ADA Tejas Mark-II/Medium Weight Fighter

samsaptaka

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Unlike FGFA the aircraft in MRFA are very real,
Indeed. But, their cost is unreal for a relatively poor country like Bharath. Hence cancel MRFA and order larger no.s of relatively cheaper LCA Mk2 and AMCA. Quantity has a quality of its own. Learn from chinks
 

DeadCritic

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I think he is legit Kuntal, who participated my some DRDO competition and did well.
Also, his work is well appreciated by many well-known people including Indranil sir.

He is not directly involved with defense but I believe he definitely has some contacts as he recently mentioned he requested someone to acquire data for more accurate 3D art of Mk2 and AMCA.

See the people following him from my profile perspective.

1660719409871.png
 

IndianHawk

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Eagerly waiting for mk2 roll out.
Nothing major is happening these days. No missile tests due to mansoon.

Russian war is going in ultra slow motion.

Chinkies as usual did nothing in Taiwan.

No new news about anything.

We need mk2 roll out to start rabid discussion again 😑😶😐
 

pipebomb

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Wouldn't it be better if mk2 goes mk1a's way, meaning no rollout direct first flight.
 

samsaptaka

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Actually Mk2 is the exact form of LCA IAF wanted. But we force feed them Mk1A instead.

Now don't think that I am anyhow against force feeding Mk1A, but the fund which would have gone for Mk2 has been rerouted to Mk1A. So next time they would obviously be sceptic of what is coming out of the stable.

So its not damage control, but just reiterating what the have considered.
We're beating around the same bush. Both HAL & IAF are at fault. HAL for usual babu slowness and govt like snail pace and IAF for expecting a very hifi fighter from the get go. Is Tejas good enough to replace aging MiG-21 ? Yes. Is it needed in large nos ? Yes. Then order it in large nos. Sadly this point or line of thinking is absent in IAF and HAL too to some extent
 

Blademaster

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You cannot get Mk2 without going through Mk1A. I mean take a look at the F-35 program. USAF willingly got Block I and II even though those blocks did not achieve even IOC status let alone FOC. Block V is the one that will achieve FOC. Same thing happened with the F-16 program. You had Block 15, 20, 30, 40/42, 50/52, etc. Same thing with the Rafale program and Typhoon program.

No it is IAF being totally unrealistic about supporting a fighter program and bringing it to fruition. Nothing happens in a vacuum. You need to provide organic support on a continual basis. That is the hard lesson that needs to be nailed into IAF brass.
 

MirageBlue

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Wouldn't it be better if mk2 goes mk1a's way, meaning no rollout direct first flight.
How can that possibly happen? Tejas Mk2 is an almost entirely new airplane, whereas the Mk1A was an upgrade to the Mk1 which could be done to a series production SP-25.

A roll-out is a very symbolic event that every OEM does for the morale of it's own employees as well as PR. Having been a part of a couple of such roll-outs (in the civil aviation sector) it's a shot in the arm for everyone involved in the program to see the airplane you've been toiling on, finally in prototype form on the tarmac or hangar.

The Tejas Mk2 will require significant amount of ground testing of all systems, avionics, landing gear, brake management systems, ECS, etc. which will take months after the roll-out. Then LSTT itself will be a big event followed by HSTT. It's first flight will be a big deal.
 
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karn

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How can that possibly happen? Tejas Mk2 is an almost entirely new airplane, whereas the Mk1A was an upgrade to the Mk1 which could be done to a series production SP-25.
The LRUs isn't it ? Aren't they validating them on the mk1A, the same that will go on the mk2? And do they have 2 teams to work on both?
 

MirageBlue

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The LRUs isn't it ? Aren't they validating them on the mk1A, the same that will go on the mk2? And do they have 2 teams to work on both?
Same? The engines are different, we have a bigger airplane in the Mk2 than the Mk1 and while several systems will be derived from those on the Mk1, they will be different in many ways and all of them need to be thoroughly tested and certified. Remember the FCS is going to be different as well thanks to the new canard control surfaces. Landing gear will be beefier, aero structures sturdier to absorb higher loads on landing. Wings are being strengthened to take much higher payload with larger number of pylons including wing tip pylons.

There are no short cuts in aerospace. It will take time.

Tejas Mk2 is an ADA driven program with HAL as the manufacturing agency. Tejas Mk1A is an HAL project.
 

johnj

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You cannot get Mk2 without going through Mk1A. I mean take a look at the F-35 program. USAF willingly got Block I and II even though those blocks did not achieve even IOC status let alone FOC. Block V is the one that will achieve FOC. Same thing happened with the F-16 program. You had Block 15, 20, 30, 40/42, 50/52, etc. Same thing with the Rafale program and Typhoon program.

No it is IAF being totally unrealistic about supporting a fighter program and bringing it to fruition. Nothing happens in a vacuum. You need to provide organic support on a continual basis. That is the hard lesson that needs to be nailed into IAF brass.
LCA is more like f18, lca mk1 is similar to f18abcd and mk2 similar to sh, and mk1a similar to f18cd aesa and sh got aesa first. Like wise mk1a getting upgrades developed for mk2/jaguar/su30mki/mig21 etc. ADA more focused on mk2 while hal upgrading mk1 with available tech.
 

samsaptaka

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Demand the perfect from domestic industry to avoid ordering the good, because phoren is best.
With that small correction, you have summed up the state of IA and IAF in a nutshell. It can as well be a tagline for them in their RFPs !
 

Blademaster

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I would disagree. In the short run, IAF is suffering because they still rely on Mig-21s and have not replaced the MIG-27s.

Unless you believe those 30-40 year old obsolete jets are better than Tejas Mk-1/1As, the air force has shot themselves in the foot thanks to their disdain for Indian products and love of phoren maal. We should have had half a dozen squadrons ordered and inducted by now, and would have cost just a few billion dollars. Woukd they be as good as the latest Gripens and Rafales? No. But they would be a match for anything the PAF has, full up squadrons and far better than what the IAF has stubbornly stuck with.

And suggesting that IAF should have waited for Tejas mj 2 is a familiar trick. Demand the perfect to avoid ordering the good, because phoren is best.
Reminds me of the Russian saying, "Better/Perfect is the enemy of good enough."
 

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