China's 003 Aircraft Carrier (former 002)

Super falcon

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Type 003 more havier than indian Vikrant what options India will take to tackle growing Chinese threat at sea

 

Super falcon

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With KJ 600 on board these type 003 it will be harder for IN to get near these because IN ships and jets can be detected by Chinese aircraft battle group far away before IN does
 

Super falcon

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India has to get a new Carrier atleast of 70000 to 80000 tonnage to get closer to Chinese threat and buy E 2 for them than it will be even
 

houde10000

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I wonder how you reached that figure, would you explain your thought process on how you reached the figure of "at least 70-80000 tonne"? Is this standard or full?
85000 tonne is standard replacement, the full replacement is easily over 100000 tonne. How to get that number? the standard figure is from PLAN publicized info, normally PLAN won't bluff for their arsenal figure. The full figure is easy to calculate with US navy carrier's standard/full replacement ratio, but remember 003 is not nuclear propel boat, it will fill extra 10000 tonne dynamical fuel.

Byway, PLAN has already loaded 3 LHA boats with 40000 tonne standard replacement. 100,000 tonne is just a piece of cake for PLAN, if the world is in dire chaos, Chinese shipyards could show us the capability to simultaneously build 10 ACs. It is better to leave Chinese chill, not inspire them.
 

Adm Kenobi

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85000 tonne is standard replacement, the full replacement is easily over 100000 tonne. How to get that number? the standard figure is from PLAN publicized info, normally PLAN won't bluff for their arsenal figure. The full figure is easy to calculate with US navy carrier's standard/full replacement ratio, but remember 003 is not nuclear propel boat, it will fill extra 10000 tonne dynamical fuel.
I'm not asking about 003's figure. I suggest you read my statement and the quoted statement before replying again.

100,000 tonne is just a piece of cake for PLAN
There's a difference between launching x number of LHD of yz,000 displacement and the achievement of launching a supercarrier. Calling it a "piece of cake" eh?

if the world is in dire chaos, Chinese shipyards could show us the capability to simultaneously build 10 ACs. It is better to leave Chinese chill, not inspire them.
I wouldn't even explain on how delusional that is.
 

houde10000

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I'm not asking about 003's figure. I suggest you read my statement and the quoted statement before replying again.

Sorry, I can not roll back many layers to read where your question was evolved from, could you please quote whole clue, not just a piece of words, to make things explicit. Thx.


There's a difference between launching x number of LHD of yz,000 displacement and the achievement of launching a supercarrier. Calling it a "piece of cake" eh?

of course, there is a difference between LHD and Super AC, but build 3 LHD 40000 tonne in one shipyard in 3 years, it means the enormous shipbuilding capacity can immerse in casting super ACs.

I wouldn't even explain on how delusional that is.
America and China, the two behemoths clash, we are better to watch, not inspire either of them.
 

IndianHawk

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Type 003 more havier than indian Vikrant what options India will take to tackle growing Chinese threat at sea

Chinese naval threat to india is frankly overhyped.
Indian shoreline is thousands of km away from China and most of Chinese navy can't even reach india . ( All their diesel ssk and smaller surface ships Corvettes etc. Are useless against India. )
And bigger ships and SSN are still much less in numbers then what china requires.

Because first China has to contend with massive us baby and more advanced Japanese navy . Only after that it can realistically hope to have a foot print in Indian Ocean.

Meanwhile India is developing carrier killer missiles ( Agni prime already tested) besides brahmos which is now also air launched) there there are Indian SSN upcoming which will make all chinese surface ships in Indian Ocean dead in water.

Plus there are Indian carriers equipped which much better air components ( upcoming deal with either f18 or rafale) compared to disaster that is j15.

India hypersonic missiles are also incoming.

So basically this so called chines naval thread is already taken care off.
 

Blademaster

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Chinese naval threat to india is frankly overhyped.
Indian shoreline is thousands of km away from China and most of Chinese navy can't even reach india . ( All their diesel ssk and smaller surface ships Corvettes etc. Are useless against India. )
And bigger ships and SSN are still much less in numbers then what china requires.

Because first China has to contend with massive us baby and more advanced Japanese navy . Only after that it can realistically hope to have a foot print in Indian Ocean.

Meanwhile India is developing carrier killer missiles ( Agni prime already tested) besides brahmos which is now also air launched) there there are Indian SSN upcoming which will make all chinese surface ships in Indian Ocean dead in water.

Plus there are Indian carriers equipped which much better air components ( upcoming deal with either f18 or rafale) compared to disaster that is j15.

India hypersonic missiles are also incoming.

So basically this so called chines naval thread is already taken care off.
So speaketh by someone whose head is in the sand.

Reminds me of an Indian folklore story where a flock of birds live on top of a tree. There was a baby creeper growing at the base of the tree. An old wise bird advised the flock to eat away the baby creeper before it becomes a menace. The flock cried, "A baby creeper a threat? What nonsense!" and ignored the old bird. As the creeper grew, the old bird kept advising that the flock destroy the growing creeper and each time the flock ignored him saying that the creeper was no threat. Then one day came where the creeper grew around the tree and its body so thick and hard that the birds' beaks could not break it but destroy their own beaks. A man came by and noticed the flock on top of the tree. He climbed the tree and threw a net over the top of the tree and trapped the flock. The flock cried out and asked the old bird, "What shall we do??!!" The old bird said, "Nothing for it is too late. I kept warning you and you did not listen."
 

Blood+

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America and China, the two behemoths clash, we are better to watch, not inspire either of them.
For a Canadian, your wording seems rather 'interesting'. Are you sure you're a Canadian or are you using a VPN??
 

Blood+

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So speaketh by someone whose head is in the sand.

Reminds me of an Indian folklore story where a flock of birds live on top of a tree. There was a baby creeper growing at the base of the tree. An old wise bird advised the flock to eat away the baby creeper before it becomes a menace. The flock cried, "A baby creeper a threat? What nonsense!" and ignored the old bird. As the creeper grew, the old bird kept advising that the flock destroy the growing creeper and each time the flock ignored him saying that the creeper was no threat. Then one day came where the creeper grew around the tree and its body so thick and hard that the birds' beaks could not break it but destroy their own beaks. A man came by and noticed the flock on top of the tree. He climbed the tree and threw a net over the top of the tree and trapped the flock. The flock cried out and asked the old bird, "What shall we do??!!" The old bird said, "Nothing for it is too late. I kept warning you and you did not listen."
While I agree with you in general that we should never underestimate an opponent, especially one such as the PRC, at the moment, there is simply no way for us to achieve any kind of parity with their navy.
 

Super Flanker

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Chinese naval threat to india is frankly overhyped.
Indian shoreline is thousands of km away from China and most of Chinese navy can't even reach india . ( All their diesel ssk and smaller surface ships Corvettes etc. Are useless against India. )
And bigger ships and SSN are still much less in numbers then what china requires.

Because first China has to contend with massive us baby and more advanced Japanese navy . Only after that it can realistically hope to have a foot print in Indian Ocean.

Meanwhile India is developing carrier killer missiles ( Agni prime already tested) besides brahmos which is now also air launched) there there are Indian SSN upcoming which will make all chinese surface ships in Indian Ocean dead in water.

Plus there are Indian carriers equipped which much better air components ( upcoming deal with either f18 or rafale) compared to disaster that is j15.

India hypersonic missiles are also incoming.

So basically this so called chines naval thread is already taken care off.
I agree with what you say but we should not underestimate the PRC either. Remember, never underestimate your Opponent or else you will regret it.

If a full scale war does happen between India and China and both countries get their navy involved then I would say that it would be a fight only between PLAN and IN. Don't expect US/Japan or anyone else to come to your aid. We have already seen how trustworthy US is as a partner in Afghanistan, Ukraine etc.

Also Pakistan too would definitely get involved in the war so it would not be just PLAN vs IN but rather PA and PLAN vs IN. China can use Pakistan's major ports to deploy it's ships and mount an attack on India along with Pak Navy so that assumption that Chinese navy's ships are too far away from the Indian mainland IMO is wrong.

In a conflict, we will be on our own. I doubt US would help us militarily or any country for that matter.
 

Blademaster

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While I agree with you in general that we should never underestimate an opponent, especially one such as the PRC, at the moment, there is simply no way for us to achieve any kind of parity with their navy.
Yes but it doesn't mean ignoring the threat and burying your head into the sand. You have to be proactive in countering the threat with whatever means available.
 

Blademaster

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I agree with what you say but we should not underestimate the PRC either. Remember, never underestimate your Opponent or else you will regret it.

If a full scale war does happen between India and China and both countries get their navy involved then I would say that it would be a fight only between PLAN and IN. Don't expect US/Japan or anyone else to come to your aid. We have already seen how trustworthy US is as a partner in Afghanistan, Ukraine etc.

Also Pakistan too would definitely get involved in the war so it would not be just PLAN vs IN but rather PA and PLAN vs IN. China can use Pakistan's major ports to deploy it's ships and mount an attack on India along with Pak Navy so that assumption that Chinese navy's ships are too far away from the Indian mainland IMO is wrong.

In a conflict, we will be on our own. I doubt US would help us militarily or any country for that matter.
US will only help out indirectly by making sure that the PLAN doesn't block any navigational routes or force the PLAN to take longer routes and provide IN with real time intelligence on the whereabouts of the PLAN forces and some weapon supplies.
 

Blood+

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Yes but it doesn't mean ignoring the threat and burying your head into the sand. You have to be proactive in countering the threat with whatever means available.
Not at all. We would need to invest more resources in sea denials. Building smaller faster-mover FFGs with long-range ASHms and SAMs in large numbers for literal warfare should do the job. hopefully.
 

Super Flanker

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Yes but it doesn't mean ignoring the threat and burying your head into the sand. You have to be proactive in countering the threat with whatever means available.
No one here is saying that we should ignore the threat, I said that regardless of the magnitude of the threat, we should ensure that we are well prepared to deal with it. To counter new modem threats, we need to invest our money in newer and modern Weopons systems.

Not at all. We would need to invest more resources in sea denials. Building smaller faster-mover FFGs with long-range ASHms and SAMs in large numbers for literal warfare should do the job. hopefully.
Yes this is very well said. In the past I have emphasized upon countering PLAAF in somewhat same way as too, we need to have more air defense systems to form an entire layer of protection on the border against any Chinese misadventure.

Let's wait for Brahmos II (Which Will reportedly have near hypersonic speed). This is the Ashm that we ideally need to deter PLAN.
 
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