ADA Tejas (LCA) News and Discussions

[ersakthivel]

If there is a will there is a way,

Chinese are simultaneously developing two brand new stealth 5th gen platforms side by side.

The french developed mirage-4000 a twin engined version of Mirage-2000 in a short span of time .

Most of the stuff like Mission computers,
avionics , weapon integration ,
composite tech ,
aerodynamic efficiency of RSS low wing loading wing form,
and Ew suit along with IRST
air to air refueling,
HMDS , and most other thing
will be validate along with a MMR(we may get ASEA in five or six years, I hope )
and fielded by the time Tejas mk-2 finishes development somewhere in 2018,

So if stealth tejas mk-3 development is initiated side by side along tejas mk-2 we may see the fighter ready around 2022 .because the implementation of internal bays and fly by wire software update alone is needed.

Since we are going to maintain the same wing loading for mk-3 most of its aerodynamic specs can be tested in a speedier manner with confidence, because we would have known what kind of AOA and STR can be achieved by this cranked delta by the time we finish mk-2.

As reported earlier 500 of the 2500 test flights conducted for tejas mk-1 was to validate flight control laws that will be common to all delta platform designs.

So we can use all the technical data painfully validated with over two decades and evolve the tejas platform into stealth,

thats why DRDO chief saraswath was frequently talking about this.

And it is with this approach chinese shocked the world with the quick development of J-20. A mig-1.44 design was adopted to stealth with readily available AL series engines.They will test flight both the J-20 and ,31 platforms with AL series engines and switch to their WS series engine when it finishes development.

this approach cuts a lot of time wasted while waiting for a new gen engine.For AMCA we will need such a new engine

tejas mk-3 can be tailored for the thrust level of K-9 that would be validated by that time.

Because with 2x54 Kn dry thrust it can be designed to super cruise with an airframe empty weight of around 8 or 9 tons.

And it can be developed with the scope to use a better engine tech in future.

It will serve as a hedge against delays in AMCA development.

Because AMCA will be a totally new wing form and it needs a development of 75/110 Kn engine and fly by light tech as a precondition for development.

And most of the IAF requirement creep can be done on AMCA not in tejas mk-3.

 

[Apollyon]

How many will be 2-seater trainer among the 40 LCA-Mk1 ordered ? @p2prada

Sent from my GT-S5830 using Tapatalk 2

 

[sayareakd]

Air Marshal Ravi Kant Sharma took over as the Vice Chief of the Air Staff (VCAS) at Air Headquarters (Vayu Bhawan) today.
An alumnus of National Defence Academy, Khadakwasla, he was commissioned into the Fighters' stream of the IAF in June 1975. A Qualified Flying Instructor, he is an Experimental Test pilot who has flown around 3,300 hrs, on several different types of aircraft including the LCA.


Read more: Air Marshal Ravi Kant Sharma is new vice air chief
Frontier India - news, Analysis, Opinion
Follow us: @frontierindia on Twitter | frontierindia on Facebook

 

[Sridhar]

 

[p2prada]

How many will be 2-seater trainer among the 40 LCA-Mk1 ordered ? @p2prada

Sent from my GT-S5830 using Tapatalk 2

Don't really know. If you want an estimate, it shouldn't be more than 4. But we don't know what's happening with the trainer version at all. Probably none.

 

[redragon]

Why delete my honest opinion? Which rule my post was violating? I studied news from Indian source and draw conclusion about when LCA can be massive enlisted. And I update my conclusion whenever more new information available. That is the perfect content for a defence forum, what is wrong with it?

 

[redragon]

Don't be so defensive, if you think I am wrong, just provide your thoughts and backed by information you have. And if LCA actually come out as your schedule, well, congradulation. I will not have any bad feeling.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Can you back your claims with posts you made here say the same, afaik you are just trolling ..

Why delete my honest opinion? Which rule my post was violating? I studied news from Indian source and draw conclusion about when LCA can be massive enlisted. And I update my conclusion whenever more new information available. That is the perfect content for a defence forum, what is wrong with it?

Don't be so defensive, if you think I am wrong, just provide your thoughts and backed by information you have. And if LCA actually come out as your schedule, well, congradulation. I will not have any bad feeling.

 

[redragon]

I post a link from India source and what happened to LCA so far also is indicator to back up my conclusion. What do you have to back up your conclusion?

 

[redragon]

And You are saying to predict when a weapon can be inducted in service is trolling? So many other memebers are predicting and you are singling me out, that is discriminating.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

I am not convinced, take your time out, When comeback try to be more specific with links backing your claims ..

And You are saying to predict when a weapon can be inducted in service is trolling? So many other memebers are predicting and you are singling me out, that is discriminating.

 

[makmohan]

Should India spend Rs 1000cr on a single fighter jet? | idrw.org

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Many of the things in the article is correct and many are incorrect, Though whatever the article says it does say that Tejas must be mass produce ..

One primary concern is that IAF rely completely on foreign equipment and have no reserves for Combat pilots, This is not good ..

In War, Casualty counts both men and machine, IAF must have something like TA which is a reserve force of IA ..

We have archive only a small portion of what may be call battle readiness with bigger foes ..

Should India spend Rs 1000cr on a single fighter jet? | idrw.org

 

[Sridhar]

No. of flights successfully completed by LCA - Tejas :

2014

Next Page

· 2467th flight on 02 Jan

TD1 : 233


PV1: 242


PV3: 381


LSP1: 74


LSP3: 183


LSP5: 246

TD2 : 305


PV2: 222


PV5: 36


LSP2: 289


LSP4: 110


LSP7: 77

NP1: 7


LSP8 : 62

 

[makmohan]

When will LSP 6 fly ?? or will they do the flight envelope expansion tests on existing LSP's itself ?

 

[rvjpheonix]

What is the the difference between the Spectra and Tejas' EW suite? From what I have understood spectra gives rafale the ability to detect another aircraft using that aircraft's radar emissions to pinpoint that aircraft.Isn't the Tejas RWJ capable of doing that? I read that the RWR aboard Tejas has geolocation capability. So it too can pinpoint enemy aircraft without switching on its radar. Isn't that what it means? @p2prada @Twinblade @ersakthivel

 

[Twinblade]

What is the the difference between the Spectra and Tejas' EW suite? From what I have understood spectra gives rafale the ability to detect another aircraft using that aircraft's radar emissions to pinpoint that aircraft.Isn't the Tejas RWJ capable of doing that? I read that the RWR aboard Tejas has geolocation capability. So it too can pinpoint enemy aircraft without switching on its radar. Isn't that what it means? @p2prada @Twinblade @ersakthivel

Yes. Tejas' ew suite, or the ew suite for any half decent modern fighter, has several HADF antennas (high accuracy direction finding) in 6 or more antenna sets (front, back lh, rh, up, down).

Depending on the manufacturer, the accuracy of these HADF antennas varies. LRDE claims that it has made them with an accuracy of .5 degrees. Now these ESM measures will only give you bearing data, but not actual range of the emissions. Depending on the data fusion capabilities of the platform, the bearing data from ew suite of several fighters can be collimated to enable passive ranging as in Gripen (the accuracy is questionable compared to radar data). Can Tejas do that has neither been discussed nor disclosed. The efficacy of these esm measures is limited to the threat library and signal processing capability of the suite (spectra is said to be excellent in this regard). On the outside the system capabilities might seem similar but looks can be deceiving. Nearly all modern radars try to make their signal less obvious in one form or another. The efficacy of the ESM will be governed by the fact that it can separate and identify the radar signals from the electronic clutter. This signal information can be replicated faithfully via DRFM, present on Tejas like any half decent fighter, and transmitted out of sync to trick the enemy radars into seeing more than one fighters or no fighter at all, messing their range and bearing estimates and plenty of other tricks that us ordinary mortals are unaware of, however it is effective only against ancient radars. Any half decent pesa or aesa radar will see through this trickery right away. It's effectiveness in case of older radars is also questionable when there is an overlap of radar coverage, where fooling more than one radar at a time would be a difficult task. DRFM is made even more effective by having a good threat library in the ew suite. DRFM jamming is the preferred mode of jamming due to home on jam and counter-countermeasure modes in modern surface to air and air to air missiles. As far as jamming/transmitting capabilities are concerned, Rafale and Eurofighter use solid state AESA based transmitters, with Rafale planning to move on to even more powerful GaN based transmitters. Such transmitters are also used on MiG-29 suite, but do not feature on Tejas Mk 1 due to power, cooling and real estate concerns, which uses TWT based pulse and continuous wave transmitters. The solid state transmitters should be available on mk2.

In the case of Rafale, the sensor information from ESM antennas, MAWS, LWS and Radar is fused together to form a unified picture. In Tejas and Gripen C, as far as I am aware, the radar information is displayed separately from the EW suite information.

Very little is known publicly about Tejas' ew suite capability other than this. Initially it was supposed to carry jammers externally, but they have since gone internal. Barring that one recent report, I am not even sure that Tejas is going to have LWS and MAWS. The sensors have been seen on the hack, but I am not 100% sure that mk1 will have them right away, maybe at FOC.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

@Twinblade can you explain the reason for it further ?

"DRFM jamming is
the preferred mode of
jamming due to home on
jam and counter-
countermeasure modes in
modern surface to air and
air to air missiles. "

 

[p2prada]

What is the the difference between the Spectra and Tejas' EW suite? From what I have understood spectra gives rafale the ability to detect another aircraft using that aircraft's radar emissions to pinpoint that aircraft.Isn't the Tejas RWJ capable of doing that? I read that the RWR aboard Tejas has geolocation capability. So it too can pinpoint enemy aircraft without switching on its radar. Isn't that what it means? @p2prada @Twinblade @ersakthivel

Twinblade's already explained most of that.

To add to his points, HADF or High Accuracy Direction Finding is a type of device that uses interferometry to find the bearing of targets. Bearing means the angle of the target, while approaching or regressing, to the receiver. For this to work, the enemy needs to be transmitting signals that are detectable by the hardware of the HADF system. So, high hardware sophistication is necessary along with a pretty good CFAR algorithm.

The RWR can also use multiple receivers to achieve detection using a technique called multilateration where the receivers calculate the time difference of arrival or TDOA. The receivers have to be on other aircraft separated by a minimum amount of distance from the first receiver, basically the aircraft will have to fly in a formation that allows such detection. The more the number of such receivers, the more accurate is the information you receive.

Normally, the above methods don't really provide range information, so you use a method called triangulation to find an estimated range of the target. You need at least two receiver aircraft for this to work.

Once a target is picked up, you can decide whether to engage it using passive means where you simply fire an active missile hoping the missile would pick up the target after closing in or by active means where you turn on the radar and paint the target and provide more accurate information to the missile.

With a combination of multilateration, triangulation and interferometery techniques, you can geolocate your target and send a nice package out to meet the threat without using your radar. Of course, the range and angular accuracy of such systems are lesser than modern radar but come with other advantages where you yourself are not a victim of passive techniques since you are less dependent on radars.

 

[CuriousBen]

Should India spend Rs 1000cr on a single fighter jet? | idrw.org

It came from the Times Of India , the same place where Rajat Pandit works, so I was a bit surprised with it when the report had good words for Tejas.
It suggests that combination of SU-30MKI and TEJAS would be best suited for the IAF.
rafale is more than 2 times costly than su 30 mki, and 5 times more costly than lca tejas.

It brought much despair.
Lucky for the Chinese as they don't have such internal greedy enemies. Lucky the Chinese don't have Indian police that work for criminals.
Like the indian courts deny justice by delaying them, similarly for whatever reason tejas has has been denied to the air force / navy because of delays.

The report mentions that only mirage 2000 / rafale is well suited for AIR to GROUND roles.
What makes Rafale better than SU-30MKI in air to ground ?
Before Kargil ,1999 was the air-force sleeping ? Would Rafale be relevant in modern times ?
Why is the IAF going crazy over rafale , even though its 5 time costly than LCA ?

Does LCA tejas mk1 match or better the mirage 2000 /rafale in air to ground roles ?