ADA Tejas Mark-II/Medium Weight Fighter

aerokan

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Chandragupt Maurya

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Most of the information is wrong ..

Elta 2052 is not a GAN based radar , also 116 kn thrust GE414Epe would not be used , show me any reliable source which shows that 116 kn thrust GE414 is operational or it would be used in Tejas mk 2
I don’t know whether ELTA 2052 is GaN Based AESA Radar or not but GEF414 is under development and it’s expected to be a 114 KN thrust engine
 

Emperor Kalki

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aerokan

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Were these with the tender?

If those are the images from the tender its pretty obvious its a mk2 wing....
Its got wing tip extension for the hardpoint.
And only 2 leading edge slats on the wing compared to mk1 wing (although dimensionally they cover the entire span of the slats in mk1).
Yes. they were with the tender.

Ofcourse!! it's the additional hard point on the wing tip.. damn!! didn't notice the obvious..lol
Good observation on the leading edge slats.
 

aerokan

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What i don't understand is why the tender didn't include the canards for MK2?

They are not big components and can be easily included with the tender without having to raise a seperate one.

MK2 with no canards? :hmm: :notsure:
 

Shekhar Singh

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What i don't understand is why the tender didn't include the canards for MK2?

They are not big components and can be easily included with the tender without having to raise a seperate one.

MK2 with no canards? :hmm: :notsure:
You have to look for front fuselage tender, it there is space for canards or not.
 

Trololo

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Reposting from Mk1/Mk1A Thread:

Good opportunity for us to sign tripartite agreement for F414 engines and take firm orders for LCA Mk2 for VPAF, Thai AF, Indonesian AF, Philippines AF, Myanmar AF, and stitch together an anti China alliance.

Design and most subsystems will be Indian. IP of MWF will be Indian.


For other foreign subsystems for which clearance cannot come, there is always a Russian alternative. But I think these will be very minimal.



According to available info only engine will be major foreign component in MWF.


Its Data Links and formidable avionics will be Indian. If D-29 EW suite is anything to go by, DRDOs UEWS will be an excellent piece of kit. Probably in the same category as the Rafale. Here is where i see an opportunity:






If we can sell the LCA Mk2 to the VPAF, or any other country hostile to China (like Indonesia or Philippines), then we can also sell to them the following:



1> Astra Mk1 missile (110 km range)


2> Astra Mk2 missile (160km range)



3> Astra Mk3 SFDR missile (320 km range)


4> Astra IR close quarter combat missile (40km range)



5> SANT missile (20-30km anti tank missile)


6> SAAW anti airfield PGM (120+ km)


7> Rudram 1 anti awacs missile


8> Rudram 2 air to ground missile


9> Rudram 3 air to ground missile (SCALP class missile)


10> Brahmos NG missile (300 km max range under MTCR for exports)



11> Improved Sudarshan class of LGBs with kits for 250kg, 500kg, 1000kg, 1500kg, and 2000kg munitions. Can be configured to be in the class of the Paveway 2, Paveway 3, Spice, and Hammer munitions.


12> DRDO HSLD munition which can be used with the kits from point 11 above.


13> All upcoming Indian targeting and EW pods



14> Current OFB dumb munitions modeled on Russian dumb munitions.

15> Upcoming Indian loyal wingman type drones which whill significantly increase the capability of any aircraft it is paired with.


Once these airforces are locked in with the LCA Mk2, then it automatically creates a market for Indian munition and combat electronics sales. Most countries will prefer single source vendor for end to end solution (i.e India) in order to prevent all hotch-potch and avoid paying for integration costs of other weapons. For example, the Egyptian Rafales are ditto the French ones, whereas ours have India specific mods which are costly.

If these countries, however, want foreign weapons on their aircraft, they have the following to choose:

1> ASRAAM close combat missile from Europe.

2> Meteor missile (If permitted. I last heard they will allow meteor integration with an Indian radar)

3> Python 5 close combat missile from Israel (certified already)

4> Derby medium range missile (110 km class, already certified)

5> R-73 close combat missile from Russia (already certified)

6> R-77 medium range missile from Russia (possibly certified. not sure)

7> KAB series of Russian PGMs in the 250-1500kg class. (certified)

8> OFAB dumb russian munitions (certified)

9> Paveway 2 LGB kit (certified)

10> Griffin LGB kit (certified)

11> Kh-XX series of A2G and anti ship missiles (certified)


12> Spice kit

13> Hammer kit



All these are a TREMENDOUS list of options!! No other aircraft will give this kind of versatility as far as weapon systems are concerned!


Tejas Mk2 will be the only aircraft in the world which can easily integrate Indian, Russian, Israeli, and Western armaments. No other aircraft in the world will offer this diversity.


LCA Mk2 will also offer variety of targeting pods too

1> Upcoming Indian targeting pods

2> Israeli Litening (already integrated and most preferred)

3> French Talios

4> US Sniper pod (good possibility if sold to ME countries)

Also on offer will be missions training systems, pilot training, etc. Not to mention that any country who buys the LCA Mk2 will increase our strategic footprint there. The sale of MWF will pave the way to sell our under development AWACS aircraft too. And other electronics like radars and data links.

Good opportunity for us to make alliances and modernize some air forces at affordable prices. Just imagine a string of nations hostile to the Chinese and armed with a combination of MWFs, ORCAs, and a range of desi munitions. I think we should aggressively pursue this.
 

Abhijeet Dey

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Reposting from Mk1/Mk1A Thread:

Good opportunity for us to sign tripartite agreement for F414 engines and take firm orders for LCA Mk2 for VPAF, Thai AF, Indonesian AF, Philippines AF, Myanmar AF, and stitch together an anti China alliance.

Design and most subsystems will be Indian. IP of MWF will be Indian.


For other foreign subsystems for which clearance cannot come, there is always a Russian alternative. But I think these will be very minimal.



According to available info only engine will be major foreign component in MWF.


Its Data Links and formidable avionics will be Indian. If D-29 EW suite is anything to go by, DRDOs UEWS will be an excellent piece of kit. Probably in the same category as the Rafale. Here is where i see an opportunity:






If we can sell the LCA Mk2 to the VPAF, or any other country hostile to China (like Indonesia or Philippines), then we can also sell to them the following:



1> Astra Mk1 missile (110 km range)


2> Astra Mk2 missile (160km range)



3> Astra Mk3 SFDR missile (320 km range)


4> Astra IR close quarter combat missile (40km range)



5> SANT missile (20-30km anti tank missile)


6> SAAW anti airfield PGM (120+ km)


7> Rudram 1 anti awacs missile


8> Rudram 2 air to ground missile


9> Rudram 3 air to ground missile (SCALP class missile)


10> Brahmos NG missile (300 km max range under MTCR for exports)



11> Improved Sudarshan class of LGBs with kits for 250kg, 500kg, 1000kg, 1500kg, and 2000kg munitions. Can be configured to be in the class of the Paveway 2, Paveway 3, Spice, and Hammer munitions.


12> DRDO HSLD munition which can be used with the kits from point 11 above.


13> All upcoming Indian targeting and EW pods



14> Current OFB dumb munitions modeled on Russian dumb munitions.

15> Upcoming Indian loyal wingman type drones which whill significantly increase the capability of any aircraft it is paired with.


Once these airforces are locked in with the LCA Mk2, then it automatically creates a market for Indian munition and combat electronics sales. Most countries will prefer single source vendor for end to end solution (i.e India) in order to prevent all hotch-potch and avoid paying for integration costs of other weapons. For example, the Egyptian Rafales are ditto the French ones, whereas ours have India specific mods which are costly.

If these countries, however, want foreign weapons on their aircraft, they have the following to choose:

1> ASRAAM close combat missile from Europe.

2> Meteor missile (If permitted. I last heard they will allow meteor integration with an Indian radar)

3> Python 5 close combat missile from Israel (certified already)

4> Derby medium range missile (110 km class, already certified)

5> R-73 close combat missile from Russia (already certified)

6> R-77 medium range missile from Russia (possibly certified. not sure)

7> KAB series of Russian PGMs in the 250-1500kg class. (certified)

8> OFAB dumb russian munitions (certified)

9> Paveway 2 LGB kit (certified)

10> Griffin LGB kit (certified)

11> Kh-XX series of A2G and anti ship missiles (certified)


12> Spice kit

13> Hammer kit



All these are a TREMENDOUS list of options!! No other aircraft will give this kind of versatility as far as weapon systems are concerned!


Tejas Mk2 will be the only aircraft in the world which can easily integrate Indian, Russian, Israeli, and Western armaments. No other aircraft in the world will offer this diversity.


LCA Mk2 will also offer variety of targeting pods too

1> Upcoming Indian targeting pods

2> Israeli Litening (already integrated and most preferred)

3> French Talios

4> US Sniper pod (good possibility if sold to ME countries)

Also on offer will be missions training systems, pilot training, etc. Not to mention that any country who buys the LCA Mk2 will increase our strategic footprint there. The sale of MWF will pave the way to sell our under development AWACS aircraft too. And other electronics like radars and data links.

Good opportunity for us to make alliances and modernize some air forces at affordable prices. Just imagine a string of nations hostile to the Chinese and armed with a combination of MWFs, ORCAs, and a range of desi munitions. I think we should aggressively pursue this.
Firstly we should concentrate on replenishing the squadron strength of Indian Air Force.

The squadrons sanctioned for Indian air force is 42 (in case of a two front war).

Right now western countries are concentrating on 6th generation aircraft for the future. Russia and China may follow suit.
 

Trololo

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Firstly we should concentrate on replenishing the squadron strength of Indian Air Force.

The squadrons sanctioned for Indian air force is 42 (in case of a two front war).

Right now western countries are concentrating on 6th generation aircraft for the future. Russia and China may follow suit.
Their 6th gens won't come into service until late 2030s - early 2040s. And 4.5 gens are here to stay for a while. And their 5th gens won't be in huge numbers either as of now. Large orders for MWF will let us open 4-5 assembly lines. If we can secure an order of 200 MWF for us, and another 400 for exports, then there can be 3 dedicated lines to serve the IAF. We shouldn't twiddle our thumbs on this.
 

Steven Rogers

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Firstly we should concentrate on replenishing the squadron strength of Indian Air Force.

The squadrons sanctioned for Indian air force is 42 (in case of a two front war).

Right now western countries are concentrating on 6th generation aircraft for the future. Russia and China may follow suit.
We should do things what we can rather than watching what others are doing....An aircraft is modern by its systems and surface life,not by the generation tag...
 

WolfPack86

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How Tejas Mk2 will have half the development time then Tejas Mk1

From the first flight in 2001 till the formation of the first squadron in 2016, LCA-Tejas Mk1 Program has been for long ridiculed for its slow pace of development and 15 years from first flight to the first squadron has often been due to long developmental and testing cycle which many aviation experts felt was prolonged due to higher safety issues and lack of experience in moving from prototype stage to production stage of the program but that’s about to change for successor Tejas Mk2 program. Like LCA-Tejas Mk1 Program, Tejas Mk2 program will skip Technology Demonstrator (TD) and Prototype vehicles (PV) stages to start with and the first aircraft assembled will be Limited Series Production (LSP) aircraft in Initial Operational Clearance (IOC) standard configuration slated to have its first flight by 2022. The adoption of computer simulations in a big way not only has helped ADA to perfect the design of the aircraft but it will also cut down on the required time to test basic flight characteristics of the aircraft. HAL plans to outsource sub-assemblies of the aircraft fuselage to the Tier-2/3 suppliers, which will mean that instead of getting bare fuselage it will get fully equipped section of aircraft fuselage it’s in charge of to be later assembled with other sections supplied by other Tier-2 suppliers into one whole aircraft, which means that production line can hit 24 aircraft per annum mark from the first year itself instead of gradual increase in production rate as seen in Tejas Mk1 program. ADA and HAL plan to field 3 IOC Standard and 2 Full Operational Clearance (FOC) standard aircraft before it is ready for production by 2028-29. Production-wise all LSPs will have all structures and panels which will not be unique to the aircraft and will be interchangeable so that when aircraft enters production it doesn’t face quality or spare issues. interchangeable of panels and spares is a must for the operational squadrons so that aircraft availability per squadron remains 75% and above to meet IAF’s operational availability criteria and to also reduce downtime of the grounded aircraft. The majority of the design work of the Tejas Mk2 has been frozen with minor changes expected before the final freeze happens by end of this year. Tender documents issued to private sector companies by HAL show the final design of the wings for the Tejas Mk2 program and HAL ordering Two cockpit simulators to train pilots shows that unlike the Tejas Mk1 program, many of the groundwork has commenced before aircraft goes into assembling mode. The first metal cutting process for the Tejas Mk2 will happen in early 2021 and it is reported that it will require close to 12 months for the HAL to roll out first Tejas Mk2 LSP aircraft ready for first flight by the second half of 2022 or early 2023. Many of the major components like Digital Flight Control Computer (DFCC), Avionics, Navigation equipment, EW and Onboard Oxygen generator are already developed, but concern remains on availability of UTTAM AESA fire Control Radar which is still going through fine-tuning and testings and many of modes out of total 18 modes yet to be realized. Around 8 F-414INS6 engine ordered from US engine-maker General Electric (GE) have arrived in India a few years back and according to ADA and GE officials, Tejas Mk2 will accommodate the F-414INS6 engines without any problems or extensive redesign to the enlarged air intakes, and that it will perform to its designed potential as validated by computer simulations. GE team will also be India to overlook and monitor the integration work of the engine with the first Tejas Mk2 and also carry out Ground engine run of the aircraft before it is cleared for its first flight.
 

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