ADA Tejas (LCA) News and Discussions

[manishhot]

The best advice i have seen so far.You should be made the strategic advisor of IAF.

i always spead truth

 

[tony4562]

it is the same IAF chief who asks ada and HAl to speed up LCA production to reach a figure of 100 plus within next 10 years.
And navy too wants a couple of squadrons.So what did IAF see through? (that is so top secret that you alone seem to know)

The mirage has low set wings and a plain delta.The LCA has high set wings with compound delta.Where is the similarity?
And both have different wing loadings.

After more than 250 pages of discussion you please dont jump in the middle with a comment like this.Just read all the info and point out what was so obsolete about LCA in a meaningful manner.it is a small aircraft and we have already discussed it to the smallest possible detail here.

Thanks to the untiring effort of few guys like you here I have been nominated for the best fanboy of the year award.So why are you provoking me again.Just wait till the FOC to know how obsolete or how useful it is.

General similarities between LCA and Mirage3/5/2000 are not to be denied. OK, the wings are hinged at a different place on LCA than on the Mirages, what about air intakes, vertical tail, cockpit and shape of the main body?

Also it's one thing to say how many aircrafts should be inducted, but it's a completely different thing to have them actually inducted. India too, wanted to have the indigenous upper stage for GLSV ready by 2002 and mannned space-flight by 2015, and Gorshkov sailing by 2008, has any of these things panned out yet? Many of the big talks by DRDO, IAF, or what ever, are just for the public's consumption or are just tricks to get more funding from the government, which in turn provides more opportunities for embezzlement.

Thanks for the nomination, but you nominated me for the wrong award. Award for speaking most about truth is the award I should be getting, but I don't really give a damn about anything.

 

[Apollyon]

General similarities between LCA and Mirage3/5/2000 are not to be denied. OK, the wings are hinged at a different place on LCA than on the Mirages, what about air intakes, vertical tail, cockpit and shape of the main body?

Ohh, whiner at it again.
Actually there are x100 times more similarities between J-15 and Su-33, J-11 and Su-27, J-16 and Su-30, J-10 and Lavi, HQ-9 and S-300, HT-233 and 30N6E Flap Lid / Tomb Stone series, HQ-16 and SA-11 than there are dissimilarities between LCA and Mirage 2000.

 

[tony4562]

Ohh, whiner at it again.
Actually there are x100 times more similarities between J-15 and Su-33, J-11 and Su-27, J-16 and Su-30, J-10 and Lavi, HQ-9 and S-300, HT-233 and 30N6E Flap Lid / Tomb Stone series, HQ-16 and SA-11 than there are dissimilarities between LCA and Mirage 2000.

I tend to agree with you that J-15 is a carbon copy of Su33, and HQ-9 is clearly inspired by S300, but J10 is less a copy of Lavi than LCA is a copy of Mirage. But the point we really are missing here is that China has managed to copy lots lots of things successfully whereas India has only had the capacity/capability to copy a few, and for the most part ending in failure (Akash <-> SA-6, INSAS >->FN FAL, Dehli <-> Kashin, LCA <-> Mirage, etc). Another difference, in case China, every thing down to screw level got examined and reproduced during the reverse engineering process, but DRDO even with original blue print, original parts and the guidance of blue-eyed, blonde-haired experts from the west, still could not get anything done. That's why after 2 decades of hard working China has now catapulted herself to the ranks of medium-income countries with 3 trillion dollars worth of export, meanwhile India continues to languish as one of world's absolutely poorest countries with no real hope in sight.

 

[ersakthivel]

General similarities between LCA and Mirage3/5/2000 are not to be denied. OK, the wings are hinged at a different place on LCA than on the Mirages, what about air intakes, vertical tail, cockpit and shape of the main body?

Also it's one thing to say how many aircrafts should be inducted, but it's a completely different thing to have them actually inducted. India too, wanted to have the indigenous upper stage for GLSV ready by 2002 and mannned space-flight by 2015, and Gorshkov sailing by 2008, has any of these things panned out yet? Many of the big talks by DRDO, IAF, or what ever, are just for the public's consumption or are just tricks to get more funding from the government, which in turn provides more opportunities for embezzlement.

Thanks for the nomination, but you nominated me for the wrong award. Award for speaking most about truth is the award I should be getting, but I don't really give a damn about anything.

1.Air intake is positioned above the wing and at the wingroot for mirage..Air intake is positioned below the wing and at the and behind the halfway point of the wing in tejas .

2. wing meets the fuselage at it's bottom in mirage.In LCA wing meets the fuselage at it's top.

3.Mirage is pure delta wing .tejas is compound delta.

4.Mirage is a 13 ton fighter and tejas is a 6.5 ton fighter(both loaded with fuel figure).

The only similarity is both the aircraft are tailless deltas , besides this everything else is different.

Mirage General characteristics
Crew: 1
Length: 14.36 m (47 ft 1 in)
Wingspan: 9.13 m (29 ft)
Height: 5.20 m (17 ft)
Wing area: 41 m² (441.3 ft²)
Empty weight: 7,500 kg (16,350 lb)
Loaded weight: 13,800 kg (30,420 lb)
Max. takeoff weight: 17,000 kg (37,500 lb)
Powerplant: 1 × SNECMA M53-P2 afterburning turbofan
Dry thrust: 64.3 kN (14,500 lbf)
Thrust with afterburner: 95.1 kN (21,400 lbf)
Performance
Maximum speed: Mach 2.2 (2,530+ km/h, 1,500+ mph) at high altitude/ 1,110 km/h (690 mph) at low altitude
Range: 1,550 km (837 nmi, 963 mi) with drop tanks
Ferry range: 3,335 km (1,800 nmi, 2,073 mi) with auxiliary fuel
Service ceiling: 17,060 m (59,000 ft)
Rate of climb: 285 m/s (56,000 ft/min)
Wing loading: 337 kg/m² (69 lb/ft²)
Thrust/weight: 0.91

tejas General characteristics
Crew: 1
Length: 13.20 m (43 ft 4 in)
Wingspan: 8.20 m (26 ft 11 in)
Height: 4.40 m (14 ft 9 in)
Wing area: 38.4 m² (413 ft²)
Empty weight: 6,560 kg (14,460 lb)
Loaded weight: 9,500 kg (20,944 lb)
Max. takeoff weight: 13,300 kg (29,100 lb)
Powerplant: 1 × F404-GE-IN20 turbofan
Dry thrust: 53.9 kN[87] (12,100 lbf)
Thrust with afterburner: 85 kN[88][89][90] (19,000 lbf)
Internal fuel capacity: 2,458 kg
External fuel capacity: 2 x 1,200 litre drop tank at inboard, 1 x 725-litre drop tank under fuselage
Performance
Maximum speed: Mach 1.6[84] (1,350 km/h,) at high altitude
Range: 850 km[84] (530 mi) without refueling
Combat radius: 300km ()
Ferry range: 3,000 km[91] (1,840 mi)
Service ceiling: 15,250 m[92] (50,000 ft[84])
Wing loading: 247 kg/m² (50.7 lb/ft²)
Thrust/weight: 1.07[84]
g-limits: +8/−3.5 g[93]

Please spot the similarities and post.i didnt nominate you for any position in DFI.You can go and check it.

 

[Apollyon]

@tony4562

About LCA being copy of Mirage or not :

Mirage :

LCA :

Apart from differently positioned Air-Intakes, compound delta on LCA and Tailless delta on MIrage 2000 and use of more composites on LCA they are absolutely same . India blatantly copied Mirage 2000, change the position of air intake, wing design and almost everything and called it indigenous, bloody shameless Indians .

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Don't feed the troll ...

Any man would half a brain can make out differences..

 

[vram]

Reminds me of a plane joke i saw in a newspaper cartoon section related to patent fight between apple and samsung...

Two birds sitting in a tree-
Bird 1: Look there goes another of those aeroplanes up above..
Bird 2: Whenever I see those metal things it makes me burn
Bird 1: Why ..They are so marvelous
Bird 2: Because they copied from us!!!!!!!! we patented it...humans have blatantly copied our natural body designs...
Bird 1: Gee...I guess nobody told him about flying dinosaurs that got here before us

 

[Kunal Biswas]

F-35? We Want The LCA Navy: Indian Navy Chief :thumb:

Asked today about the Indian Navy's interest in the F-35 Lightning II, Chief of Naval Staff Admiral D.K. Joshi today said that while the acquisition of a new generation fighter from abroad with "in the planning phase", the Navy was looking forward more to the LCA Navy. Lockheed-Martin has pitched both F-35B and C variants to the Indian Navy, and is understood to have made another presentation recently.

Livefist: F-35? We Want The LCA Navy: Indian Navy Chief

@Decklander

 

[Kunal Biswas]

What we know about Kavari K-10..

Chief of Russia's flight test agency: India's indigenous Turbofan Engine, Kaveri

On 4th November 2010, India's indgenously developed Turbofan engine, GTX-35VS Kaveri, successfully powered its first aircraft to flight -- a Russian IL-76 test-bed aircraft, in which one of its 4 engines was removed and replaced by the Kaveri.

Subsequently it underwent many more flight trials in Russia and is expected to be ready to power India's Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft [AMCA] & later batches of the the Mk2 version of Light Combat Aircraft, Tejas.

The tests were conducted at the Gromov Flight Research Institute, the premier flight test and certification institution in Russia. The Chief of the institute, Mr. P.N Vlasov delivered a lecture at the recently held Aero India Air Show. He also spoke about the successful flight of the aircraft that was powered by the Kaveri engine on its maiden flight itself.

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Kaveri Engine Dry & Wet Thrust Demo

Kaveri turbofan demonstrating dry thrust and reheat.

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General characteristics

Type: afterburning turbofan
Length: 137.4 in (3490 mm)
Diameter: 35.8 in (910 mm)
Dry weight: 2,724 lb (1,235 kg) [Goal: 2,100-2450 lb (950-1100 kg)]

Performance

Maximum thrust:
Military thrust (throttled): 11,687 lbf (52.0 kN)
Full afterburner: 18,210 lbf (81.0 kN)
Specific fuel consumption:
Military thrust (throttled): 0.78 lb/(lbf"¢h) (79.52 kg/(kN·h))
Full afterburner: 2.03 lb/(lbf"¢h) (207.00 kg/(kN·h))
Thrust-to-weight ratio: 7.8:1 (76.0 N/kg)

Engine cycle

Airflow: 172 lb/s (78.0 kg/s)
Bypass ratio: 0.16:1
Overall pressure ratio: 21.5:1 [Goal: 27:1]
LP compressor pressure ratio: 3.4:1 [Goal: 4:1]
HP compressor pressure ratio: 6.4:1
Turbine entry temperature: 2,218-2,601 °F (1,214-1,427 °C; 1,487-1,700 K) [Goal: 3,357 °F (1,847 °C; 2,120 K)]

GTRE GTX-35VS Kaveri - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

India could test Kaveri engine on Tejas by end-2013

India's Gas Turbine Research Establishment (GTRE) aims to integrate the Kaveri powerplant with the Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) Tejas fighter within the next nine months.A test aircraft operated by India's Aeronautical Development Agency will be used for the integration, says an industry source familiar with the programme.

India could test Kaveri engine on Tejas by end-2013

 

[asianobserve]

Why is testing of Indian indigenous jet engine being done in Russia? It will no longer be indigenous...

 

[Kunal Biswas]

Russian have test facility with IL-76 test bed and was offered to India, In India there are no spare IL-76 for test runs, Offer was beneficial and was utilized..

I am not sure what you are asking, exactly ?

Why is testing of Indian indigenous jet engine being done in Russia? It will no longer be indigenous...

 

[manishhot]

please close the lca thread lca is useless and crap , instead of developing mark 2 india should buy gripen ng. there is no use of lca.

 

[Anoop Sajwan]

please close the lca thread lca is useless and crap , instead of developing mark 2 india should buy gripen ng. there is no use of lca.

Are bhai akhitr kb tk bahar se khareedenge.

We should work on mk2. although there is only a single ray of hope, we should try to get that.

May be we fail but that will give us experience & knowledge. So that we can work on another project in future.

 

[ersakthivel]

please close the lca thread lca is useless and crap , instead of developing mark 2 india should buy gripen ng. there is no use of lca.

Please ask the mods for closing the thread.

 

[Patriot]

please close the lca thread lca is useless and crap , instead of developing mark 2 india should buy gripen ng. there is no use of lca.

WoW! what a brainer. Ok dude join politics & support Suresh Kalmadi to shelve the LCA project. As second option do not visit this thread.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

I am Mod and I dont see why it need to be Closed..

Please ask the mods for closing the thread.

 

[Kunal Biswas]

I will just leave this here..

 

[trackwhack]

please close the lca thread lca is useless and crap , instead of developing mark 2 india should buy gripen ng. there is no use of lca.

He is from Delhi and thinks it is necessary to specify the fact that he thinks he is 'hot'.

 

[ersakthivel]

please close the lca thread lca is useless and crap , instead of developing mark 2 india should buy gripen ng. there is no use of lca.

If the thread is closed ,how can we all get your deep technical insight about everything that is either right or wrong with the LCA?

Don't you think it is a great loss for the military aviation history that Manishhot's real expertise regarding everything that has gone wrong with lca can't be etched in stone if the thread is closed?