ADA Tejas (LCA) News and Discussions

[SATISH]

I would prefer the Ej-200 as minimal airframe modifications are required and is more modern than the 414.

 

[Rahul Singh]

EJ's present output may turn out to be insufficient. At 90Kn it is standing at the edge. Question arises, if ADA discovers or IAF puts a need to increase combat payload capacity, then at that stage EJ will repeat what 'F-404 IN' did..... F-414(whose thrust can be increased beyond 100KN) can meet futuristic requirements, which may arise anytime during M.L.U.

 

[SATISH]

EJ can be worked upon due to it's open architecture and it is lighter compared to the F 414. The EJ is also a newer engine compared to the F 414.

 

[Sridhar]

It is heavier by 100 kgs , if we can take care of the CG shift it should go fine as we already operating with a GE engine. But the Euro engine has advantages in high altitudes.

 

[nitesh]

I think the final choice will be the one which requires minimum change sin the air frame and future growth potential. In both cases I think EJ has an edge as compared to 414

 

[Rahul Singh]

EJ can be worked upon due to it's open architecture and it is lighter compared to the F 414. The EJ is also a newer engine compared to the F 414.

All true. But my concern is on present output. If EJ gets enhancement and manages to get +100KN, then all ok. But it should not come at great weight penalty....... BTW we should keep in mind that revised thrust requirement for LCA engine is +100KN.

 

[Rahul Singh]

I think the final choice will be the one which requires minimum change sin the air frame and future growth potential. In both cases I think EJ has an edge as compared to 414

EJ may have edge as per ADA but IAF has asked for an engine with +100KN reheated thrust. And they will not be happy to compromise on this ground. Also ADA has already said that MK-2 will be advanced or atleast contemporary. Meaning, addition of new equipments, meaning increase in weight. So by this a 90KN engine sounds risky.

 

[nitesh]

EJ may have edge as per ADA but IAF has asked for an engine with +100KN reheated thrust. And they will not be happy to compromise on this ground. Also ADA has already said that MK-2 will be advanced or atleast contemporary. Meaning, addition of new equipments, meaning increase in weight. So by this a 90KN engine sounds risky.

The point needs to be considered also is the current plus future requirement. If we take the theory that kaveri is out of equation then the current engine may be asked to improve further let's say 10 year down the line. So the future growth potential will be a key factor. Correct me if I am wrong but EJ has 30% growth potential so it should be the preffered choice

 

[Rahul Singh]

The point needs to be considered also is the current plus future requirement. If we take the theory that kaveri is out of equation then the current engine may be asked to improve further let's say 10 year down the line. So the future growth potential will be a key factor. Correct me if I am wrong but EJ has 30% growth potential so it should be the preffered choice

Nitesh. I'm saying, a +100KN, which necessarily doesn't mean F-414. However, i in my earlier posts named engine as F-414 because it is the only engine in the ferry which closes to 100KN. On other side. IAF have clearly tabled the requirement for a +100 KN engine. Tell me, how ADA will satisfy IAF with 90 KN engine? As far as my knowledge go, to do so, ADA will have to drastically modify the airframe to reduce drag to make 90KN engine do 100KN. And i don't think ADA has enough knowledge and experience in pocket to complete that much in less time.........


Yeah, some reports have claimed that EJ's thrust can be increased by 30%. But all that is still on paper. And to get 'EJ-IN', ADA might have to wait for another 3-5 years before commencing work on MK-2. Question is, can ADA or MK-2 wait that long to get development work started. You can say, to save time work can run parallel. But my question is, why should we wait, if in both cases LCA will be flying with a foreign engine.

 

[nitesh]

rahul what you are saying is right but the point I am trying to make is EJ dimension are close to kaveri/ 404 whereas 414 and dimensions are higher then current 404 is heavier wouldn't it shift the CG of plane and resulting in requirement for more time to modify the air frame and testing?

 

[Rahul Singh]

rahul what you are saying is right but the point I am trying to make is EJ dimension are close to kaveri/ 404 whereas 414 and dimensions are higher then current 404 is heavier wouldn't it shift the CG of plane and resulting in requirement for more time to modify the air frame and testing?

'Time' is a major concern and i understand this. But this is one thing. Less time in no case can be used as an excuse for performance penalty. And going by the IAF intension, i can guarantee you that IAF will ask for further improvements, at worst canceling the project. So why should ADA take risk....... On time issue. Well, GE will surely help ADA to get job done in time and for good reasons HAL has experience in handling GE engines. My point is, why ADA should not take relatively more time for sure success than less time for uncertain success.

 

[Daredevil]

This is what ADA people say about F414 according to Shiv Aroor

The American F-414-400 is physically similar, if not identical, to the F-404 that currently powers the Tejas, and is, remember, a technological derivative of the same. Therefore, it stands to reason that ADA believes the people at GE when they say the F-414 is a spot-on fit without any tinkering.

 

[Rahul Singh]

Had it been the truth, ADA would not have projected 6 year time frame for developing LCA MK-2. So claim is wrong.

 

[Daredevil]

 

[Rahul Singh]

It would be winner for EJ, if they guarantee to increase thrust by 10%(by 9KN totaling 99KN wet) without increasing weight most importantly within time(-1 year). Cost should not be the factor.

 

[SATISH]

Defunct Humanity: Indian delegation visited RD-33MK production plant

Check out the last 2 pics in the blog...Sea Wasp RD 33MK has TVC...I guess something is cooking.

 

[nitesh]

Defunct Humanity: Indian delegation visited RD-33MK production plant

Check out the last 2 pics in the blog...Sea Wasp RD 33MK has TVC...I guess something is cooking.

I too agree with this, something is cooking indeed and cooking big time

 

[Vladimir79]

Check out the last 2 pics in the blog...Sea Wasp RD 33MK has TVC...I guess something is cooking.

It is for the MiG-35. It too uses RD-33MK but with TVC. If you want your MiG-29Ks to have TVC it is a real option but it will cost more. The flight control upgrades are rather expensive. The article says they were looking at both MiG-29K and MiG-35 engines so I wouldnt' jump to a boiling pot yet.

 

[p2prada]

Defunct Humanity: Indian delegation visited RD-33MK production plant

Check out the last 2 pics in the blog...Sea Wasp RD 33MK has TVC...I guess something is cooking.

The author is just assuming. There is no official confirmation that the LCA will use RD-33s. So, don't jump the gun yet.

 

[Sridhar]

It should be part of recent agreement signed between HAL and Kilmov for 26 series 3 RD 33 engines for Mig 29 Upgrades. There was a talk of Complete TOT .