Would India give Russia a naval base in the Indian Ocean?
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LETHALFORCE
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Russians may want it at a future point in time, but with trend going the way it is USA and China will have squeezed Russia out of the Indian Ocean by then?
icecoolben
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Blok letters: India never allowed soviets berthing why should russia waning from its
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President Vladimir Putin's recent visit to India underlines the fact that the strategic alliance between India and Russia has endured well over 40 years. Although both sides continue to make the usual declarations and pledges of eternal friendship, the nature of that friendship has undergone considerable change during the past decade.
The strong links between the two countries was forged in the early 1960s as a fallout of the Cold War. India had spurned American overtures to join a military alliance, preferring to opt for, what was then a newly coined word, nonalignment.
India's honeymoon with China had ended in defeat and disillusionment 1962. The Soviet Union's relations with China had soured and Moscow was looking for a counterbalance to China in the south.
India fitted into the slot nicely. Although nonalignment required maintaining an equidistance from both Washington and Moscow, it was apparent that New Delhi was a little closer to the latter.
The bonds really became strong in 1965 when the West, taking a somewhat myopic view, refused India's genuine requirement for sophisticated weapons and arms. The Soviet Union was more than willing to fill the gap. The initial Indian hesitation to go in for Soviet arms slowly vanished when it was discovered that the Soviets had, in some areas, better equipment than was expected.
What came as a pleasant surprise was that both the price quoted by the Soviets and the terms offered would make the purchases really attractive. Over the next 40 years India's armed forces became the largest recipients of Soviet arms. Even today more than 70 per cent of the equipment in the Indian Army, Navy and the Air Force is of Soviet origin.
The Indian Navy was the largest benefactor of Soviet largesse. The Navy received Soviet submarines, missile boats, patrol vessels, destroyers and mine sweepers. Soviet long range maritime aircraft formed the backbone of the Navy's maritime recce squadrons. With Soviet assistance the Navy turned the sleepy naval base at Vishakhapatnam into a modern naval dockyard and berthing facility.
While all this was going on the Navy also kept its window open to the West, sometimes to Moscow's annoyance. The Navy purchased the British Harrier VTOL aircraft for its two carriers and went to Germany for the purchase of submarines. It also began indigenous construction of Leander frigates at Mazagon Docks, Mumbai, with initial collaboration from British shipyards.
The Indo-Soviet friendship really flowered in 1971 when India confronted Pakistani excesses in the erstwhile East Bengal. The Soviets jumped in when the West rejected Indira Gandhi's pleas for help. The resulting 20-year peace and friendship treaty was the acme of Indo-Soviet friendship. Soviet arms, some of them delivered by express means, contributed considerably to India's victory in 1971.
Of course, it was not all one sided. The Soviet Union too gained considerably from having India as its southern ally. Soviet suppression of uprisings in Hungary and Czechoslovakia drew only muted responses from New Delhi and Afghanistan found a ready friend in India during the Soviet military occupation of that country.
The alliance had other fallouts. With nearly 20 years of interaction between them, both countries developed strong emotional attachment to each other. This was especially true of Soviet military leaders. Top military officials like Admiral Gorshkov, Marshal Ustinov and Marshal Akremeyov were extremely fond of India and the Indian armed forces. It was indeed during their times that most of the military agreements between the two counties were forged.
The emotions spilled out on to the streets. Indians were treated as honoured guests in the Soviet Union. Those were the days of long queues in Moscow and it was not uncommon to find the local people asking Indians to go to the head of a long queue.
The equation began to change gradually in the late eighties. When Mikhail Gorbachev introduced perestroika, Indians, for the first time, found that equipment was no longer available at the easy prices of the 1970s. Not only did the Soviets want international prices but they were reluctant to give any long term credit on easy terms. Supply of equipment continued but at a much slower rate.
The end of the Cold War and the breakup of the Soviet Union was the beginning of the end to the cozy relationship between the two countries. Russia gave up its claims to become a superpower. The Soviet fleet terminated its presence in the Indian Ocean. Today the only Russian ships to touch Indian shores are those purchased by the ship breakers at Alang.
Side by side the roller coaster relationship between India and the United States is on the upswing again. India was the first to enroll in the fight against terrorism after 9/11. The contentious issues between the two countries have been put on the back burner. In fact, India has achieved the status of a US strategic partner in the Indian Ocean. The armed forces of the two countries carry out frequent and prolonged joint exercises, something which was unthinkable just 10 years ago.
Pakistan still remains a thorny issue between the two countries but it does not cause the acrimony it did a few years ago. In fact, India today looks to the US to use its influence in taming Pakistan and eradicating cross border terrorism.
India has also improved its relations with China and there is much interaction and trade between the two countries. No one in the world today looks at India as a bastion against Chinese expansion in the Indian Ocean.
On the other hand Indo-Russian relations have become pure business. Russia now looks to India to keep its defence industry afloat. Russia still has many friends in India but any arms deal between the two countries is beginning to draw flak. Recent reports that a frigate ordered from a Russian yard is overdue by more than a year because the missile system failed repeatedly cast doubts whether the Russians are still leaders in sophisticated military equipment that they were just 10 years ago.
Unfortunately, by putting most of their eggs in the Russian basket for the past 30 years, the Indian military is still largely dependent on that country for upkeep and support in spare parts. The prices have increased considerably, but there is little choice.
The Soviets supplied considerable military equipment to India but they did not help in the process of indigenisation. Except for the manufacture of MiG aircraft there are no other manufacturing facilities in India. India is certain to pay a heavy price for this neglect in coming years.
Admiral (retired) J G Nadkarni
US EDITION
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Recent Columns
When the Gods smiled
A brutal nation
Hollow promises
A cup half full
Scourge of the 'bandh'
This battle will
be won
Beyond boundaries
Lost opportunities
Admiral (retired) J G Nadkarni
Assessing old bonds
President Vladimir Putin's recent visit to India underlines the fact that the strategic alliance between India and Russia has endured well over 40 years. Although both sides continue to make the usual declarations and pledges of eternal friendship, the nature of that friendship has undergone considerable change during the past decade.
The strong links between the two countries was forged in the early 1960s as a fallout of the Cold War. India had spurned American overtures to join a military alliance, preferring to opt for, what was then a newly coined word, nonalignment.
India's honeymoon with China had ended in defeat and disillusionment 1962. The Soviet Union's relations with China had soured and Moscow was looking for a counterbalance to China in the south.
India fitted into the slot nicely. Although nonalignment required maintaining an equidistance from both Washington and Moscow, it was apparent that New Delhi was a little closer to the latter.
The bonds really became strong in 1965 when the West, taking a somewhat myopic view, refused India's genuine requirement for sophisticated weapons and arms. The Soviet Union was more than willing to fill the gap. The initial Indian hesitation to go in for Soviet arms slowly vanished when it was discovered that the Soviets had, in some areas, better equipment than was expected.
What came as a pleasant surprise was that both the price quoted by the Soviets and the terms offered would make the purchases really attractive. Over the next 40 years India's armed forces became the largest recipients of Soviet arms. Even today more than 70 per cent of the equipment in the Indian Army, Navy and the Air Force is of Soviet origin.
The Indian Navy was the largest benefactor of Soviet largesse. The Navy received Soviet submarines, missile boats, patrol vessels, destroyers and mine sweepers. Soviet long range maritime aircraft formed the backbone of the Navy's maritime recce squadrons. With Soviet assistance the Navy turned the sleepy naval base at Vishakhapatnam into a modern naval dockyard and berthing facility.
While all this was going on the Navy also kept its window open to the West, sometimes to Moscow's annoyance. The Navy purchased the British Harrier VTOL aircraft for its two carriers and went to Germany for the purchase of submarines. It also began indigenous construction of Leander frigates at Mazagon Docks, Mumbai, with initial collaboration from British shipyards.
The Indo-Soviet friendship really flowered in 1971 when India confronted Pakistani excesses in the erstwhile East Bengal. The Soviets jumped in when the West rejected Indira Gandhi's pleas for help. The resulting 20-year peace and friendship treaty was the acme of Indo-Soviet friendship. Soviet arms, some of them delivered by express means, contributed considerably to India's victory in 1971.
Of course, it was not all one sided. The Soviet Union too gained considerably from having India as its southern ally. Soviet suppression of uprisings in Hungary and Czechoslovakia drew only muted responses from New Delhi and Afghanistan found a ready friend in India during the Soviet military occupation of that country.
The alliance had other fallouts. With nearly 20 years of interaction between them, both countries developed strong emotional attachment to each other. This was especially true of Soviet military leaders. Top military officials like Admiral Gorshkov, Marshal Ustinov and Marshal Akremeyov were extremely fond of India and the Indian armed forces. It was indeed during their times that most of the military agreements between the two counties were forged.
The emotions spilled out on to the streets. Indians were treated as honoured guests in the Soviet Union. Those were the days of long queues in Moscow and it was not uncommon to find the local people asking Indians to go to the head of a long queue.
The equation began to change gradually in the late eighties. When Mikhail Gorbachev introduced perestroika, Indians, for the first time, found that equipment was no longer available at the easy prices of the 1970s. Not only did the Soviets want international prices but they were reluctant to give any long term credit on easy terms. Supply of equipment continued but at a much slower rate.
The end of the Cold War and the breakup of the Soviet Union was the beginning of the end to the cozy relationship between the two countries. Russia gave up its claims to become a superpower. The Soviet fleet terminated its presence in the Indian Ocean. Today the only Russian ships to touch Indian shores are those purchased by the ship breakers at Alang.
Side by side the roller coaster relationship between India and the United States is on the upswing again. India was the first to enroll in the fight against terrorism after 9/11. The contentious issues between the two countries have been put on the back burner. In fact, India has achieved the status of a US strategic partner in the Indian Ocean. The armed forces of the two countries carry out frequent and prolonged joint exercises, something which was unthinkable just 10 years ago.
Pakistan still remains a thorny issue between the two countries but it does not cause the acrimony it did a few years ago. In fact, India today looks to the US to use its influence in taming Pakistan and eradicating cross border terrorism.
India has also improved its relations with China and there is much interaction and trade between the two countries. No one in the world today looks at India as a bastion against Chinese expansion in the Indian Ocean.
On the other hand Indo-Russian relations have become pure business. Russia now looks to India to keep its defence industry afloat. Russia still has many friends in India but any arms deal between the two countries is beginning to draw flak. Recent reports that a frigate ordered from a Russian yard is overdue by more than a year because the missile system failed repeatedly cast doubts whether the Russians are still leaders in sophisticated military equipment that they were just 10 years ago.
Unfortunately, by putting most of their eggs in the Russian basket for the past 30 years, the Indian military is still largely dependent on that country for upkeep and support in spare parts. The prices have increased considerably, but there is little choice.
The Soviets supplied considerable military equipment to India but they did not help in the process of indigenisation. Except for the manufacture of MiG aircraft there are no other manufacturing facilities in India. India is certain to pay a heavy price for this neglect in coming years.
Admiral (retired) J G Nadkarni
Vladimir79
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False, Russian ships participate in every INDRA exercise.
False, the US itself views India as containment of Chinese expansion.
False, we have given license for India to produce their own parts.
False, India manufactures Su-30MKI and the T-90 Bhishma.
Admiral (retired) J G Nadkarni is clearly in the pro-US lobby with these untruths.
proud_hindustani
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If russia sets its bases in different territories of India. other countries like china and pakistan will have to think several time before attacking on india.
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1.Russia needs more(2-3) permanent friends in subcontinent to think about such bases.
2.@ LF if India agrees to proposals which piece of land you think will be appropriate.
3.There are chances that US and chines (CPI etc) lobby will become active to do false propaganda and we Indians will follow the suite thus may jeopardize our relations with Russia.
4. Its always better to play on first priority when it is your own backyard, your wickets, bat, ball and gear than asking some one else to bat first. As we are very trustworthy friends of Russia,so its better to make sure/tell our friend that we will always keep his interest in Indian ocean protected. Thus he should help us(India) directly with all possible technical Geo political support for that sake, In a very blunt term to be Russian Partial Proxy. A very wild-wild assumption of mine is that if that was the case ever that India was so cordial with Russian aspiration in past she would have never done the invasion of Afghanistan. India could have acted as her strategic and logistical base at that time. The bluff of Indira to plan attack on Diego Garcia has set precedent to that. I think negotiating with India on such bold proposals is always a difficult task (tedi kheer) and Russians know it very well.
(Which is fair enough; serving own interest is way to go, we don't want other superpowers to be our permanent enemies. examples like Pakistan are always helpful to understand its Pros and Cons.
)
2.@ LF if India agrees to proposals which piece of land you think will be appropriate.
3.There are chances that US and chines (CPI etc) lobby will become active to do false propaganda and we Indians will follow the suite thus may jeopardize our relations with Russia.
4. Its always better to play on first priority when it is your own backyard, your wickets, bat, ball and gear than asking some one else to bat first. As we are very trustworthy friends of Russia,so its better to make sure/tell our friend that we will always keep his interest in Indian ocean protected. Thus he should help us(India) directly with all possible technical Geo political support for that sake, In a very blunt term to be Russian Partial Proxy. A very wild-wild assumption of mine is that if that was the case ever that India was so cordial with Russian aspiration in past she would have never done the invasion of Afghanistan. India could have acted as her strategic and logistical base at that time. The bluff of Indira to plan attack on Diego Garcia has set precedent to that. I think negotiating with India on such bold proposals is always a difficult task (tedi kheer) and Russians know it very well.
(Which is fair enough; serving own interest is way to go, we don't want other superpowers to be our permanent enemies. examples like Pakistan are always helpful to understand its Pros and Cons.
)Vladimir79
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Russian admirals just confirmed that we are indeed building a base in Syria.
Russia will have home to the Navy in Syria
This means we are going to be defacto Syrian protector from Usraeli aggression and will put alot of conflict between us and the US. What Putin doesn't want is to cause alot of conflict with our Chinese neighbours, of which placing a base in India will most certainly do.
icecoolben
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The soviets were our strategic protectors within their nuclear umbrella. They sought berthing in india. but our government refused citing non-aligned status. But vietnam granted its cam rahn naval base, even that country understood that russia won't be able to secure it as it asked for $ 200 million per annum since 1992 and the russians moved out. The russians didn't wish to renew the indo-soviet treaty of friendship, when it lapsed in 2001, the russians way back as 1992 requested to remove the security clause from the treaty. So how will the russians guarentee our security with a base in the region. We are reluctant to sign a logictics agreement with the Us. Will v lease a base to a foreign power? The answer is a big NO. the best india and russia can do is work together and shun chinese influence in the central asian region.
Further more the indian navy prefers to work with the US navy to protect the sea lanes, as well as check china. The absence of training and inter-operability between russian and indian naval forces also indicates a shift in the doctrinal thinking of the indian navy which has shifted from a sea denial navy to a blue water navy. Further the gokskov carrier saga has left the indian navy having floped big time since the hdw scandal. So a maritime cooperation is not seen fruitifying in the coming years. With india becoming a self capable navy with its submarine nuclear arm being forged by arihant and the akula-2 would not need russian umbrella like the syrians do. The russians too are more than happy to arm india rather than support it by its own arms. Thus it is safe to say the indian bases are not on the cards of any foreign powers at least for the time being.
Further more the indian navy prefers to work with the US navy to protect the sea lanes, as well as check china. The absence of training and inter-operability between russian and indian naval forces also indicates a shift in the doctrinal thinking of the indian navy which has shifted from a sea denial navy to a blue water navy. Further the gokskov carrier saga has left the indian navy having floped big time since the hdw scandal. So a maritime cooperation is not seen fruitifying in the coming years. With india becoming a self capable navy with its submarine nuclear arm being forged by arihant and the akula-2 would not need russian umbrella like the syrians do. The russians too are more than happy to arm india rather than support it by its own arms. Thus it is safe to say the indian bases are not on the cards of any foreign powers at least for the time being.
Indo-Russian partnership is already on firm ground. We must not complicate it by providing Russia a base on our land, instead both nations can seek bases in Indian Ocean and African territory and then coordinate/support each other. Providing Russia a base in India will not serve any of our long-term strategic interest, maintaining a little distance is always good for Indo-Russia relation and for serving their geo-political interest.
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The real question is would Russia be able to pay for the upkeep and maintenace of a naval base in the IOR , and even if an agreement could be worked out would the RN be able to place viable naval assets there?
When India tried to gain a air-base in Central-Asia ( Farkhor Air Base in Tajikistan), Russia virtually crippled it. Now we are talking about providing them with a base in Indian Ocean, on our land. Its imperative that India improves her defence capabilities, and estabilishes herself as a formidable force, we need to gain as many friends internationally as we can, keeping relations with Russia on a sound footing. We must pursue our defence and foreign policies independently on the basis of equality. We must seek partners, not defenders.
Vladimir79
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The real question is would India allow Russia to place a base there. The answer is no... Only weak nations that can't protect themselves ask for bases from bigger powers.
According to the hidden diplomacy and pacts, both India and Russia can utilize others bases as per the need arises.Both governments have been successfully extending the once signed pact by Indira during the 70`s which also includes the mutual use of others bases and air space in case of a war with a nation which is hostile to both.
But the same agreement does provide a clause of sharing of weaponry and systems if needed be.
Hence neither russia nor India dont necessarily need to have a base and special maintenance for their respective forces.
The pact is also a matter of concern to both China and US.
Apart from the open sources which talk about the port calls ,Russia has sent its SSBN`s for patrol into IOR as many times.
Simply put,strategic ties between India and Russia dont publicly show off.
But the same agreement does provide a clause of sharing of weaponry and systems if needed be.
Hence neither russia nor India dont necessarily need to have a base and special maintenance for their respective forces.
The pact is also a matter of concern to both China and US.
Apart from the open sources which talk about the port calls ,Russia has sent its SSBN`s for patrol into IOR as many times.
Simply put,strategic ties between India and Russia dont publicly show off.
icecoolben
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But still v are not under moscow's nuclear umbrella, are we? V have to fend for our own in the face of massive chinese nuclear strike. Better build our own capabilities and assistance from russia is always welcome.
take a look at this.....mumbai is not a naval base...navy shares the base with civilian ships...thats why several accidents are happened in mumbai....only karwar and visakhapatnam are actual major navar base which are under construction now........
does that simply Japan as a week country ?since it has a USN base?
Japan can protect itself and may even go aggressively against the invader given its defensive posture is overturned.
Lending bases to other countries are based on strategical implications.
If X is lending a base to Y means,X and Y are aligned and transmits a signal world wide.IT does come with advantages and disadvantages.
Wotever India and Russia are doing on their part is simply great.
Vladimir79
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Japan is a weak country because they were defeated by the USSR and ran to US to protect them. US keeps them weak under their constitution. If you haven't noticed, Japan wants to get rid of US bases because they want to be strong again which only enforces the concept.
Really? Case and point --- Do you see the US lending bases to other nations? Didn't think so.
What India and Russia are doing is strategic partnership. We conduct joint naval exercises every couple of years, we train Indian officers and engineers, have joint development projects but we could do more. Like large land maneuvers, we most definetely would if we weren't seperated by hostile countries.
icecoolben
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Ussr never entered the main battle field against japan
Its not my place to say, but national rheotic seldom inspires in a neutral venue.
the russian empire got whipped by japan in 1905. They were lucky to be allied to japan during ww1. And japan must have thought russia would be a push over for germany and so wouldn't have gotten worked up about it. the ussr feared a japanese invasion till 1944, when kgb and allied intelligence confirmed that japan had infinitely postponed invasion of japan till conquest of main-land china to australia. When they soviets were on the offence by early 1945 in korea. Japan was already overvelmed by us forces and the soviets even offered the us their assistance to invade mainland japan this was equalent of killing a dead snake. But the us feared a north/south japan like korea. So they bombed japan to surrender.
Its not my place to say, but national rheotic seldom inspires in a neutral venue.
