ADA Tejas Mark-II/Medium Weight Fighter

Trololo

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You can copy the engine.......from the design to the exact shape of the components. But not the metallurgy, and not the fadec source code, and not the computer chips that run those.
At best we can do a component by component copy by geometry using our own materials, and use our own fadec to see what happens.
 

Bhurki

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You can copy the engine.......from the design to the exact shape of the components. But not the metallurgy, and not the fadec source code, and not the computer chips that run those.
At best we can do a component by component copy by geometry using our own materials, and use our own fadec to see what happens.
And then get hit by sanctions the kind of which are reserved only for war.. Eg.. Fuel embargo etc
 

Gandaberunda

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India should buy engines and spares in advance to last for next 10 years atleast maybe we will come with our indigenous engines in next 10 years
If US stops engine export then it's their loss as India already has a backup engine in French safran M88. Also France has offered help to develop fighter engine with India and also suggested to use the core of M88 in Kaveri ( rejected by DRDO as we want to develop our own core but needed help).
GE ain't fool to lose order of 100+ engines also US won't put any embargo on export of engines as it's done by GE - HAL directly not by US Govt to Indian govt as aid.
 

Okabe Rintarou

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Why not copy all those engines .
Can't drdo guys , copy them ?
You can copy the engine.......from the design to the exact shape of the components. But not the metallurgy, and not the fadec source code, and not the computer chips that run those.
At best we can do a component by component copy by geometry using our own materials, and use our own fadec to see what happens.
Nope. You can't copy that either. That shape has been optimized for that particular pressure ratio, turbine entry temperature, etc. The optimization is also material specific and the moment you change the material, you suddenly become unable to achieve the performance parameters you set for the engine. Change of material changes the components' creep and fatigue behaviour, changes its vibration response (along with that of the entire engine). The TBC that worked suddenly doesn't work anymore. All these changes lead to the shape that you copied not being optimal anymore. So now maybe you try to find the optimal shape, but how? Without the CFD code the Americans used to model the airflow and multiphase interactions in the original design, you won't be able to achieve the same result. Then there are features that can only be created by certain manufacturing methods.
TL;DR design of a jet engine is a multivariable problem. You change one variable and the others change dramatically. In such systems, you just can't copy.
 

Chandragupt Maurya

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But how will they get to know ?
( Iam a noob, in these matters so kindly ignore my probably idiotic questions )
They keep inspecting their engines and how are our scientists going to copy the alloy which has been used to make the engine it’s very difficult thing takes decades to master
Thought it’s possible to steal the technology through espionage but that will impact India US relations
 

Bhurki

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But how will they get to know ?
( Iam a noob, in these matters so kindly ignore my probably idiotic questions )
Thats what technical intelligence does..
If you break a weapons contract to the point that you start copying IP protected items, all wrath is brought to bear.
 

Trololo

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Will the MWF feature a tail mounted jammer similar to the Gripen or Rafale?
 

no smoking

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They keep inspecting their engines and how are our scientists going to copy the alloy which has been used to make the engine it’s very difficult thing takes decades to master
You can't copy that either.
You can analyze the ingredients of the alloy, but you won't know how these ingredients are processed and manufactured so the final alloy can perform the same features.
You may think espionage can get the answer for you, but unfortunately it doesn't help much either. Even your tech intelligence get that, in most of time, your industrial departments of supply chain can't produce by these foreign processing map. For example, one department may tell you that the material produced their factory can't reach the required purity, another one may tell you that their production equipment can't monitor the temperature precise enough in the processing, the third one may say that they can provide the satisfied material but the cost is sky high, etc, etc. Eventually, you have to give it up and go back to your scientists to re-develop a new alloy which may not be as good as those foreign alloy but close enough and more importantly your domestic industries can produce within accepted cost.

Thought it’s possible to steal the technology through espionage but that will impact India US relations
Just like Chinese, India intelligence agency does steal too. The difference is the extent and consequence of this kind activities from India are not serious enough currently to alarm Americans.
 

Chandragupt Maurya

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You can't copy that either.
You can analyze the ingredients of the alloy, but you won't know how these ingredients are processed and manufactured so the final alloy can perform the same features.
You may think espionage can get the answer for you, but unfortunately it doesn't help much either. Even your tech intelligence get that, in most of time, your industrial departments of supply chain can't produce by these foreign processing map. For example, one department may tell you that the material produced their factory can't reach the required purity, another one may tell you that their production equipment can't monitor the temperature precise enough in the processing, the third one may say that they can provide the satisfied material but the cost is sky high, etc, etc. Eventually, you have to give it up and go back to your scientists to re-develop a new alloy which may not be as good as those foreign alloy but close enough and more importantly your domestic industries can produce within accepted cost.



Just like Chinese, India intelligence agency does steal too. The difference is the extent and consequence of this kind activities from India are not serious enough currently to alarm Americans.
USA and UK have stolen technology from France and other countries in the past Pakistan stole nuclear technology from USA it’s difficult but not impossible the only thing required is a strong political will
 

no smoking

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USA and UK have stolen technology from France and other countries in the past Pakistan stole nuclear technology from USA it’s difficult but not impossible the only thing required is a strong political will
Every country has stole some techs from others.
You don't need a strong political will for that, that is what intelligence agency's daily job.
Where the strong political will is demanded is putting these stolen techs into actual production because it generally requires massive long-term investment from government to upgrade the industrial capabilities.
 

Bleh

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See both refueling-probe & IRST have been moved. From its positioning I'm pretty sure this one is foldable/retractable... Also definitely no DSI, you can see the splitter-plate's boundary layer air escape slot.

 

Bleh

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Thrust to weight ratio of mwf?
Due to much higher internal fuel, overall T/W ratio of Mark2 is same as Tejas Mark1... About 0.95 (considering present F414, not EPE)

Performance difference will be brought by canards, superior aerodynamics & improved FCS, not brute power.
 
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