ADA Tejas Mark-II/Medium Weight Fighter

[Lonewolf]

We will have superior planes also . Rafale is already here which is decades ahead in avionics and weaponary than j20 . Amca will start flying soon.

J20 still doesn't have stealth engine .

China is just a fat lizard which is only 5-6 years ahead of us in indigenous weapons development. We are on the same tech only difference is that our indigenous products actually compete with western products and hence are much better than chinese junk.

Except their project are more and are in great number and improved block by block .


We aren't 5 6 years back ,we are almost equal in some aspects ,like airborne fcr ,but lag much behind when it comes to bomb variety ,many of project are still not complted , they have a eots , targeting pod but we haven't perfected it yet , they have some advantage but we arr catching up and need to up the game

 

[Trololo]

J20 is just a third generation plane bettered in some way. The designer of J20 was sscked by china. Su30 MKI detected J20 with PESA radar 300 km away. It is not stealth, it has the engine of 4th generation plane technology, poor radar, poor weapons. Rafale is much better than Chinese J20 and that is ehy China bought Su 35 else which country who claims to have fifth generation plane will import forth generation plane.

I never spoke about the J-20. I am speaking about J-10. I won't make any assumptions on J-20 other than saying that its skin finish looks quite good. And that shows manufacturing prowess.

 

[onlinpunit]

So what are drdo and hal doing right now , they are developing a prototype and soon it will be reality so any other issue with mr pessimist

Well Don't count your chickens until they are hatched !
so let the Prototype become a reality and then we can compare it with whatever you want till the end of days. !

 

[MirageBlue]

Well Don't count your chickens until they are hatched !
so let the Prototype become a reality and then we can compare it with whatever you want till the end of days. !

While I generally would 100% agree that it's not a good idea to compare the paper specs of a fighter still in design, versus a fighter that's been in service a few years, in this case, the Tejas Mk2 is an incremental development of a fighter.

I take it as similar to a Super Hornet evolution over the Hornet and the Saab Gripen E over the C. The Baseline designs existed, were proven and some incremental changes were made to the design but it was not a fresh design as such.

That reduces effort (although there is still a LOT of effort required) and the risk. Many of the systems are going to be carried over or modified for a larger design, weight, power or other driving requirements. But they will be evolving, not clean sheet, which is a lot riskier.

Tejas Mk2 was the lower hanging fruit of the 3 programs that ADA has currently going on..AMCA and TEDBF are much riskier.

 

[HariPrasad-1]

While I generally would 100% agree that it's not a good idea to compare the paper specs of a fighter still in design, versus a fighter that's been in service a few years, in this case, the Tejas Mk2 is an incremental development of a fighter.

I take it as similar to a Super Hornet evolution over the Hornet and the Saab Gripen E over the C. The Baseline designs existed, were proven and some incremental changes were made to the design but it was not a fresh design as such.

That reduces effort (although there is still a LOT of effort required) and the risk. Many of the systems are going to be carried over or modified for a larger design, weight, power or other driving requirements. But they will be evolving, not clean sheet, which is a lot riskier.

Tejas Mk2 was the lower hanging fruit of the 3 programs that ADA has currently going on..AMCA and TEDBF are much riskier.

Fully agree except the last paragraph.

 

[MonaLazy]

agree except the last paragraph.

So are AMCA and TEDBF within reach or is even MWF a risky proposition, which is it?

 

[Vaibhavseafarer]

I think we shouldn't take Chinese counterparts lightly.
J-10 is a very capable fighter and now they are fielding J-10 with WS-10
We'll catch soon Inshallah.

 

[Snowcat]

A lot of arm chair experts are active here these days.
No need to chat shit about Jeff and 10c, they aren't as bad as your making them out to be, especially the BLK 3 version, and frankly WVR engagements turns out more to be pilot dependent rather than that much on aircraft. Let's not undermine the enemy, Chinese pilots are pretty well trained, nevermind the numerical superiority they have over us.

 

[SARTHAK]

A lot of arm chair experts are active here these days.
No need to chat shit about Jeff and 10c, they aren't as bad as your making them out to be, especially the BLK 3 version, and frankly WVR engagements turns out more to be pilot dependent rather than that much on aircraft. Let's not undermine the enemy, Chinese pilots are pretty well trained, nevermind the numerical superiority they have over us.

i agree that j10c is not as bad as someone wud portray and numerical superiority is also true but "Chinese pilots are pretty well trained" is doubtfull

 

[Lonewolf]

i agree that j10c is not as bad as someone wud portray and numerical superiority is also true but "Chinese pilots are pretty well trained" is doubtfull

Availability could be a issue too

 

[SARTHAK]

Availability could be a issue too

the biggest thing about plaaf is the info that comes out of china is strictly controlled by ccp so comparing their planes in terms of availability,ew or radar capabilities is skeptical

 

[Lonewolf]

the biggest thing about plaaf is the info that comes out of china is strictly controlled by ccp so comparing their planes in terms of availability,ew or radar capabilities is skeptical

That's a plus point for them ,hope they export it to pakistan ,we would be able to know it's capa by then ,if they export a constricted capabilities version ,their official will cry like whores , if good then will spill some beans in open for sure

 

[Bleh]

But is that at all a requirement? TVC causes significant energy loss in a turning fight

I see you've been affected by the high-school dropout Muricans commenting on internet about energy fighting & post-stall maneuvering.
I'm not in a mood to write a 2000word explanation that would be required, but there's another way. Watch this, the difference between TVC & non-tvc jets in modern dogfight situations (note: J-10 has similar T/W ratio as Su-30 but much better high AoA lift due to being a delta. Would score a 3:0 win here):

I don't know why you assumed that IAF or PLAAF pilot's won't know what they're doing.

If you want to do a follow-up then watch J-10 aerial demonstrations before & after getting tvc.

 

[SARTHAK]

That's a plus point for them ,hope they export it to pakistan ,we would be able to know it's capa by then ,if they export a constricted capabilities version ,their official will cry like whores , if good then will spill some beans in open for sure

one thing is that ccp tries to over amplify their armedforce capabilities rather than concealing them for surprise elements

 

[Bleh]

one thing is that ccp tries to over amplify their armedforce capabilities rather than concealing them for surprise elements

Ya. New era 2day... Posturing to avoid conflict altogether is preferred nowadays.

 

[kamaal]

We are too optimistic and over confident, have paid price for that. MK2 doesn't exist whereas J-10 and J-20 have been inducted in PLAF. J-10 is matured platform, why would the chinese induct them large numbers if they are junk ? Where is our common sense ?

 

[Lonewolf]

We are too optimistic and over confident, have paid price for that. MK2 doesn't exist whereas J-10 and J-20 have been inducted in PLAF. J-10 is matured platform, why would the chinese induct them large numbers if they are junk ? Where is our common sense ?

Why they have higher crashes ? , It isn't fully junk but older version are , chinese stick to platform and improve block by block , still older version are not in small quantity

 

[MirageBlue]

A lot of arm chair experts are active here these days.
No need to chat shit about Jeff and 10c, they aren't as bad as your making them out to be, especially the BLK 3 version, and frankly WVR engagements turns out more to be pilot dependent rather than that much on aircraft. Let's not undermine the enemy, Chinese pilots are pretty well trained, nevermind the numerical superiority they have over us.

PLAAF pilots well trained? Not till a few years ago. They may have improved over the years, but earlier reports were pretty dismal about their pilot training and tactics.

 

[tsunami]

I think we shouldn't take Chinese counterparts lightly.
J-10 is a very capable fighter and now they are fielding J-10 with WS-10
We'll catch soon Inshallah.

J-10 is very capable, so much that when offered to Porks they denied it by saying it doesn't really offers much over JF-17. WS-10 can still fly in observation.

 

[Deadtrap]

I see you've been affected by the high-school dropout Muricans commenting on internet about energy fighting & post-stall maneuvering.
I'm not in a mood to write a 2000word explanation that would be required, but there's another way. Watch this, the difference between TVC & non-tvc jets in modern dogfight situations (note: J-10 has similar T/W ratio as Su-30 but much better high AoA lift due to being a delta. Would score a 3:0 win here):

I don't know why you assumed that IAF or PLAAF pilot's won't know what they're doing.

If you want to do a follow-up then watch J-10 aerial demonstrations before & after getting tvc.

No offence but I don’t know why people compare Desktop simulator (DCS, P3D etc) to real life performance.
Flight model data of even complex DCS aircraft like F/A-18 just cost $100. A real life flight model data cost Millions of dollars that needs to be licensed purchased by the manufacturer and then implemented on Fixed Base simulator (FTD) or Level D Simulator. Even then it’s not 100% accurate. I have been simulating for more than 10+ years and have used almost all simulators out there and find it totally funny when people compare them to real life.