ADA Tejas (LCA) News and Discussions

[proud_indian]

Thx, but LCA figures were correct? How on earth did the FOC price doubled? IFR, new nose, A2A weapon integration???

Yes that are quite correct in today's exchange rate. But I really can't answer your second question. That is more than 2 fold jump in pricing!

 

[Sancho]

Yes that are quite correct in today's exchange rate. But I really can't answer your second question. That is more than 2 fold jump in pricing!

Yes I'm confused and shocked as well, but now the 60 to 110 million estimates for LCA MK1A seem possible.

 

[proud_indian]

Yes I'm confused and shocked as well, but now the 60 to 110 million estimates for LCA MK1A seem possible.

It's very much possible and honestly speaking I do not expect any 4th Gen fighter with AESA and other modern avionics would cost any cheaper and this 60-100 million figure would include all the necessary infrastructure and a long term support as well.

@sanco offtopic question, Why are you not on the new forum? You can ignore answering if there is any personal reason.

 

[Sancho]

It's very much possible and honestly speaking I do not expect any 4th Gen fighter with AESA and other modern avionics would cost any cheaper

Well I expect the 1A to be initially more expensive too, but this kind of difference between IOC and FOC might show, how much less capable the first 20 actually are. Which once again confirms my view, that the FOC is the key milestone for the LCA programme and ADA finally needs to deliver.

Will write you a PM.

 

[proud_indian]

Well I expect the 1A to be initially more expensive too, but this kind of difference between IOC and FOC might show, how much less capable the first 20 actually are. Which once again confirms my view, that the FOC is the key milestone for the LCA programme and ADA finally needs to deliver.

FOC is definitely the most important mile stone to be achieved, It will give the whole LCA program a much needed closure and thereafter HAL can concentrate on the following variants of LCA and I also wish there is MK2 in the pipeline as well.

 

[Kshithij]

Correct me please if I got the conversions from cores to million wrong, but does this mean that the unit costs come down to...

LCA MK1 IOC = 21 million USD
LCA MK1 FOC = 47 million USD
Su 30 MKI = 59 million USD

Have you considered the fact that development cost may be included in this? After all, the cost will include all the elements like infrastructure, development etc. Also, privatisation and capital expenditures must be included. The expenditure is unlikely to be for mere production cost. For that matter consider these too:
Do228 costs 12 million dollars a piece
ALH costs 13.5 million dollars a piece. (Apache costs 13 million dollars and it is armed while ALH is unarmed)

These things are also mind blowing. The only explanation is the cost of development and infrastructure creation for mass manufacturing. Don't forget that there is a massive push for investment in capital asset formations to develop indian industries. None of the private industries will agree to invest that heavily without government assistance. Also, MK1A is rectifying 43 flaws out of 57 pointed out by IAF.

There is no other way out. IAF needs to have at least 672 combat aircraft by 2030 to maintain 32 Sq strength.
Supposing all 394 Migs are retired by then & add another 95 Jags.
IAF would have just 357 aircrafts ( 272 Su-30,51 Mirage,36 Rafale)
Now assuming IAF orders 10 Sq of Tejas(210 nos, assuming production capacity of 18 per year )
IAF would have just 567 aircrafts(27 Sq) - 5 sq short of 32 sq strength.

This shortage will be rectified once MK2 and Kaveri engine will come into action by 2024. After that mass production will be possible. No need to buy paltry 18-36 imported ones. Keep calm. 2030 is 13 years ahead. That is a big time

 

[Sancho]

Have you considered the fact that development cost may be included in this?

Development costs won't be included in indigenous procurements, since the government already paid for them beforehand. This must be the flyaway cost for LCA and the production cost of MKI at HAL.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

The FOC versions of Tejas are going to be MK1A standard ..

MK1A has more imported content as per IAF requests, More imported content will raise cost eventually ..

 

[Kunal Biswas]

When she flies past with couple of spot rolls..

@deb_rana

 

[Kunal Biswas]

After the induction of the Light Combat Aircraft in the 45th Squadron aka THE FLYING DAGGERS , the Indian Air Force now plans to revive the sole Param Vir Chakra squadron of the force , the 18th Squadron aka THE FLYING BULLETS. 18 Sqd will be the second squadron to have LCA Tejas

Source : INDRA FB

==================

LA-5004 (SP-4) prior to getting into Sqn fleet, completing her initial block of flights.After SP7 (LA-5007) did her maiden flight, will undergo similar process but with a faster pace as the initial hiccups have been left behind. Soon SP5 (LA-5005) will commence this process. For viewer’s benefit, SP-5 is being getting ready by the second production line. We expect the first flight of SP-5 to take place before this month end.

Source : INDRA FB

 

[Kshithij]

Development costs won't be included in indigenous procurements, since the government already paid for them beforehand. This must be the flyaway cost for LCA and the production cost of MKI at HAL.

This is not the 83 ordered recently but 20 ordered when there was no Mk1A. As soon as the demands for MK1A was raised, Govt sanctioned 20 MK1A building. So, this apparently does have developmental cost with it.

 

[ezsasa]

For people who want to form a negative opinion on HAL and Tejas.....

 

[pankaj nema]

Tejas to Participate in IAF exercise

Tejas inducted into 45 Squadron of the Air Force, to fly in IAF war game

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/...r-force-to-fly-in-iaf-war-game/1/1122647.html

 

[pankaj nema]

Exercise Gaganshakti in March -April

The Gaganshakti exercise is a pan-India war game conducted by the Air Force across its operational commands where the response of the force is checked to the threats faced by it on different fronts.

During the exercise, the IAF will operate its latest acquisitions in a network-centric environment, achieving very high levels of synergy with the Army and the Navy, sources in the Air Force said.

During this exercise, several hundred combat planes including the Su-30MKI, Mirage-2000, Jaguars and MiG 29s would take part and hundreds of missions would be flown with impeccable planning and execution, they said.

The exercise will be based on a scenario that included rapid deployment across the country at all operational Air Force bases.

 

[darshan978]

For people who want to form a negative opinion on HAL and Tejas.....

Is he pointing towards ajay shukla? Manu pubby?

 

[Sancho]

The FOC versions of Tejas are going to be MK1A standard ..

MK1A has more imported content as per IAF requests, More imported content will raise cost eventually ..

For the MK1A sure, but here we are talking about more than twice the costs for IOC and FOC versions. Can the addition of Chobham nose and refuelling probe, the Russian gun as well as Israeli missiles can't really raise the cost that much?

 

[Kshithij]

For the MK1A sure, but here we are talking about more than twice the costs for IOC and FOC versions. Can the addition of Chobham nose and refuelling probe, the Russian gun as well as Israeli missiles can't really raise the cost that much?

I think I have answered that by stating that investment cost and private industry initial expenditures has been included. That is also how ALH cost if spike up so much.

 

[cyclops]

Development costs won't be included in indigenous procurements, since the government already paid for them beforehand. This must be the flyaway cost for LCA and the production cost of MKI at HAL.

Or it might be that the more mature platforms have achieved economy of scale and are easy to produce hence making the price competitive, unlike Tejas which will take time to achieve this.

 

[Kshithij]

Or it might be that the more mature platforms have achieved economy of scale and are easy to produce hence making the price competitive, unlike Tejas which will take time to achieve this.

The economy of scale refers to investment and fixed costs of production being subsumed to a small percentage of unit cost due to large scale manufacturing. That is why I called it investment cost.

 

[Narasimh]

Why was the Gun on Tejas not integrated and tested first?
Was it not included in the design from the beginning and added later?