 more. Turkey is building us three corvettes of the "Ada" type (scheme: 1 Turkish shipyard + 2 at a Ukrainian shipyard. Great Britain builds us 8 missile boats (3 + 5 scheme) and sells two minesweepers of the Sandown type.
Ukrainian corvette (project 58250) will be completed as a frigate.
At the beginning of 2022, the delivery of the first battalion of the AShM system "Neptune" (6 launchers in battalion) will take place. There will be three battalions in total.
 

Jimih

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Volatile Situation 🚨

British destroyer violates Russia's border in Black Sea, Russian ship & fighter jet respond with warning shots – Defense Ministry

 

JBH22

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Continuation
Now our fleet is being actively updated. Due to the annexation of Crimea, we lost 75% of the ships of the Ukrainian Navy and, most importantly, naval bases and berths. Today, two such bases are under construction.
The Americans gave us 2 Island-class patrol boats, this year +3 more. Turkey is building us three corvettes of the "Ada" type (scheme: 1 Turkish shipyard + 2 at a Ukrainian shipyard. Great Britain builds us 8 missile boats (3 + 5 scheme) and sells two minesweepers of the Sandown type.
Ukrainian corvette (project 58250) will be completed as a frigate.
At the beginning of 2022, the delivery of the first battalion of the AShM system "Neptune" (6 launchers in battalion) will take place. There will be three battalions in total.
No do you still believe that you can fight Russia without Nato active support. Even covert support by Russia is creating head ache for Ukraine in Donbass region. At the end of the day, Ukraine leadership want transit fees and perks from Russia and also lie in bed with Nato.
As a pivot state you should make your mind, shun Russia and go full Nato. Provided you get Nato accession and that should tell about Nato real intention.
 

Akim

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No do you still believe that you can fight Russia without Nato active support. Even covert support by Russia is creating head ache for Ukraine in Donbass region. At the end of the day, Ukraine leadership want transit fees and perks from Russia and also lie in bed with Nato.
As a pivot state you should make your mind, shun Russia and go full Nato. Provided you get Nato accession and that should tell about Nato real intention.
Hidden? In 2014, the Russian army fought under the guise of rebels. Putin wanted to create Novorossiya, but got two stubs.
Are we going to attack Russia? Of course not. Our goal is that the Russian army will know that it will suffer huge losses in the event of an open invasion of Ukraine.
Otherwise, such blackmail, as in the spring of this year, will be repeated.
This is a long process, but as I said, we have no other way.
Contact your government for advice on what to do.
 

omaebakabaka

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Hidden? In 2014, the Russian army fought under the guise of rebels. Putin wanted to create Novorossiya, but got two stubs.
Are we going to attack Russia? Of course not. Our goal is that the Russian army will know that it will suffer huge losses in the event of an open invasion of Ukraine.
Otherwise, such blackmail, as in the spring of this year, will be repeated.
This is a long process, but as I said, we have no other way.
Contact your government for advice on what to do.
Lol, is this a joke....they will walk over Ukraine in like a week NATO or not but they have no reason to, they wanted crimea and they got it and rest of it is pretty useless for them....they are a far better force than soviets ever were now. Highly goal oriented and disciplined and trained....Ukrainian leadership is like India's congress selling their countries interests for personal benefit and in that sense acting like Pakis
 

Akim

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Lol, is this a joke....they will walk over Ukraine in like a week NATO or not but they have no reason to, they wanted crimea and they got it and rest of it is pretty useless for them....they are a far better force than soviets ever were now. Highly goal oriented and disciplined and trained....Ukrainian leadership is like India's congress selling their countries interests for personal benefit and in that sense acting like Pakis
These words can only confirm or deny realities. If in 6 years they have not moved a single meter, then they are definitely not ready for an open invasion.
 

omaebakabaka

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These words can only confirm or deny realities. If in 6 years they have not moved a single meter, then they are definitely not ready for an open invasion.
They have no reason to invade, Ukraine at this point offers nothing really much to them that they already do not have....they are waiting for islamic takeover of Euro land and Ukraine should not think or has a reason to think they are in same category as russia and risk losing more. Be friendly and mutually profitable relationships with your historical neighbor, Ukraine should be glad that they don't have porkis or Chinese at their door step.
 

JBH22

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Hidden? In 2014, the Russian army fought under the guise of rebels. Putin wanted to create Novorossiya, but got two stubs.
Are we going to attack Russia? Of course not. Our goal is that the Russian army will know that it will suffer huge losses in the event of an open invasion of Ukraine.
Otherwise, such blackmail, as in the spring of this year, will be repeated.
This is a long process, but as I said, we have no other way.
Contact your government for advice on what to do.
Our advice for you to remain stable is to remain neutral. To get Nato accession, be courteous to Russia and manage them as far as you can.
If no, then go full for Nato accession if they willing to give
 

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