ADA Tejas Mark-II/Medium Weight Fighter

SARTHAK

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Su 57 is grand pa of agility. It can climb up to the height of Mount Everest in less than 20 Second with climb rate of 350 meter a second. However, as it happens with most of Russian Weapons, it can not match the electronics of west. Its panned powerful engine is also not coming. Russian planes are built on outdated philosophy such as dog fight etc but does not focus on electronics and weapon package like west. Su57 with west electronics, Indian HUD and software can be a lethal combo which India has planned to do in FAGFA. However, it did not happen because of some reasons.
yes they are not upto the western level but they are not as bad as chinese ones (i mean they are not sub standard), but still su 57 is more of a stealth killer ,with k77 and l band ew arrays with full of radars it can be worthy (more of a jugadu f22)
 

JBH22

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@ZBH22
When I have specifically stated that F16 and F15 are outdated, why are you concluding that I have said that F15 and F16 better? Your problem is that you don't read while responding the post. Good medium weight fighter is Rafale, Gripen Ng etc. Read above post of mine and stop putting words in mouth and make suitable judgements.[/Quote,

In an another post, you said that I am biased when I said that Su30 are outdated. . Do you know that Indian airforce has a massive Super sukhoi upgradation programe which is more costlier than original acquisition price of Su 30 MKIs. Now, if they are contemporary as you said, why such big amount is spent on upgradation?
@ZBH22
When I have specifically stated that F16 and F15 are outdated, why are you concluding that I have said that F15 and F16 better? Your problem is that you don't read while responding the post. Good medium weight fighter is Rafale, Gripen Ng etc. Read above post of mine and stop putting words in mouth and make suitable judgements.
The initial post is that any plane would be better than the Su 30mki. The comparison was made by me to compare the RCS, cost that you said was the down side of the Su30-mki.

In an another post, you said that I am biased when I said that Su30 are outdated. . Do you know that Indian airforce has a massive Super sukhoi upgradation programe which is more costlier than original acquisition price of Su 30 MKIs. Now, if they are contemporary as you said, why such big amount is spent on upgradation?
If you say any plane is better than the backbone of IAF don't you have a bias. A blanket statement on it being worst than any plane. For the upgrade it's the Mid life program the Su30-mki in its present configuration is back what it was 2002.
Going by your logic Rafale is useless given the F4 variant is ready
 

HariPrasad-1

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The initial post is that any plane would be better than the Su 30mki. The comparison was made by me to compare the RCS, cost that you said was the down side of the Su30-mki.


If you say any plane is better than the backbone of IAF don't you have a bias. A blanket statement on it being worst than any plane. For the upgrade it's the Mid life program the Su30-mki in its present configuration is back what it was 2002.
Going by your logic Rafale is useless given the F4 variant is ready
Yes please do anything but don't put the words in my mouth.
 

sakalasiva

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Can anybody explain how good Tejas Mk2 will be in comparison with J10c. Is having bigger powerplant on J10 will give it's an edge over Tejas?
 

Lonewolf

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Can anybody explain how good Tejas Mk2 will be in comparison with J10c. Is having bigger powerplant on J10 will give it's an edge over Tejas?
Then j10c is heavier too , but shorter combat range , it's external payload is 300 kg higher , engine power is higher but high fuel consumption too , overn and all it is good but accident record is not pleasing , but would be a worthy opponent , after 110 kn thrust engine , it would be unmatched by j10 c , it may even exceed it in most parameters
 

IndianHawk

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Can anybody explain how good Tejas Mk2 will be in comparison with J10c. Is having bigger powerplant on J10 will give it's an edge over Tejas?
J10 engine is old compared to Tejas mk2 f414.
J10 is not a match for MWF / mk2 . It has engine reliability servicing issues which makes its availablity a joke that's why chinese need more jets just to keep numbers available.

J10 avionics also can't match what India will field including weapons suit. As indian will mix and match western systems weapons too.
 

Lonewolf

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J10 engine is old compared to Tejas mk2 f414.
J10 is not a match for MWF / mk2 . It has engine reliability servicing issues which makes its availablity a joke that's why chinese need more jets just to keep numbers available.

J10 avionics also can't match what India will field including weapons suit. As indian will mix and match western systems weapons too.
Yet it is heavier and old platform with higher twr ,so can't judge like that , in future some combat experience will speak much better
 

onlinpunit

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J10 engine is old compared to Tejas mk2 f414.
J10 is not a match for MWF / mk2 . It has engine reliability servicing issues which makes its availablity a joke that's why chinese need more jets just to keep numbers available.

J10 avionics also can't match what India will field including weapons suit. As indian will mix and match western systems weapons too.
Let MK2 become a reality first.
 

Bleh

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Can anybody explain how good Tejas Mk2 will be in comparison with J10c. Is having bigger powerplant on J10 will give it's an edge over Tejas?
Platform-wise (ie not counting reliability, availability, operatiing cost etc.) only significant advantage in J-10C's favour would be its 3D thrust-vectoring... One the other hand MWF will enjoy lower observability, integrated EW & better avionics & weaponary in general.
 

IndianHawk

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Yet it is heavier and old platform with higher twr ,so can't judge like that , in future some combat experience will speak much better
Combat depends on weaponry more now than just thrust. Even now lca has python 5 what does j10 has against it ?? Even for longer range missiles with Derby er and Astra mk2 j10 has no advantage over lca it will be at disadvantages due to higher RCS higher infrared signature .
 

Lonewolf

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Combat depends on weaponry more now than just thrust. Even now lca has python 5 what does j10 has against it ?? Even for longer range missiles with Derby er and Astra mk2 j10 has no advantage over lca it will be at disadvantages due to higher RCS higher infrared signature .
I just pointed what it is better at not their combat utilization , any timeline for mk2 production @Bleh
 

Trololo

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Platform-wise (ie not counting reliability, availability, operatiing cost etc.) only significant advantage in J-10C's favour would be its 3D thrust-vectoring... One the other hand MWF will enjoy lower observability, integrated EW & better avionics & weaponary in general.
I think this will be mitigated in the 110KN engine that will be fielded in the LCA Mk2 post 2030. But is that at all a requirement? TVC causes significant energy loss in a turning fight (where high excess power is key like Typhoon), and is only useful in the hands of highly skilled pilots for momentary nose pointing advantage to quickly fire a missile or cannon.

From a Su-30 pilot I have spoken to they are only taught to use TVC in combat after having mastered all basic air combat training, and that the TVC is to be used only during certain combat regimes.

I mean if TVC was really that advantageous surely all countries would field them.
 

HariPrasad-1

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Can anybody explain how good Tejas Mk2 will be in comparison with J10c. Is having bigger powerplant on J10 will give it's an edge over Tejas?
I see only one advantage with J10 C and that is TVC. J10 C is a shit like JF17. Poor aerodynamics, unreliable engine, Poor AESA radar of 170 km range against 5 sq meter target, unreliable Chinese weapons, high RCS, poor or no EW. It is just a third generation plane which can easily be outmatched by Mirage 2000 upg. 9 J10 had fallen in 2 years. Tejas is an ultra modern fighter which can be matched by only Gripen.
 
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MonaLazy

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J10 is not a match for MWF / mk2
A real assessment of even paper capabilities is possible only when MWF is inducted into the war plans of IAF. That is many many years away. It will not be j-20 it will be facing, but something much superior. No time for IAF+HAL+DRDO to sit on their haunches. The Chinese dragon is well and truly breathing fire down Indian neck!
 

Trololo

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I see only one advantage with J10 C and that is TVC. J10 C is a shit like JF17. Poor aerodynamics, unreliable engine, Poor AESA radar of 170 km range against 5 sq meter target, unreliable Chinese weapons, high RCS, poor or no EW. It is just a third generation lane which can easily outmatched by Mirage 2000 upg. 9 J10 had fallen in 2 years. Tejas is an ultra modern fighter which can be matched by only Gripen.
J-10 is the love child of the IAI Lavi and the Su-27. I wouldn't diss that. And the FCS most definitely is yahoodi, so that shouldn't be dissed either.
Importantly it is construction quality, avionics, engines, and weapons that should be the talking point. And the Chinese should be a few notches behind on those. But that is something that I wouldn't underestimate either. Chinese R&D and academia is way better funded than ours. So their progress should not be underestimated. Just look at the finish of the J-20 for example.
 

Lonewolf

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J-10 is the love child of the IAI Lavi and the Su-27. I wouldn't diss that. And the FCS most definitely is yahoodi, so that shouldn't be dissed either.
Importantly it is construction quality, avionics, engines, and weapons that should be the talking point. And the Chinese should be a few notches behind on those. But that is something that I wouldn't underestimate either. Chinese R&D and academia is way better funded than ours. So their progress should not be underestimated. Just look at the finish of the J-20 for example.
J 20 was too raw some years back , new ones look better , our academia needs improvement in industry linking and funding
 

HariPrasad-1

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J-10 is the love child of the IAI Lavi and the Su-27. I wouldn't diss that. And the FCS most definitely is yahoodi, so that shouldn't be dissed either.
Importantly it is construction quality, avionics, engines, and weapons that should be the talking point. And the Chinese should be a few notches behind on those. But that is something that I wouldn't underestimate either. Chinese R&D and academia is way better funded than ours. So their progress should not be underestimated. Just look at the finish of the J-20 for example.
J20 is just a third generation plane bettered in some way. The designer of J20 was sscked by china. Su30 MKI detected J20 with PESA radar 300 km away. It is not stealth, it has the engine of 4th generation plane technology, poor radar, poor weapons. Rafale is much better than Chinese J20 and that is ehy China bought Su 35 else which country who claims to have fifth generation plane will import forth generation plane.
 

IndianHawk

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A real assessment of even paper capabilities is possible only when MWF is inducted into the war plans of IAF. That is many many years away. It will not be j-20 it will be facing, but something much superior. No time for IAF+HAL+DRDO to sit on their haunches. The Chinese dragon is well and truly breathing fire down Indian neck!
We will have superior planes also . Rafale is already here which is decades ahead in avionics and weaponary than j20 . Amca will start flying soon.

J20 still doesn't have stealth engine .

China is just a fat lizard which is only 5-6 years ahead of us in indigenous weapons development. We are on the same tech only difference is that our indigenous products actually compete with western products and hence are much better than chinese junk.
 

Lonewolf

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J20 is just a third generation plane bettered in some way. The designer of J20 was sscked by china. Su30 MKI detected J20 with PESA radar 300 km away. It is not stealth, it has the engine of 4th generation plane technology, poor radar, poor weapons. Rafale is much better than Chinese J20 and that is ehy China bought Su 35 else which country who claims to have fifth generation plane will import forth generation plane.
To make j16 , and j20 isn't that shit ,it maybe using luneberg lens , also j 20 is still better stealth that su 30 mki , chinese generation are a number behind others , like their 4 th gen is actually a 5 th gen by nomenclature of west
 

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