Avalanche buries Pakistani soldiers near Siachen

KS

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I still wonder though, why there were so many of them gathered in one place? I am not familiar with military deployments so I do not know if this is routine, but knowing the Pakis, can't help but think that perhaps they were planning some major for the coming spring/summer to

a) Boost their own moral

b) Divert attention from all the uncomfortable questions that are being asked of the all powerful army

c) Nothing unites that sorry excuse of a country than anti-India rhetoric.
Looks like it was the Battalion HQ and it was always normal for about 90 people to be there..
 

KS

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^^

This is also an opportunity for the US to get a closer feel of GB, do a recce while doing rescue work and gather more information about the terrain, Pakistan's military installations, the mood of the locals and to gauge whatever PLA is doing there.
Nothing that their mil-sats could not detect.

Also a 8 member alpine rescue team surrounded always by PA soldiers would be the last ones to gather any such things.
 

Awesome

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The Himalayas are young mountains and have not settled in.

These are common happenings.

One wonders how come a Battalion HQ was not sited to ensure that it is not bang next to a mountain. HQs are not directly in battle i.e. eyeball to eyeball. Small plateaux are always available. However, maybe there was some operational reasons when it has be located so.

All that same it is very unfortunate.

It is a horrid way to die.

I have experienced effects of such avalanches and when the bodies are found, often when the snow melts during the summer, the bodies putrefy and are full of pitmarks where the stones and boulders have hit the body.

While some may rejoice that Pakistani are dead, one should also remember that they are but human beings and it is one of the most horrid way to die.

Some may also say that Pakistanis would not have sympathised.

That may be true.

But Indians have more sensibilities and sensitivity than many.
If I am stupid not to use my tactical knowledge and field craft and instead expose myself as if I am a film star on the ramp, then I should get a bullet to teach me a lesson.

I cannot explain it to you. You all feel that those who are on an eyeball to eyeball situation should show the attitude that you all show. That is not so in actual life.

They are doing their duty and we are doing ours.

A combat confrontation is different from a peacetime natural catastrophe.

Even in a war, after ceasefire, we allowed Pakistanis to collect their dead in the minefields when they were mowed down during an attack in the war.

Given the temperament being shown, we should have shot them while they were collecting their dead, right?

Now, if the chaps were buried under an avalanche, someone will take their place. There will be no tangible advantage in anyway.

Does it in anyway put India in a better place that will not be changed within a few days and status quo restored?

Why should they abandon their post just because a rear HQ has been wiped out? They are stocked to take on a war as also for the winter. For the post, their operational efficiency is in no way affected.

Sorry, it proves that we have some human sensibilities that those who have never fought a war, will not understand.

However, if one gets malevolent glee out of Pakistanis dying, then it a different issue.
Ray,

Much appreciation, respect and love for the comments on this thread. Many people took notice and actually pointed me here to read about it.
 

Tolaha

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Ray,

Much appreciation, respect and love for the comments on this thread. Many people took notice and actually pointed me here to read about it.
Asim Aquil,
I remember this quite well, in a thread on PDF long time back, you were the one who advocated that Pakistan must nuke India! That you were fine with Indian nuclear retaliation that would obliterate Pakistan... as long as enough Indians perished! Do you remember that argument of yours?

You have no business appreciating Ray's comments as his views/opinions are in complete contrast to what you believe in! Ray is a soldier and a humanitarian.... you probably are neither!
 

one

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Ray,

Much appreciation, respect and love for the comments on this thread. Many people took notice and actually pointed me here to read about it.
I know one thing if this would have happened to Indians then there would have been a shortfall of sweets on the shelves in Pakistan. I never enjoyed nor did i pity them, just had a bottle of beer.
 

Shredder

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Captain Kalia and his men were in their captivity for over twenty-two (May 15, 1999 – June 7, 1999) days and subjected to unprecedented brutal torture as evident from their bodies handed over by Pakistan Army on June 9, 1999.The postmortem revealed that the Pakistan army had indulged in brutal acts of torture by burning their bodies with cigarettes, piercing ear-drums with hot rods, puncturing eyes before removing them, breaking most of the teeth and bones, fractured skull, cutting the lips, chipping of nose, chopping off limbs and private organs of these soldiers besides inflicting all sorts of physical and mental tortures and finally shooting them dead, as evidenced by the bullet wound to the temple. The postmortem report also confirmed that injuries were inflicted ante mortem (before death)

On June 9, 1999, NK Kalia had received the body of his son, Captain Saurabh Kalia, handed over by the Pakistani army to Indian army commanders at the Kargil sector, with evidence of torture
Peace to these sorts of pigs? May they die a slow and painful death!!

And to the Indians here with all your RIP bullshit, remember what this effing nation has done and what it is continuing to do.
 
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utubekhiladi

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By Ajai Shukla
Business Standard, 30th May 11

On a moonless night in Siachen, in May 1987, Second Lieutenant Rajiv Pande's thirteen-man patrol silently climbed towards Quaid Post, a 21,153-feet high pinnacle near the crucial Bilafond La pass that was held by 17 Pakistani soldiers. Quaid had to be captured and Pande was fixing ropes on the near-vertical, 1500-feet ice wall just below the post, to assist a larger follow-on force in making a physical assault. As the jawans fixed the ropes, gasping for breath in that oxygen-depleted altitude, the Pakistani sentries just a few hundred feet above heard them. Gunfire rang out killing nine Indian soldiers, including Pande. But the four survivors could tell their unit, 8 Jammu & Kashmir Light Infantry (8 JAK LI), that the ropes were fixed.

Capturing Quaid post was vital being the only Pakistani post that dominated key Indian positions at Bilafond La. Realising its importance, Pakistan named it after Qaid-e-Azam Mohammad Ali Jinnah. The post, commanded by Subedar Ataullah Mohammed, was held by commandoes from the elite Special Services Group.

With the ropes in place, 8 JAK LI helicoptered an assault team to Bilafond La. Since the Cheetah helicopter can only ferry a single passenger in those extreme heights, and because of frequent blizzards, it took 25 days for the team to gather. On 23rd June, sixty-four soldiers, commanded by Major Virendar Singh, began the attack, all night they searched in waist-deep snow for the rope fixed by Pande's patrol. Unable to find it, they fell back to base.

The next night a silent cheer went up as the rope was found. In single file, with their rifles slung across their backs, the first section (10 men) started the ascent to Quaid, crossing en route the bodies of Pande and his patrol, still roped together in death. Halfway up, the Pakistani defenders spotted them and opened a murderous fire. Pinned to the ice wall and unable to fire back --- their weapons had suffered "cold arrest", jammed solid from the minus 25 degree cold --- the assault team sheltered in craters formed by artillery shells. There they spent the entire day exposed, frozen, hungry and under Pakistani fire.

At nightfall on the 25th, the attack began anew. Now the neighbouring Indian posts ---Sonam and Amar --- also fired at Quaid, supplementing an artillery barrage. But each metre gained was paid for in blood; every Indian casualty needed four comrades to ferry him down. A brief rest, a cup of tea, and the four helpers were thrown back into battle.

"By any measure, we should have dropped from exhaustion", said Major Virendar Singh, describing the events to Business Standard. "But Pande had to be avenged, and the relentless firing from Quaid reminded us of what we had to do."

By daybreak on the 26th, it became evident that capturing Quaid post would need a daylight frontal assault. With the entire army brass' attention riveted on this unfolding drama, the brigade commander, Brigadier Chandan Nugyal, radioed Virendar, promising him fire support from every artillery gun in range if he could finish the job.

"I knew we would not last another night on a bar of 5-Star chocolate. We fixed the attack for noon", says Virendar.

After a massive barrage of artillery fire, Virendar closed onto the post with his 8-man assault party. Simultaneously, another small team outflanked Quaid from below and cut the ropes that the Pakistanis used. Subedar Mohammad knew the game was up. Four defenders jumped off the post, preferring instant death in the abyss below to being shot or bayoneted in combat. The two who remaining were quickly killed. By 3 p.m. the Indian assault party staggered onto Quaid.

"We had no strength to celebrate. At 21,000 feet, nobody does the bhangra, yells war cries, or hoists the tricolour. Ultimately, sheer doggedness wins. If we had once hesitated, Quaid would still be with Pakistan," recounts Virendar. An admiring army awarded a Param Vir Chakra to Naib Subedar Bana Singh of the assault party and renamed Quaid post Bana Top; and a Maha Vir Chakra and 7 Vir Chakras to other bravehearts of 12 JAK LI. Virendar, who was severely wounded by an artillery shell after Quaid post was captured, won a Vir Chakra, as did Lieutenant Pande.

Indian posts across Siachen, like Bana Top, many of them won at similar cost, will be on the negotiating table today and tomorrow, as the defence secretaries of India and Pakistan meet for the 12th round of dialogue to resolve the Siachen dispute. The Pakistan Army --- for whom Siachen represents a stinging defeat at the hands of the Indian Army --- wants to erase that memory by "demilitarising" Siachen. It wants both sides to vacate their positions and pull back to an agreed line, well short of the glacier. But the Indian Army has little trust for its Pakistani counterpart after the Kargil intrusion and years of fighting terrorism. It asks: how do we know that Pakistan will not reoccupy Siachen after we withdraw? How can you assure us that we will not have to capture Bana Top again?

During 11 previous rounds of dialogue New Delhi had demanded a signed map from Pakistan, showing its forward troop locations, as a prerequisite for a Siachen settlement. Pakistan demurs, ostensibly because that would "legitimise" India's "intrusion" into Siachen. Rawalpindi's refusal to authenticate its positions has scuttled all previous dialogue. The reason for that reluctance, the Indian Army believes, is that a signed map would clearly show how badly Pakistan was beaten in Siachen. Although Pakistan terms it "the Siachen dispute", its forward-most positions cannot even see the glacier. From 13th April 1984, when an all-volunteer Indian force was helicoptered to the Bilafond La pass, India's complete control of the Saltoro Ridge has shut Pakistan out of Siachen.

Over the years, at enormous cost in dead and injured, the Indian Army has developed enormous skill at surviving at "super altitudes". In the 1980s, casualties from frostbite and altitude sickness ran in the hundreds. By the end of the last decade, they were down to 20-22 per year. During the last eight years, nobody has died. Today, barely 10-12 soldiers are evacuated annually.

Prime Minister Manmohan Singh has termed Siachen "a mountain of peace", and has tended to view it as a bargaining chip in the larger dialogue process with Pakistan. For the Indian Army, though, Siachen symbolises a superhuman feat of arms, sustained over decades. Generals today recall that the blood-soaked capture of the strategic Haji Pir Pass in 1965 was undone at the negotiating table in Tashkent. And many wonder whether history is about to repeat itself.

Broadsword: Army watches as Siachen dialogue resumes
 

Blackwater

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Ray,

Much appreciation, respect and love for the comments on this thread. Many people took notice and actually pointed me here to read about it.
Your presence here confirms thousands of Pakistanis as guest members on this forum.


Glad u guys r watching our views on this forum.:lol::lol::lol::rofl::rofl:
 

pankaj nema

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In the aftermath of this avalanche there is so much grief in Pakistan

The whole country is drowned in sorrow right now

For them loosing thousands of soldiers at the hands of the Taliban is OK

But loosing 135 soldiers in SIachen is a disaster because INDIA has WON Siachen
and India has started this fight

India is being cursed and abused in all possible ways

God help these completely mad people
 

pmaitra

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Guys, don't get too emotional about these things. Those people who tortured Saurabh Kalia and Co., were probably fanatic nutheads from outside Gilgit-Baltistan. Do not forget, NLI is cheap cannon fodder for Pak Army. Our ultimate goal is to recover PoK and GB, and we need to befriend any ethnic group that is upset or displeased with how the Pakistani State is treating them.

Divide and fragment the enemy, weaken the enemy by making them fight each other, reduce your enemy count by making the less lethal fragments your friend, find potential allies among the enemy, and then dismember this sorry excuse of a nation!
 

mayfair

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Guys, don't get too emotional about these things. Those people who tortured Saurabh Kalia and Co., were probably fanatic nutheads from outside Gilgit-Baltistan. Do not forget, NLI is cheap cannon fodder for Pak Army. Our ultimate goal is to recover PoK and GB, and we need to befriend any ethnic group that is upset or displeased with how the Pakistani State is treating them.

Divide and fragment the enemy, weaken the enemy by making them fight each other, reduce your enemy count by making the less lethal fragments your friend, find potential allies among the enemy, and then dismember this sorry excuse of a nation!
To be honest, all we know is that his patrol was ambushed by an NLI team/lashkar and it was they who tortured our men. While, we cannot say for certain if the ambush party included outsiders, considering the information that has since come out about NLI- a former paramilitary force consisting almost entirely of recruits from G-B region, commanded by a few "outsiders", one may assume with reasonable conviction that the men who tortured Saurabh Kalia and his patrol, most certainly included soldiers from the G-B region.

I'll fish out some videos where some of these NLI soldiers (if you search for interview with an NLI Havaldar/sepoy Feroz Khan on youtube, you may find one) were interviewed on Paki channels and they were as proud as any Paki in claiming to have killed Hindu soldiers. I think it would be foolish to view them as allies. Useful idiots? Yes. Allies? I'll be very cautious on that front.
 

Maharana

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Even if they believe that the Indian Army was behind it, I would support my army and wold congratulate on the commendable job they did. Its a war. A war that these Pakis started in 47. Kashmir is not their territory, they are the occupiers, and they should be thrown out, whenever we can, wherever they are, by any means necessary. Kashmir, all of it, is ours. They have no business here.
 
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Blackwater

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paki TOTA AT burfani TODA :rofl::rofl::rofl::laugh::laugh:

 
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Blackwater

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2 weeks pass by not a single body found height of nikamapan and lazypan by gazi army:scared2::scared2::taunt1::taunt1::taunt1:
 

Neil

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Pakistan avalanche search hampered by toxic gases

ISLAMABAD — Pakistan authorities said on Tuesday toxic gases were hampering the search for 138 people buried by an avalanche at a high-altitude army camp, as teams from the United States and Norway arrived at the site to help operations.
A huge wall of snow crashed into the remote Siachen Glacier base high in the mountains in disputed Kashmir more than a week ago, smothering an area of one square kilometre (a third of a square mile).
Rescuers have dug tunnels in the hard mass of snow and ice to try to reach the buried soldiers and civilians at the Gayari base, but toxic gases have built up inside one of them, the military said in a statement.
A rise in the temperature has increased the risk of further snow slides, the statement said, forcing workers on the site to take extra precautions.
Specialist teams from Norway and the United States arrived at Gayari, while Swiss and German teams have returned home after helping the efforts.
Search teams are looking for the trapped soldiers and civilians at six different points on the site, around 4,000 metres (13,000 feet) up in the mountains.
More than 450 rescuers are working at the site near the de facto border with India in the militarised region of Kashmir, though experts have said there is virtually no chance of finding any survivors.
Kashmir has been the cause of two wars between India and Pakistan and the nuclear-armed rivals fought over Siachen in 1987, though guns on the glacier have largely fallen silent since a peace process began in 2004.


AFP: Pakistan avalanche search hampered by toxic gases

toxic gas...?? we talking like nerve gas or something....?
 

SLASH

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How safe are our soldiers on these mountains? We should consider all precautionary measures and learn from the neighbours mistakes.
 

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