Chinese military lost 10 aircraft in 2017

Armand2REP

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Note that the Chinese military has lost 10 aircraft for the year of 2017, among which are a J-10AH, a J-11BH and a J-15 of the Navy, a two-seater J-10S, two J-10As and a JH-7A fighter-bomber of the air force. Not to mention a JL-8 from the aviation school and a Mi-171 helicopter of the army. 7 pilots were found dead.

***This may not be a complete list due to the secrecy of the government but the expansion of the internet is making it more difficult to hide such incidence.

It is predicted that with the further increase in training demanded by Supreme Leader Xi and outlined in the Central Military Commission that the number of accidents will certainly increase over the next two years.

source Henri Kenhmann, author East Pendulum blog
http://bit.ly/2GKeHC6
 

lcafanboy

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Note that the Chinese military has lost 10 aircraft for the year of 2017, among which are a J-10AH, a J-11BH and a J-15 of the Navy, a two-seater J-10S, two J-10As and a JH-7A fighter-bomber of the air force. Not to mention a JL-8 from the aviation school and a Mi-171 helicopter of the army. 7 pilots were found dead.

***This may not be a complete list due to the secrecy of the government but the expansion of the internet is making it more difficult to hide such incidence.

It is predicted that with the further increase in training demanded by Supreme Leader Xi and outlined in the Central Military Commission that the number of accidents will certainly increase over the next two years.

source Henri Kenhmann, author East Pendulum blog
http://bit.ly/2GKeHC6
Chinese Lavi & Sukhoi copycat FLYING COFFINS J-10-11-12-13-14-15-16...... coming down as fast as they are manufacturing.......... :pound::pound::pound::pound:

Soon joining these will be J-20 & J-37 Chinese 6th GEN stealth planes will get invisible into mother earth once they fly too......:daru::daru::daru:

RIP to pilots & their families......:scared2::scared2::scared2::scared2::sad::sad::sad::sad::sad:
 

sthf

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Dayum!!! 8 out of 10 crashes are new platforms. Not really surprising that filthy commies are hiding the crashes. They suffer from some serious inferiority complex.

Either the PLAAF has replaced the Mig copies or have stopped flying them completely till they can be replaced.
 

cyclops

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Lost 10 aircrafts.............that we know of.
 

Armand2REP

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Half of the losses were J-10s. There are problems with the fly-by-wire but that is not all. There is a good reason the Russians didn't make a single engine fighter out of the AL-31. If you don't have a backup when it fails you aren't going to make it back to base. This raises serious questions about the combat worthiness of the fighter as it is only now that they are putting serious hours on the platform. If it was required to go hundreds of hours in a month air campaign they wouldn't even have to be shot down, they would simply fall from the sky.
 

binayak95

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It took almost a decade for us to sort out issues with the MiG 29s and the Su-30s (IAF).
And the IN is now dealing with the same. That too with local manufacture of the RD-33 and the Al-31F. Which is why the Chinese are now pushing full steam for their own engines.
Half of the losses were J-10s. There are problems with the fly-by-wire but that is not all. There is a good reason the Russians didn't make a single engine fighter out of the AL-31. If you don't have a backup when it fails you aren't going to make it back to base. This raises serious questions about the combat worthiness of the fighter as it is only now that they are putting serious hours on the platform. If it was required to go hundreds of hours in a month air campaign they wouldn't even have to be shot down, they would simply fall from the sky.
 

Armand2REP

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It took almost a decade for us to sort out issues with the MiG 29s and the Su-30s (IAF).
And the IN is now dealing with the same. That too with local manufacture of the RD-33 and the Al-31F. Which is why the Chinese are now pushing full steam for their own engines.
India has always put massive hours on their MKI and long ago the reliability state of the engines has been known. It is not the fault of localised production that causes them technical problems. Chinese get theirs straight out of the box from Russia as they are not trusted in production after the Su-27 license scandal. The reason the AL-31 was chosen over the WS-10 was because the WS-10 wasn't reliable enough for a single engine fighter. 80% of engine failures were caused by broken turbine blades. Al-31 doesn't have this problem but there are many other components on this engine that can fail. Even MKI has had problems from 2012 to 2015 there were 69 investigations into engine failures according to Parrikar. Thanks to MKI being a twin engine aircraft it can make it home. The Soviets knew exactly what they were doing when they created MiG-29 and Su-27 to be twin engine aircraft. Especially considering the long history of single engine turbojet fighters it was a radical departure for their mass production scale as single engine airframes require less resources. If you are going to make a single engine fighter it must use the most reliable of engines. Pakistan is finding with JF-17 they wished they had two.
 

binayak95

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India has always put massive hours on their MKI and long ago the reliability state of the engines has been known. It is not the fault of localised production that causes them technical problems. Chinese get theirs straight out of the box from Russia as they are not trusted in production after the Su-27 license scandal. The reason the AL-31 was chosen over the WS-10 was because the WS-10 wasn't reliable enough for a single engine fighter. 80% of engine failures were caused by broken turbine blades. Al-31 doesn't have this problem but there are many other components on this engine that can fail. Even MKI has had problems from 2012 to 2015 there were 69 investigations into engine failures according to Parrikar. Thanks to MKI being a twin engine aircraft it can make it home. The Soviets knew exactly what they were doing when they created MiG-29 and Su-27 to be twin engine aircraft. Especially considering the long history of single engine turbojet fighters it was a radical departure for their mass production scale as single engine airframes require less resources. If you are going to make a single engine fighter it must use the most reliable of engines. Pakistan is finding with JF-17 they wished they had two.
The insane sortie rate (as far as the Russians are concerned atleast) that the IAF and the IN make their fighters do doesn't help any. What I meant by local manufacture is that it helps us in quickly sourcing spares for the aircraft and rectifying issues, something that the Chinese dont have.. besides the underpowered nature of the WS-10 is well known.
 

Armand2REP

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So does that mean JF17 safety record is actually better? :pak:
How many hours does PAF fly the average JF-17 in a year vs how many hours the J-10 flies? When China pushes the J-10 they crash, when PAF pushed the JF-17 they crashed. It seems both aircraft are good for show pieces at airshows but when you push them for combat duties they are not up to the mark. If you or anyone knows what kind of flight hours the JF-17 had been getting over the last few years of budget restrictions facing the Pakistan military would go a long way to answering that question.
 

Armand2REP

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The insane sortie rate (as far as the Russians are concerned atleast) that the IAF and the IN make their fighters do doesn't help any. What I meant by local manufacture is that it helps us in quickly sourcing spares for the aircraft and rectifying issues, something that the Chinese dont have.. besides the underpowered nature of the WS-10 is well known.
Going back to 2015 there was evidence that J-10s were crashing at a high rate due to engine failure. Apparently there is some design compatibility issues. http://bit.ly/2ECFpLX

The WS-10 has still proven less reliable than the AL-31 despite the numerous J-10 losses. Maybe it is not the AL-31 itself that is to blame but the poor integration of it by Chinese engineering.
 

Armand2REP

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Chinese Lavi & Sukhoi copycat FLYING COFFINS J-10-11-12-13-14-15-16...... coming down as fast as they are manufacturing.......... :pound::pound::pound::pound:

Soon joining these will be J-20 & J-37 Chinese 6th GEN stealth planes will get invisible into mother earth once they fly too......:daru::daru::daru:

RIP to pilots & their families......:scared2::scared2::scared2::scared2::sad::sad::sad::sad::sad:
In 2015 there were also 4 crashes of J-10. http://bit.ly/2DXZdZa It could truly be turning into the Chinese flying coffin. Most pilots turn up dead or critically injured.
 

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Armand2REP

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Ten? Not a lot for an Air Force the size of China.

USAF had 22 crashes in non-combat missions in 2017.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/11/24/us-troops-killed-in-plane-crashes-skyrockets-in-2017.amp.html

There is no evidence that China can “hide” crashes in a densely populated country with cameras and cellphones everywhere.

The J-10? China is making more and more! So you don’t have to worry.

Count them. There are 21 new J-10Cs at CAC in Dec. 2017.

I see 21 J-10s waiting for engines. Russia has only delivered 245 which means accounting for spares of four engines per sqd. 200 actual deliveries. Out of that 10% have crashed. You do realise China has plans to get 400 J-10s?

There are plenty areas of China that are not densely populated and where PLAAF likes to host war games. If someone takes a picture Chinese censors quickly scrub the internet.

You do realise that out of all of these crashes not one are of J-7s or Q-5s which make up half of all PLAAF fighters. It is as if they do not even fly.
 

SexyChineseLady

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There are already over 400 J-10s currently, according to Andreas Rupprecht who only count batch serials:

232 J-10A
90 J-10AS
55 J-10B
27 J-10C
-------------
404 serial J-10 of all versions (without the prototypes)

And that was before the Dec. 2017 satellite pictures of the 21 J-10C at the Chengdu plant.

Sorry Indian “French” man, China has made a lot of J-10s. And they will be making more otherwise they would not be testing the new vectoring variant of the WS-10 on the J-10:



You should read Henri Kenhmann and East Pendulum more so you can learn more. He is very accurate and fair.

But he writes only in French so that can be a problem for you (I noticed you used the google translator in your post.)
 

Armand2REP

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There are already over 400 J-10s currently, according to Andreas Rupprecht who only count batch serials:

232 J-10A
90 J-10AS
55 J-10B
27 J-10C
-------------
404 serial J-10 of all versions (without the prototypes)
According to SIPRI only 245 AL-31FN have been delivered, numbers don't lie.

And that was before the Dec. 2017 satellite pictures of the 21 J-10C at the Chengdu plant.

Sorry Indian “French” man, China has made a lot of J-10s. And they will be making more otherwise they would not be testing the new vectoring variant of the WS-10 on the J-10:
If you are suggesting China has 200 J-10s powered by Taihang I say heaven help them.

You should read Henri Kenhmann and East Pendulum more so you can learn more. He is very accurate and fair.

But he writes only in French so that can be a problem for you (I noticed you used the google translator in your post.)
You noticed what? My original translation reads...

Note that the Chinese military has lost 10 aircraft for the year of 2017, among which are a J-10AH, a J-11BH and a J-15 of the Navy, a two-seater J-10S, two J-10As and a JH-7A fighter-bomber of the air force. Not to mention a JL-8 from the aviation school and a Mi-171 helicopter of the army. 7 pilots were found dead.

Google translate reads...

Note that the Chinese military has lost 10 aircraft in a single year 2017, among which are a J-10AH, a J-11BH and a J-15 of the Navy, a two-seat J-10S, two J-10A and JH-7A fighter-bomber of the air Force, as well as JL-8 from the aviation school and a Mi-171 helicopter of the army. 7 pilots were killed.

It doesn't look the same, oh wait, it isn't the same. Are you trying to imply something?
 

SexyChineseLady

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Yes, you seemed to have use nearly word for word the google translation for a French article including all of the robotic grammar while you claim to be French.

Also, you don’t seem to be able to understand the title and main point of the story which was about the Y-8 crash (that you say was the C-919.)

Crash d’un brouilleur longue portée Y-8G qui fait 12 morts

Yes, I encourage you to read more from Henri and East Pendulum — even if you need to use google translate — so you can learn more about China and its military.
 

SexyChineseLady

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And I trust the German, who published multiple books on the Chinese air force, on the 400 J-10 count than I would you. Sorry.
 

Armand2REP

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Yes, you seemed to have use nearly word for word the google translation for a French article including all of the robotic grammar while you claim to be French.
I count about 13 differences within three lines of text between my translation and the Google translation. It isn't my fault Henri le petit Chinois writes like a robot.

Also, you don’t seem to be able to understand the title and main point of the story which was about the Y-8 crash (that you say was the C-919.)
You want to talk about that you can take it to the appropriate thread. Here we are talking about crashes pre-2018.
 

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