Buddhism in India

salmanov

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Buddhism lost the battle because of predominantly two things.

1.Destruction of state sponsored buddhism (started with Pusyamitra sunga killing brahdrata)
2.Work done by Adi Shankara who is also called as Prachanna Buddha( Buddha in disguise)
Did anyone know how to become Buddhist in India??
 

Sigmamale101

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Buddhism lost the battle because of predominantly two things.

1.Destruction of state sponsored buddhism (started with Pusyamitra sunga killing brahdrata)
2.Work done by Adi Shankara who is also called as Prachanna Buddha( Buddha in disguise)
Pushyamitra sunga never killed any Buddhist, it's a myth. You must be talking about Pushyamitra Maurya.
 

Tshering22

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Did anyone know how to become Buddhist in India??
Depends on which path and where you are getting ordained.

There is no formal method except being ordained at any of the major monasteries. Once you go there, you will first be explained and asked why you want to become a Buddhist (Tantra or otherwise, that's up to you). Then the monks will explain to you about our philosophy. If you are lucky (and have time), you might get to spend the day with the monks; usually about 2-3 days.

After that, the head Abbott will ordain you with the prayers early in the morning. You then may choose to keep a Sanskrit name (it is usually not applicable to Hindus, Sikhs, etc., since they pretty much have the same names anyway) and get your name changed on the legal documents.

If it is what you want, I would advise you to get ordained in a monastery in either Dharmsala (Himachal Pradesh), my home state Sikkim, or in Tawang (Arunachal Pradesh).

You will find a breed of so-called Buddhists who are Hindu-haters. These people are called Ambedkarites and are a political movement of fanatics (like BLM extremists), who have nothing to do with real Buddhism.

Tip: Avoid them like the plague. They aren't real Buddhists by any means.
 

warriorextreme

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Pushyamitra sunga never killed any Buddhist, it's a myth. You must be talking about Pushyamitra Maurya.
I wrote that post 8 years ago :O

Read it again :) I have not written that he killed Buddhists. I have written that he killed Brahdrata (Brihadratha Maurya). It is believed that he put a stop to the state patronage of Buddhism. However Buddhists (without much proof) believe that he persecuted Buddhist of that time.
 

LurkerBaba

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It is what you want, I would advise you to get ordained in a monastery in either Dharmsala (Himachal Pradesh), my home state Sikkim, or in Tawang (Arunachal Pradesh).
I feel Mahayana (Tibet, Japan etc) sect of Buddhism is more platable to Indian tastes. Beautiful and quite similar in flavour to mainstream Hinduism

Theravada sect (Sri Lanka etc) is very dry.
 

LurkerBaba

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I wrote that post 8 years ago :O

Read it again :) I have not written that he killed Buddhists. I have written that he killed Brahdrata (Brihadratha Maurya). It is believed that he put a stop to the state patronage of Buddhism. However Buddhists (without much proof) believe that he persecuted Buddhist of that time.
That's what I thought too since it's apparently "common knowledge"

But if you actually read Buddhist texts, some of the most sophisticated and refined stuff like Avatamsaka Sutra was composed much later after the 3rd century AD - i.e Gupta Empire time which was considered "Hindu"

Buddhism enjoyed elite patronage until their centres of learning were destroyed. I mean there aren't even copies of these sutras left in India. All burnt down. Only Tibetan and Chinese copies exist.
 
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Tshering22

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I feel Mahayana (Tibet, Japan etc) sect of Buddhism is more platable to Indian tastes. Beautiful and quite similar in flavour to mainstream Hinduism

Theravada sect (Sri Lanka etc) is very dry.
It is not about Theravada but about the way it is practised. For example, Theravada is also the official faith in Vietnam (their communism is only a political structure). Sri Lankan style is a bit rigid, somewhat like a hybrid between, say, Hindu Dharma & Christianity. The festival style is very Indic, but the way their society is structured is pretty hard.
 

LurkerBaba

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Actually pure form of Buddhism is too good to be practical but they did helped in spread of dharma , so we can't disregard them completely
Buddhism is great for the modern, urban world. Buddha had a similar upbringing (prince, luxury etc). It attempts to solve a very hard problem - how do you uphold Dharma in the face of materialism and loss of bhakti
 

Love Charger

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Buddhism is great for the modern, urban world. Buddha had a similar upbringing (prince, luxury etc). It attempts to solve a very hard problem - how do you uphold Dharma in the face of materialism and loss of bhakti
Sir please elaborate more on this point of view
 

LurkerBaba

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Sir please elaborate more on this point of view
Basically, as wealth and comforts increase people become materialists and lean towards atheism and even nihilism. How do you encourage ethical behaviour in such situations? How do you calm your mind with infinite distractions and without belief in "god" ?

Buddhism has answers to these. Either due to ignorance or/and annoying Ambedkarites, Indians are largely unaware of Buddhist philosophy.
 
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gajapati

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Charvaka materialist vs buddhist philosophy -

Charvaka says there is different source of pleasure and pain .. One should attempt to maximize the pleasure .

Buddhist - Composite things decay . World is in flux . Nothing lasts . Even pleasure is temporary . Pleasure is enjoyable but when its gone you feel pain .. You also feel the pain of anxiety of loosing pleasure when it is there .. Buddhist philosophy begins with pessimism and move towards a new paradigm towards life where there is freedom from reward based mechanism we all are dictated by ..

Will write some interesting philosphical views of buddhism in my free time .. Specially pratityasamutpada .
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Basically, as wealth and comforts increase people become materialists and lean towards atheism and even nihilism. How do you encourage ethical behaviour in such situations? How do you calm your mind with infinite distractions and without belief in "god" ?

Buddhism has answers to these. Either due to ignorance or/and annoying Ambedkarites, Indians are largely unaware of Buddhist philosophy.
Big Bhrata don't you think those parallels are already there in Dharma. There is nothing new which Buddha taught only but rejection of an unchanging eternal self viz Ishvara and Atma. Despite all internal diversities within the schools of Dharma the Buddha Sikh and Jain have acknowledged the laws of Karma.

This is actually very celestial tier discussion.



I think you already know what led to the decline of Buddhistic thoughts simply answer is in their total failures to produce any Maharana Pratap or Shivaji Maharaj or Chandragupta Mauryas :).
 

LurkerBaba

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Big Bhrata don't you think those parallels are already there in Dharma. There is nothing new which Buddha taught only but rejection of an unchanging eternal self viz Ishvara and Atma. Despite all internal diversities within the schools of Dharma the Buddha Sikh and Jain have acknowledged the laws of Karma.

This is actually very celestial tier discussion.

That's a huge innovation. Rejection of an "ultimate reality" and having a somewhat nihilistic outlook, but with ethics is radical. In the modern urban world would you rather have a bunch of people who're woke or Buddhists with belief in Karma, reincarnation etc ?

I think you already know what led to the decline of Buddhistic thoughts simply answer is in their total failures to produce any Maharana Pratap or Shivaji Maharaj or Chandragupta Mauryas :).
Buddhism had already declined by the time of Maharana Pratap, Shivaji etc. But this argument of Buddhism loosing because it was "peaceful" doesn't hold up to scrutiny. Forget India, look abroad. Are the Buddhists in Myanmar and Sri Lanka "peaceful" ? Buddhism, unlike Hinduism is tied to state power. If the state is powerful, then Buddhism is a force multiplier. The Buddhist Sangha is generally close to the military. More on this here https://defenceforumindia.com/threads/buddhism-in-india.54561/page-3#post-2065989

In the "RW" Buddhism gets a bad name because of Ambekarites and Marxist professors who associate everything good in Indian civ with Buddhism and everything bad with Hinduism. People get defensive. Lets start owning it instead. Its part of our philosophy and a few Navayana LARPers cant change it
 
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asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Yes and no. That whole "Buddhism lost because of non violence" is BS. Buddhism was basically the belief system of elite Kshatriyas. Non violence doesn't even figure in the 4 tenents of Buddhism, this perception is because of Western hippie culture.

My understanding is that Buddhism is centralised and tied to state power, unlike Hinduism which is decentralized. If the state gets destroyed then Buddhism gets wiped out but Hinduism can survive.

However, the opposite is also true - if the state somehow survives then it's very powerful and can go toe to toe with most foes.

Just look at South East Asia, it's the Hindu kingdoms which converted to Islam. Buddhist states like Thailand, Myanmar and Vietnam have powerful and influential militaries. There's a great book "Zen at War" on how Japan effectively used Buddhism post Meiji to promote militarism.
My understanding is that when universities of Nalanda, Vikramshila, Jagaddala, Odantapuri were attacked. The monks fled away in thousands to Nepal Tibet and other places outside BHARAT. That killed Buddhism instantly. Thats exactly why I had said that buddhism failed to produce Maharana Pratap or Shivaji.

You are correct when you say Buddhism is centralised to the state power. As we know for the Hindus every Brahmin were a potential priest. No ordination was mandated as such. Every household carried on rituals viz recitation of particular Mantras pilgrimages everybody memorizing some Veda its very purpose.

By contrast, Buddhism had instituted ordination.Monasteries were supported by the people and kings like Ashoka. When support got removed buddhism fell like a pack of cards. There are more reasons certainly.

Are the Buddhists in Myanmar and Sri Lanka "peaceful" ? Buddhism, unlike Hinduism is tied to state power. If the state is powerful, than Buddhism is a force multiplier. The Buddhist Sangha is generally close to the military.
This part gets a bit of interesting. Now we have to analyze exactly how much of violence has to do with Buddhas teachings.For example at around 1600 ad approx Japanese rulers realized the threat. The threat of christianity. Infact. No pagan civilization to our knowledge ever went to the lengths that the Japanese did in crushing christianity.
How much the Buddhism has to do in this. That I am yet to see. You could enlighten in this regards.

Sri Lanka and Buddhists far from peaceful. I absolutely agree with you. Now again how much of Buddhism is responsible that I am yet to see. But I see the conflicts in Sri Lanka more in the way of interventionist modeling. There is evidence of buddhist revivals in Sri Lanka being spurred by theosophical society. Using fraud of aryan-sinhalese-buddhist identity.

You could argue for places like Vietnam too. Far from peaceful. But that is probably reactionary. Remember that yes amreekunt coup in 1960s. That toppled dinh dem who hated buddhism because he was catholic radical.

That's a huge innovation. Rejection of an "ultimate reality" and having a somewhat nihilistic outlook, but with ethics is radical. In the modern urban world would you rather have a bunch of people who're woke or Buddhists with belief in Karma, reincarnation etc ?
If you are a Buddhist then certainly I would like to have more buddhists like you.But to best of my knowledge the unadulterated version of buddhism only exists in Tibet. I have always maintained Sanatana Dharma and buddhism are closely related. For example how Buddha decided to get hold of Kevalya the Boddhisatva . The kevalya itself is part of Ashtaang Yoga and entire chapter of YOGA DARSHAN is dedicated to Kevalya which is basically MOKSHA the final goal of human existence. The difference in only acknowledging the eternal self.

I had still chose Buddhism only if they are truly into teachings of Buddha but unfortunately today the followers of buddhism have reduced all this good philosophy to a joke. This is the cost of ignoring the metaphysical aspects of Dharma because of which over time followers of Buddhism attempted a lot to solve the mysteries and answer the questions on Atman , existence etc and even went on to adopt Tantric Sadhanas and distorted them for the sake of enjoyment and comfort. The founders were great Yogis but their teachings and practices were misused by unworthy followers.
 

gajapati

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Charvaka materialist vs buddhist philosophy -

Charvaka says there is different source of pleasure and pain .. One should attempt to maximize the pleasure .

Buddhist - Composite things decay . World is in flux . Nothing lasts . Even pleasure is temporary . Pleasure is enjoyable but when its gone you feel pain .. You also feel the pain of anxiety of loosing pleasure when it is there .. Buddhist philosophy begins with pessimism and move towards a new paradigm towards life where there is freedom from reward based mechanism we all are dictated by ..

Will write some interesting philosphical views of buddhism in my free time .. Specially pratityasamutpada .
Eternalism , nihilism and budhism

Eternalism believes that some reality exist free of any condition and nihilism says everything gets annihilated ..

Buddhism with a middle path says everything conditional . All you perceive do exist but its depended on something else . And that you perceive does not get annihilated without leaving some impression .
It says everything exist for a small moment because of some condition and when that condition ends it seize to exist . Something that exist is defined as something that can leave some effect . A unreal thing like hare's horn / space castle cant leave any effect .
 

gajapati

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Eternalism , nihilism and budhism

Eternalism believes that some reality exist free of any condition and nihilism says everything gets annihilated ..

Buddhism with a middle path says everything conditional . All you perceive do exist but its depended on something else . And that you perceive does not get annihilated without leaving some impression .
It says everything exist for a small moment because of some condition and when that condition ends it seize to exist . Something that exist is defined as something that can leave some effect . A unreal thing like hare's horn / space castle cant leave any effect .
Rebirth in Hinduism vs Buddhism

In hindusim there is concept of a permanent soul which changes body like dress . In buddhism also there is concept of rebirth but its slightly different .

Buddhism does nt believe in a permanent soul or self . The birth rebirth is just the unbroken chain of consciousness . The present form of consciousness inherits the impression from the past consciousness . Its like flame . Each moment the flame is different and has its own condition of existence different from the past flame which had its own condition of existence . But yet it is a unbroken stream .

Another example is a snow ball which moves on the slope of mountain . Through its course it accumulate many particles and also sheds many particles ( read as karma ) . The snowball at the top of mountain is no more the present snow ball but there must be some impression of past snowball which is left on it .
 

asaffronladoftherisingsun

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Eternalism , nihilism and budhism

Eternalism believes that some reality exist free of any condition and nihilism says everything gets annihilated ..

Buddhism with a middle path says everything conditional . All you perceive do exist but its depended on something else . And that you perceive does not get annihilated without leaving some impression .
It says everything exist for a small moment because of some condition and when that condition ends it seize to exist . Something that exist is defined as something that can leave some effect . A unreal thing like hare's horn / space castle cant leave any effect .
Have you read Tattvopaplavasiṃha of Ajnana a Charvaka skepticist philosopher?
 

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