China preventing UN action on Libya

[captonjohn]

Veto-wielding member China is blocking UN Security Council action on Libya while the United States has yet to define its position, French Foreign Minister Alain Juppe said Tuesday.

"If today we are stuck, it's not only because Europe is impotent, it's because at the Security Council, for now, China doesn't want any mention of a resolution leading to the international community's interference in a country's affairs," he said.

"Never mind that there's European impotence, but what about American power? What about Russian power? What's China's power over Libya?" Juppe told the parliamentary foreign affairs committee.

Juppe spoke after hosting Group of Eight counterparts in Paris who issued a statement dropping proposals for military intervention in Libya and turned to the UN Security Council to increase the pressure on leader Moamer Kadhafi.

A French and British drive to impose a no-fly zone over Libya failed to win around the United States, Russia and other European Union powers, notably Germany. China was absent from the meeting but is opposed to a no-fly zone.

"Russia is evolving and the Americans haven't yet defined their position on Libya," Juppe said.

Source: Defence Talk

 

[amoy]

failed to win around the United States, Russia and other European Union powers, notably Germany. China was absent from the meeting but is opposed to a no-fly zone.

interesting the US isn't there backing no-fly zone. France is headstrong this round

 

[captonjohn]

The whole UN & UNSC became impotent in this matter including US, Britain etc. Libya needs immediate military support, arms but they fear to help them. Gaddafi's forces are killing their people and now republic forces fighting against Gaddafi is losing this battle because of air force raid on them and UNSC is still thinking whether they should make Libya no fly zone or not?

US is fearing to interfere being afraid to get another Iraq and China is taking advantage of this. Chinese are delaying UNSC process to help Libya to give Gaddafi enough time to defeat his opponent force. Everyone has eyes but NO balls to do anything.

 

[amoy]

In another thread "France formally recognises Libya's rebels " Pmitra has made valid points that it's more like a "tribal" war than a dictator-vs-"the people" one.

Its tricky to single out China in UNSC as blocking "UN actions" since the Germany...Russia...and... in addition to the US are not supporting the no-fly zone either.

 

[badguy2000]

well,let the great France and MR. Armand's brave fellow Frenchmen go their way alone......Chinese just want to stand by watching the performance of french guys.

 

[badguy2000]

The whole UN & UNSC became impotent in this matter including US, Britain etc. Libya needs immediate military support, arms but they fear to help them. Gaddafi's forces are killing their people and now republic forces fighting against Gaddafi is losing this battle because of air force raid on them and UNSC is still thinking whether they should make Libya no fly zone or not?



US is fearing to interfere being afraid to get another Iraq and China is taking advantage of this. Chinese are delaying UNSC process to help Libya to give Gaddafi enough time to defeat his opponent force. Everyone has eyes but NO balls to do anything.

why should China be responsible to the affairs in Lybia ,thousands of miles away from CHina....?
CCP does quite well ,because they succeeded in bailing the CHinese cizitens out of the mess there...

WHat Chinese government should do with Lybia next should be to take over oil fileds and orders as possible as it can for CHinese people,instead of wasting time protecting the "human rights" in Lybia.

the duty of CHinese government is to chase the interest of CHina,instead of the interest of west countries or Lybia.

if west guys were really to love democracy,why don't they provent Saudis and UAE suppressing the "democracy protest" in Bahrain?

So. PLS stop hypocritical double standard....it makes me sick.

 

[Virendra]

well,let the great France and MR. Armand's brave fellow Frenchmen go their way alone......Chinese just want to stand by watching the performance of french guys.

For God sake, this isn't a WWF match for you to watch with your sarcasm. People are dying and countries are turning to ruins.
The only point of debate should be - what is the threshold for the international community to say "ok enough, its time to interfere and settle the dust before everything is in rubbles" ...
This isn't merely a power struggle at the top that we could just assume "its their inhouse issue, let them solve it".
It is not about the french men, a nation is in jeopardy, that is what calls for action. If not, then demolish UN, UNSC, WHO and every such body - there is no purpose of them .. there is no purpose of the term "international community".

Regards,
Virendra

 

[badguy2000]

For God sake, this isn't a WWF match for you to watch with your sarcasm. People are dying and countries are turning to ruins.
The only point of debate should be - what is the threshold for the international community to say "ok enough, its time to interfere and settle the dust before everything is in rubbles" ...
This isn't merely a power struggle at the top that we could just assume "its their inhouse issue, let them solve it".
It is not about the french men, a nation is in jeopardy, that is what calls for action. If not, then demolish UN, UNSC, WHO and every such body - there is no purpose of them .. there is no purpose of the term "international community".

Regards,
Virendra

you are sooooo naive....UN is never a organization to save the ass of someone in need, but one to legalize the rule of major powers on the earth.

 

[pmaitra]

you are sooooo naive....UN is never a organization to save the ass of someone in need, but one to legalize the rule of major powers on the earth.

Indeed, and assuming this report is true, you must be feeling mighty elated that PRC is now a superpower not constricted to Asia anymore.

Fancy a cuppa tea mate?

 

[JBH22]

China is surely playing safe with all EU powers naively supporting the rebels they might have lost Gaddafi preference when giving oil contracts chinese can step in however to say that in the event Gaddafi wins that he'll turn his back onto the west is far too simplistic he needs them.

 

[pmaitra]

Excerpts from another thread:

Q: What happens if the rebels win?

It depends on the circumstances of the victory, but the most likely scenario is that there will be some kind of temporary constitution and a framework put in place for elections as has been the case in Egypt and Tunisia.

Due to the unpopularity of the regime it appears unlikely that the former Gaddafi ministers will take part in any new government. This poses a potential problem as there is a shortage of experienced officials who are not sullied by links to Col Gaddafi. The Libyan diaspora could have a crucial part to play in any interim period, as many are expected to return to rebuild the country should Col Gaddafi fall.

Q: What happens if Col Gaddafi wins?

Col Gaddafi has said that the outcome of the struggle will be all-or-nothing so it is expected that he will only be able to remain in power through brute force rather than a process of negotiation.

In the event of Col Gaddafi prevailing, there are fears that there could be a purge of all individuals involved - or suspected of involvement - in the uprising, especially defectors from the regime. In the past, Col Gaddafi has publicly executed opponents and aired the footage on state TV.

Internationally, Col Gaddafi would find himself even more isolated than he was during the 1990s. The international community has all but forsaken him and is likely to impose heavy sanctions on Libya and seize Libyan assets abroad.

Another factor is the newly revolutionary status of two of Libya's neighbours, Tunisia and Egypt. Col Gaddafi explicitly supported both Zine El Abidine Ben Ali and Hosni Mubarak, which is unlikely to endear him to either country.

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12719557

Commentary:

• red - Why Europe sees incentive in supporting the anti-Gaddafi faction. They can install Libyans living in Europe in the new government, have strings attached and seek participation in the oil revenue on favourable terms.
• blue - Purges and executions will destroy yet another wave of protesters who dared challenge Gaddafi. This will strengthen his grip on Libya. Subsequently, he will be subjected to sanctions and criticism and perhaps boycott by the self-styled moral policemen, such as, USA, UK (wherever US goes, UK follows like a bleating lamb) and France. Russia will try to continue negotiations on defense deals, triggering concerns in the West, and will use them as political tools to extract concessions from the West. PRC will jump in to support Gaddafi, and probably secure another energy source. Of course, Gaddafi, now isolated, will befriend anyone who shows some 'kindness' and for PRC, 'end justifies the means' - a typical you-scratch-my-back-and-I-scratch-your-back scenario.

 

[Virendra]

you are sooooo naive....UN is never a organization to save the ass of someone in need, but one to legalize the rule of major powers on the earth.

That may be the way UN is being used today which is condemnable but it certainly isn't the purpose of UN to legalize major powers rule on earth.
UN is supposed to represent every country on the planet. However we're not talking about UN here and my post isn't pointing to UN specifically. I'm only notionally attacking the existence of all the world bodies if they cannot prevent atrocities and destruction in the members nations. Libya is proving to be a more violent revolution than Egypt and Tunisia.

Regards,
Virendra

 

[badguy2000]

you are sooooo naive....UN is never a organization to save the ass of someone in need, but one to legalize the rule of major powers on the earth.

well, CHina is not superpower ,because its per capital nominal GDP is only 1/10 of USA's....

However, CHina would not call itself a "superpower" ,either,even if its per capital GDP were to 10 times of USA's..
Just as CCP bosses blah...CHina was ,is and will be a one of the thrid world for ever.....however developed CHina is.

 

[captonjohn]

why should China be responsible to the affairs in Lybia ,thousands of miles away from CHina....?
CCP does quite well ,because they succeeded in bailing the CHinese cizitens out of the mess there...

WHat Chinese government should do with Lybia next should be to take over oil fileds and orders as possible as it can for CHinese people,instead of wasting time protecting the "human rights" in Lybia.

the duty of CHinese government is to chase the interest of CHina,instead of the interest of west countries or Lybia.

if west guys were really to love democracy,why don't they provent Saudis and UAE suppressing the "democracy protest" in Bahrain?

So. PLS stop hypocritical double standard....it makes me sick.

Not exactly, but if china blocks the sanction to make no fly zone in Libya then he will be responsible for that. At present we all are responsible for that bloody killing of innocent people because we fear to do anything. The reason why we suspect Chinese intention because china has already blocked such reports from internet search and keeps filtering all this type of news from Libya.

Might CCP fears that his people can get inspiration from this and start protesting Chinese government. We do not ring the bell for democracy but at least people must be saved from killing by their own rulers.

And I didn't got how you get my point double standard?

 

[captonjohn]

After looking this incident and western countries impotent behavior on the name of wait and watch I'm getting the feel that UN now has become useless. That is if any country facing civil war or any attack from its neighbors then UN won't be able to do anything. So instead of blindly believing on UN India should focus on itself in all situations and should not repeat the mistakes which were done by our previous rulers like Nehru.

It's time to throw out the illusion of UN's ability and effectiveness while solving regional issues.

 

[badguy2000]

Not exactly, but if china blocks the sanction to make no fly zone in Libya then he will be responsible for that. At present we all are responsible for that bloody killing of innocent people because we fear to do anything. The reason why we suspect Chinese intention because china has already blocked such reports from internet search and keeps filtering all this type of news from Libya.

Might CCP fears that his people can get inspiration from this and start protesting Chinese government. We do not ring the bell for democracy but at least people must be saved from killing by their own rulers.

And I didn't got how you get my point double standard?

what a naive self-given angel! you are just another Kickok in the forum....guy, you are on the earth.......In international politics, only Jungle principle can work and there is no room for morality highland...

 

[Armand2REP]

why should China be responsible to the affairs in Lybia ,thousands of miles away from CHina....?
CCP does quite well ,because they succeeded in bailing the CHinese cizitens out of the mess there...

Out of the 30,000 Chinese migrant workers, 29,250 had left before the bailout began. CCP didn't have much work to do with two charter flights only. I didn't see China helping non-Chinese while France was ferrying thousands of Egyptians by land and sea bridges back home on 6 flights a day and Mistral carting several trips to Egypt. China had the PLN's Xuzhou off the coast that did nothing.

WHat Chinese government should do with Lybia next should be to take over oil fileds and orders as possible as it can for CHinese people,instead of wasting time protecting the "human rights" in Lybia.

If CCP doesn't care about Libyan people, they should abstain from a UNSC vote and sit quietly in the corner.

the duty of CHinese government is to chase the interest of CHina,instead of the interest of west countries or Lybia.

The duty of a UNSC member is to help people, not sit idly by and block efforts to help people.

if west guys were really to love democracy,why don't they provent Saudis and UAE suppressing the "democracy protest" in Bahrain?

Saudi troops are protecting installations, not conflicting with protesters. It is a far cry from what your stooge Gaddafi is doing.

So. PLS stop hypocritical double standard....it makes me sick.

There is no hypocrisy but a clear distinction, China doesn't do anything to help anyone but themselves while France goes out of its way to help people not their own.

 

[Virendra]

In international politics, only Jungle principle can work and there is no room for morality highland...

I can see where we are going if China leads the way ....... TO THE JUNGLE !!

 

[AirforcePilot]

The whole UN & UNSC became impotent in this matter including US, Britain etc. Libya needs immediate military support, arms but they fear to help them. Gaddafi's forces are killing their people and now republic forces fighting against Gaddafi is losing this battle because of air force raid on them and UNSC is still thinking whether they should make Libya no fly zone or not?

US is fearing to interfere being afraid to get another Iraq and China is taking advantage of this. Chinese are delaying UNSC process to help Libya to give Gaddafi enough time to defeat his opponent force. Everyone has eyes but NO balls to do anything.

The U.S. wants no part of the mess in Libya. The people want democracy and they must fight and unfortunately die to get it. Most country's want us to take the lead and set up the no-fly zone. Let other country's take the lead and conduct the no-fly zone. If we use our military in Libya we will look like the bad guys. Let France and Germany do the dirty work for once.

 

[Virendra]

Agree to the reasoning but are they as capable and efficient in doing it as the US?
Perhaps if China joined it would've made a difference. It isn't a secret that they have interests vested in Libya.