ADA Tejas (LCA) News and Discussions

[Twinblade]

MKIs have already been fitted with an internal suite, only RWR called R-118 + MAWS and LWS, as of three years ago.n Indian input in the EW suite.

MKIs don't carry maws and LWS, malaysian MKMs do. Malaysian MKMs carry UV maws which are part of SAAB IDAS. system. The MAWS for Su-30 are in development by DARE (which hopefully would be tested on Tejas) are IR MAWS which will be a part of super 30 upgrade. There are two families of MAWS being developed in India, one is UV based that is being developed with EADS for rotory wing and fixed wing aircraft (slow movers such as helicopters, transports, aew&c), and the second is dual tone IR MAWS for use on fast moving aircraft (fighters).

UV MAWS

IR MAWS

 

[Waffen SS]

@p2prada, @ersakthivel dont you think HAL Tejas's is of a bit short range? It's range is only 800 Km, is it not short than our requirement?

 

[ersakthivel]

@p2prada, @ersakthivel dont you think HAL Tejas's is of a bit short range? It's range is only 800 Km, is it not short than our requirement?

In combat aircraft evolution and technology thread in the same forum this issue is discussed thread bare.
Please visit the page,
http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/...craft-technology-evolution-10.html#post814686

 

[Defcon 1]

MKIs don't carry maws and LWS, malaysian MKMs do. Malaysian MKMs carry UV maws which are part of SAAB IDAS. system. The MAWS for Su-30 are in development by DARE (which hopefully would be tested on Tejas) are IR MAWS which will be a part of super 30 upgrade. There are two families of MAWS being developed in India, one is UV based that is being developed with EADS for rotory wing and fixed wing aircraft (slow movers such as helicopters, transports, aew&c), and the second is dual tone IR MAWS for use on fast moving aircraft (fighters).

UV MAWS

IR MAWS

Thanks for the nice post. I just have one question, given the fact that rotary wing aircraft are under higher threat from IR guided weapons such the Stinger as was shown during the Kargil war, doesn't an IR maws makes more sense for helicopters rather than on fighter aircraft for which the primary threat are radar guided missiles?

 

[Twinblade]

Thanks for the nice post. I just have one question, given the fact that rotary wing aircraft are under higher threat from IR guided weapons such the Stinger as was shown during the Kargil war, doesn't an IR maws makes more sense for helicopters rather than on fighter aircraft for which the primary threat are radar guided missiles?

It's not the way you think it is. UV maws are better at detecting the radiation emitted during the launch and rocket motor burn. IR maws are better at discerning the heated missile body in cold atmosphere once the rocket burn is over. UV maws would be more handy in situations that does not entail much reaction time between launch and impact (ie manpads targeting helicopters, aircraft taking off and landing) where as IR maws would be better at detecting missiles with a very short burn time and a longer cruise where the emissions are very faint (air to air missiles, long range surface to air missiles).

 

[Twinblade]

Regarding EW suit, Tejas always had internal EW ..

I assume this EW suit is upgraded ..

LSP-7

Those are Rx antenna, part of the rwr+esm set up in the ew suite.

 

[sasi]

@ersakthivel, according to me wht i understand is diameter of radome for mk2 is the same size of mk1.
Slight increase in fuselage is due to engine and aerodynamics. It will not have any impact on dia. Of radome.
However,there will be slight increase in power supply to mk2 avionics. Wheather that power will be used for radar or not,i don't know. We have to keep in mind extra electronic equ. In mk2.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Its most like to be same, But remembering this MK2 will be with a powerful AESA ..

@ersakthivel, according to me wht i understand is diameter of radome for mk2 is the same size of mk1.
Slight increase in fuselage is due to engine and aerodynamics. It will not have any impact on dia. Of radome.
However,there will be slight increase in power supply to mk2 avionics. Wheather that power will be used for radar or not,i don't know. We have to keep in mind extra electronic equ. In mk2.

 

[sasi]

Its most like to be same, But remembering this MK2 will be with a powerful AESA ..

initial mk2 will come with mmr. Once aesa is ready,then only it will be included.

 

[p2prada]

initial mk2 will come with mmr. Once aesa is ready,then only it will be included.

Yeah.

Indigenous AESA is still 10 years away. LRDE chose the development partner only recently. This will be followed by 2 years of discussions and contract negotiations, 4-5 years of design and R&D, and two to three years of testing. That's nearly 10 years. Quite similar to how long Russia and France took without the two years extra of contract negotiations.

It is more in the AMCA timeline.

Anyway, AESA is not a IAF and IN requirement. Only ADA has announced LCA will have AESA. But depending on threat perception and advancement of AESA technologies, it is possible IAF may ask for Israeli AESA on initial batches of LCA. The IAF's LCA Mk2 avionics specifications are still not ready from what I know.

IN will use slotted array MMR instead of AESA. It looks like IN wants to keep the LCA procurement budget as small as possible so enough numbers can be bought.

 

[Twinblade]

initial mk2 will come with mmr. Once aesa is ready,then only it will be included.

No.

Yeah.

Indigenous AESA is still 10 years away. LRDE chose the development partner only recently. This will be followed by 2 years of discussions and contract negotiations, 4-5 years of design and R&D, and two to three years of testing. That's nearly 10 years. Quite similar to how long Russia and France took without the two years extra of contract negotiations.

..and no to this too.

 

[p2prada]

..and no to this too.

Why?

Since you didn't quote it, does that mean IN will use the current MMR or even 2032?

 

[sasi]

Yeah.

Indigenous AESA is still 10 years away. LRDE chose the development partner only recently. This will be followed by 2 years of discussions and contract negotiations, 4-5 years of design and R&D, and two to three years of testing. That's nearly 10 years. Quite similar to how long Russia and France took without the two years extra of contract negotiations.

It is more in the AMCA timeline.

Anyway, AESA is not a IAF and IN requirement. Only ADA has announced LCA will have AESA. But depending on threat perception and advancement of AESA technologies, it is possible IAF may ask for Israeli AESA on initial batches of LCA.

My guess is 2018-19.
Iaf Will not ask israeli aesa.

The IAF's LCA Mk2 avionics specifications are still not ready from what I know.

they are decided a year ago. Includes internal ew suite,IRST,possibly laser designator.
Due to this additional equ. Radome will be slightly lengthened.

IN will use slotted array MMR instead of AESA. It looks like IN wants to keep the LCA procurement budget as small as possible so enough numbers can be bought.

IN still not decided. But they fond of slotted array radars in harrier.
IN will go for best. Enough time to decide.

No.

u are welcome to give ur views.

 

[Twinblade]

Why?

Expect a prototype of the aesa radar with the mk-2 prototypes. The t/r modules array components have been under testing for over a couple of years now.

u are welcome to give ur views.

The mk-2 will not fly without aesa. Dr Saraswat:-

The AESA radar is also expected to be integrated with the Tejas Mark II LCA besides other programmes. DRDO Chief added that the work is already on and the Tejas Mark-2 will have nothing but the AESA radar. The DRDO lab LRDE is working on the TR (Transmitter & Receiver) modules for the same. Apparently, it is now possible to configure small as well as large AESA radar.

http://www.defencenow.com/news/804/drdo-surges-ahead-with-2nd-phase-of-aewcs-plans-to-integrate-aesa-radar-on-tejas-mark-2-as-well.html

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Is it so ? Can you give me some link on this ..

Thnx ..

initial mk2 will come with mmr. Once aesa is ready,then only it will be included.

 

[sasi]

Is it so ? Can you give me some link on this ..

Thnx ..

Expect a prototype of the aesa radar with the mk-2 prototypes. The t/r modules array components have been under testing for over a couple of years now.



The mk-2 will not fly without aesa. Dr Saraswat:-


DRDO Surges Ahead With 2nd Phase of AEW&CS, Plans to Integrate AESA Radar on Tejas Mark 2 as Well

i doubt wheather we can have asea,when mk2 prototypes ready.
Sarswat words are ....

 

[p2prada]

Expect a prototype of the aesa radar with the mk-2 prototypes. The t/r modules array components have been under testing for over a couple of years now.

Hmm. I don't know about this. Looks like we will beat Russian and French development time periods by a huge margin. Unrealistic according to me.

Normally we should take 2 or 3 years "after" the first prototype is built just to get a limited production version ready. The French took 2 years.

The mk-2 will not fly without aesa. Dr Saraswat:-

DRDO Surges Ahead With 2nd Phase of AEW&CS, Plans to Integrate AESA Radar on Tejas Mark 2 as Well

It looks more like we will fly LCA Mk2 with an Israeli radar first, rather than indigenous one.

Anyway, LRDE's DP was chosen this year while RFP for it was sent out in 2009.
Livefist: EXCLUSIVE: AESA Programme For Tejas Scans For Development Partner

This was after shortlisting two contenders.
Israel, EU in contention to co-develop radars for Tejas - Indian Express

So, from what I know, Elta finally came out as the lowest bidder and contract negotiations are happening today. Which means once a contract is signed, it's only after that will we get our hands on T/R modules. After that will come the prototype R&D stage and then testing. It is impossible for LCA to fly with an indigenous AESA anytime soon.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

If i remember correctly T/R modules for AESA was devlop some time back may be a year ago, Which was based on IAI model ..

 

[rahulrds1]

DRDO (LRDE) AESA TR Module.

The basic building block of AESA is the transmit receive module or TR module. It is self-contained miniaturised transmitter and receiver making up one AESA antenna element, and contains low noise receiver, power amplifier, and digitally controlled phase/delay and gain elements. The technology significantly improves power efficiency, antenna low sidelobes and adaptive null placement to counter jamming.
The enabling technology for AESA is the Gallium Arsenide (GaAs) microwave monolithic integrated circuit (MMIC) on a single chip and hybrid microwave integrated circuit. The technology has enabled industry to mass produce TR modules with high reliability and repeatability at low cost. DRDO has developed the TR module technology in association with industrial partner.

The noise behaviour of an antenna in AESA is superior as the low noise receiver is within the antenna itself. This improves the receiver sensitivity and thereby detection range in comparison with passive phased arrays and mechanically steered arrays given other parameters being equal. DRDO has also developed L and S band T/R modules and has established production base indigenously in partnership with Indian industry.

Source: BULLETIN OF DEFENCE RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT ORGANISATION, DRDO

[ page no- 9]
[pdf]http://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/2013/TF_June_2013_WEB.pdf[/pdf]

 

[rahulrds1]

source:livefistdefence.com