Worrisome rise of Chinese nationalism

no smoking

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I find you are an interesting chap interested in horticulture.

We are no fools.

You can do your twisting of facts. It is inbuilt!

Don't underestimate Sunni Muslims!

You do so at your peril!

They are not pacifist Buddhist Tibetans!
We are not vegetarian either (chinese joke). If terrorism cannot defeat the americans and indians, I don't see how it can work on us.

Religion is the TOPMOST agenda in China. That is why you control and appoint the Clergy. You control their Sermons and you prevent them from religious instructions to their children!

Anything more to be said?
Well, since you know sth about chinese history, you should know we had wars for all kinds of reason except religion. Why? Because no ruller in chinese history allows any religion to be a politics force. They always made the religion under the control, CCP just followed this policy.

And another interesting thing is that chinese public had no problem with this policy in the last 2000 years. We initiated riot or civil against gov corruption, foreign ruler or political ambition, but never ever for religion.
 

Ray

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The fact that religion is suppressed and controlled by the CCP is indicative that the CCP is afraid of the power of religion and what it can do.
 

nimo_cn

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The fact that religion is suppressed and controlled by the CCP is indicative that the CCP is afraid of the power of religion and what it can do.
To some extent, you are right about CCP is afraid of the power of religion, but the precondition of this concern is that religion has become a political force, which in fact has rarely happened in the history of China, neither will happen in the future. So for now, CCP has nothing to worry about.

And i dont like the word suppress, it is too strong, i think the word regulate is more appropriate. Religion is not suppressed in China. There is religion freedom in China, people can choose whatever religion they like, Buddism, Christianism, Taoism, etc, as long as it doesn't cause conflict among people and jeopardize the stability of the society. And in order to make sure that, regulations are established to guide the people to practice their religion. But the interesting thing here is that these regulations are always used to prove that China suppresses religion.
 

stax

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The fact that religion is suppressed and controlled by the CCP is indicative that the CCP is afraid of the power of religion and what it can do.
Some of my friends are Christians, some are believe in buddha. There are many churches and temples in China. We respect the human rights of believing in a religion. But we can't tolerate a religious leader to threaten our country... We just seperate the religion and politcs.
 

ZOOM

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Some of my friends are Christians, some are believe in buddha. There are many churches and temples in China. We respect the human rights of believing in a religion. But we can't tolerate a religious leader to threaten our country... We just seperate the religion and politcs.
Giving a freedom to religion has nothing do with mixing politics with the same, rather you should say that religion has a kind of a power which is more then enough to surpass any bruthal regulation upon which CCP thrives.
 

Vladimir79

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Some of my friends are Christians, some are believe in buddha. There are many churches and temples in China. We respect the human rights of believing in a religion. But we can't tolerate a religious leader to threaten our country... We just seperate the religion and politcs.

Chinese Christian Leaders Jailed for Trying to Stop Church Demolition


Five leaders of a Christian church group of about 60,000 believers were sentenced to three to seven years in prison on Wednesday, November 25, in Northern China.

The Christian leaders--including Pastor Wang Xiaoguang, and two women, Yang Rongli and Zhang Huamei--were arrested in mid September for trying to stop their congregation buildings from being torn down.

According to a Chinese rights group, Chinese Human Rights Defenders, the Deputy County Chief of Fushan County led 400 police and unidentified men to attack the Christians on September 13th at 3:00 a.m. Some were beaten unconscious and had to be taken to the hospital.

The Christian leaders were charged with “illegally occupying land” and “assembling to disrupt public order.” The sentence was given at a court in Linfen City, Shanxi Province. The defendants were not allowed to respond to the charges.

Their lawyer, Li Fanping, told AFP, “I was shocked at the seriousness of the punishment. This shows that the government is intent on using the law as a tool to attack the church.”

Chinese authorities are reported to have brought tractors and excavators to destroy the unregistered house church—a large farm warehouse. It hasn’t been torn down yet, but a police guard prevented the congregation from meeting.

The Chinese regime requires religious groups to register with the Chinese Communist Party. Those who want to be independent are forced to practice their faith “underground.”

Chinese Christian Leaders Jailed for Trying to Stop Church Demolition ? New Tang Dynasty Television
 

no smoking

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Giving a freedom to religion has nothing do with mixing politics with the same, rather you should say that religion has a kind of a power which is more then enough to surpass any bruthal regulation upon which CCP thrives.
Well, you may like the idea that religion has a kind of that power. But that is not the case for chinese. After 2000 years of "Brainwash", there is very few chinese would fiercely defend their religion. We only defend something with real meaning, just like money, treasury, national interest, life etc. As for god, since he or she is god, he or she can take care of themselves, right?

CCP once acknowledged there were 80,000 protests and riots in china in each year. How many is related to religion, i guess less than 100.

In one word, we don't take religion too seriously.
 

stax

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Giving a freedom to religion has nothing do with mixing politics with the same, rather you should say that religion has a kind of a power which is more then enough to surpass any bruthal regulation upon which CCP thrives.
Do you mean a "brutal regulation"? I don't think our goverment is brutal. Decades ago politics integrated with religion in Tibet. But there were also many local residents living in a miserable and tragic life as slaves and serfs. It is more brutal than CCP a thousand times. Following is a picture of a surf working in shackles:
 

Vladimir79

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It seems there is a rising number of Christians who take their religion serious, serious enough to face prison or even death. The more you persecute them the more power they will gain. Like the early Roman Empire, they faced the odds and turned an entire continent into the domain of Christ. You have already had to form a state church to try to control them but it has failed. Underground worship is growing by the thousands day by day. People need spirituality in their lives and this is quite evident in China.
 

Ray

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The Chinese government has relentlessly suppressed religious groups since achieving power in 1949. The rest of the world is most familiar with its oppression of non-registered Christian groups. However, the government has also persecuted many types of new religious and spiritual groups, including the Falun Gong. In fact, its suppression extends beyond such groups to include organizations that teach only simple meditation and gymnastic techniques. The government appears to fear any national group that is capable of organizing its followers into direct action.

In suppressing the Falun Dafa and other small religious movements, the Chinese government has adopted much of the terminology of the Western anti-cult movement. The official Xinhua News Agency issued a report on "cults" in the United States. 1 It quoted Berkley psychology professor Margaret Singer, one of the few remaining psychologists who supports the claims of the anti-cult movement. The report discusses "spiritual poisoning." Cults are said to "not obey the law, they upset social order, and they create a menace to freedom of religion and social stability. Under the pretense of religion, kindness, and being non-political, they participate in political activities. Some of them even practice criminal activities such as tax evasion, fraud, drug dealing, smuggling, assassination, and kidnapping."

The government appears to regard the Falun Dafa as the most serious threat to the government since the 1989 student uprising. The government has historical reasons for their fear. China has had a history of religious and spiritual uprisings that had catastrophic effects on the country. "In the late 1770s, the White Lotus rebellion against the Qing dynasty was led by Wang Lun, a master of martial arts and herbal medicine." 2 Perhaps the most serious was the Taiping rebellion of 1845-1864 which was led by a leader who viewed himself as the Son of God. Some 20 million died in that revolt. 2.......

The year 2000 report of the U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom criticized the government of China for its brutal repression of the Falun Gong spiritual movement, Tibetan Buddhists, Roman Catholics and other groups. An unidentified spokesperson for the Chinese government denied the validity of the report. He responded: "Relying solely on rumors and lies to accuse other governments and interfere in internal affairs of other countries is a mistake repeatedly made by the U.S. State Department report. This bad habit should be addressed." 6

More at:

Religious oppression and intolerance in China
 

no smoking

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It seems there is a rising number of Christians who take their religion serious, serious enough to face prison or even death. The more you persecute them the more power they will gain. Like the early Roman Empire, they faced the odds and turned an entire continent into the domain of Christ. You have already had to form a state church to try to control them but it has failed. Underground worship is growing by the thousands day by day. People need spirituality in their lives and this is quite evident in China.
I cannot help laughing at this statement. This can only be made by a person who know nothing about chinese culture. Yes, there is a rising number of christians, but I doubt the so called believer take it seriously. Today, we can believe in christian, tomorrow we can turn to another religion.

Using rome as the example, I must say your imagination iis beyond my expectation. If china alrady exsits for 2000 years without religion, why do you think we need it desperately now?

Yes, we need spirituality in our lives. That is why we have allowed religion in china. But, don't overestimate how much we would like it to play in our lives.
 

Vladimir79

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I cannot help laughing at this statement. This can only be made by a person who know nothing about chinese culture. Yes, there is a rising number of christians, but I doubt the so called believer take it seriously. Today, we can believe in christian, tomorrow we can turn to another religion.
I cannot help laughing at this statement. This can only be made by a person who concerns not for the rampant effects of immoratily raging in their society. With no one to guide them, religion is the only comfort these people have to turn to. 70 million people don't attend underground churches to face prison because they don't take it seriously. :sarcastic:

Using rome as the example, I must say your imagination iis beyond my expectation. If china alrady exsits for 2000 years without religion, why do you think we need it desperately now?
Because you are entering a new era of capitalisation which brings much injustice, corruption, greed, pollution, and uncertainty which your government lacks sufficient controls to curb. China has never faced this kind of society before and the CCP does not provide the moral guidance necessary to navigate it. Christianity does as has been seen countless times.

Yes, we need spirituality in our lives. That is why we have allowed religion in china. But, don't overestimate how much we would like it to play in our lives.
CCP has only allowed their version of religion they use to control people along party lines. Underground Churches are popping up all over China in disregard to state control and followers of Christ are imprisoned regularly. It doesn't stop the spread, it only invigorates it as people need spirituality in their lives. You tout the party line, but it isn't the true words of the people. I know you may be arrested if you speak out so I won't expect your true feelings here. Don't worry brother, I will pray for you and all Han that the light of truth will be brought to the Celestial Empire and that freedom to express your spirituality will be permitted.
 

Ray

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I cannot help laughing at this statement. This can only be made by a person who know nothing about chinese culture. Yes, there is a rising number of christians, but I doubt the so called believer take it seriously. Today, we can believe in christian, tomorrow we can turn to another religion.
If China does not take the rising number seriously, then why are the Bishops appointed by the CCP?

In every other country, it is by the Vatican?

Using rome as the example, I must say your imagination iis beyond my expectation. If china alrady exsits for 2000 years without religion, why do you think we need it desperately now?
Indeed, I wonder why China is so afraid of religion!

Yes, we need spirituality in our lives. That is why we have allowed religion in china. But, don't overestimate how much we would like it to play in our lives.
Indeed Mao was your God who gave you Godless religionism and now Deng and his theory of - who bothers about the colour of the cat so long as it catches mice.

In short, shameless Opportunism is your Religion and God!
 

stax

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If China does not take the rising number seriously, then why are the Bishops appointed by the CCP?
In every other country, it is by the Vatican?
I think Christians should believe in God, not Vatican. Does Bible say Bishops must be appointed by Vatican? Why you guys just care about Bishops? Since Bishops have power?

A Christian should do what God advocates to do, don't do what God doesn't like. God should always be in a Chritian's heart.

If someone believes in God just for powers and politics, it is really a shame!
Indeed Mao was your God who gave you Godless religionism and now Deng and his theory of - who bothers about the colour of the cat so long as it catches mice.

In short, shameless Opportunism is your Religion and God!
I respect God. But you just mentioned God in such a disrepective way, in a shameful joke!
 

ppgj

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I think Christians should believe in God, not Vatican.
let the christians in china decide it.

Does Bible say Bishops must be appointed by Vatican? Why you guys just care about Bishops? Since Bishops have power?
no. but neither it says that they should be appointed by the CCP.
people are only caring about the religious freedom and rights of the christians.

A Christian should do what God advocates to do, don't do what God doesn't like. God should always be in a Chritian's heart.
provided they have the freedom to do that. if CCP is the god, what you expect?

If someone believes in God just for powers and politics, it is really a shame
if some one does not believe in god just for powers and politics(like in china) what then?
 

mattster

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Dose of reality about the "great nation of China".

You guys are talking about the Chinese government being afraid of religion.

Why such a big issue as religion - China is the only major nation in the history of this planet that I know of that officially kidnapped a 6 year old boy - the Pachen Lama who was ordained by the current Dalai Lama to be the next Dalai Lama. He and his family have never been heard from. The Chinese government has even officially admitted it.

The boy and his family were abducted by the Chinese government when he was 6 years old !!!!!!!!!!!!!

All you DFI members including the Chinese guys; Just pause for a few seconds, take a deep breath and ask yourself a very simple question - Which major power in a last 1000 years has ever kidnapped a 6 year old boy ????



How freaking bankrupt a society can you be if you are afraid of a 6 year old baby !

That is China for you today, folks - so why are you suprised if they are afraid of a much more powerful Catholic church when this so-called next great power is afraid of a child ??
 

Vladimir79

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I think Christians should believe in God, not Vatican.
Most Christians in China are not Catholic. The vast majority of them are Protestant so they aren't praying to Vatican City.

Does Bible say Bishops must be appointed by Vatican?
Protestants don't have anything to do with Vatican.

Why you guys just care about Bishops? Since Bishops have power?
If you refer to denominations that have bishops, their purpose is to run their domain as all organisations have hierarchy. As men who devote their lives to studying the scripture and ordained by those who have done it even longer, they are the source of teaching and guidance. Power of the church is a thing of the past, they don't have power in this day and age except to run their assignment.

A Christian should do what God advocates to do, don't do what God doesn't like. God should always be in a Chritian's heart.
Duh...

If someone believes in God just for powers and politics, it is really a shame!
So Christians in China believe in God just for power and politics? :sarcastic:
 

huanle

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You guys are talking about the Chinese government being afraid of religion.

Why such a big issue as religion - China is the only major nation in the history of this planet that I know of that officially kidnapped a 6 year old boy - the Pachen Lama who was ordained by the current Dalai Lama to be the next Dalai Lama. He and his family have never been heard from. The Chinese government has even officially admitted it.

The boy and his family were abducted by the Chinese government when he was 6 years old !!!!!!!!!!!!!

All you DFI members including the Chinese guys; Just pause for a few seconds, take a deep breath and ask yourself a very simple question - Which major power in a last 1000 years has ever kidnapped a 6 year old boy ????



How freaking bankrupt a society can you be if you are afraid of a 6 year old baby !

That is China for you today, folks - so why are you suprised if they are afraid of a much more powerful Catholic church when this so-called next great power is afraid of a child ??
you should know what is panchen
Panchen Lama - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 

stax

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You guys are talking about the Chinese government being afraid of religion.

Why such a big issue as religion - China is the only major nation in the history of this planet that I know of that officially kidnapped a 6 year old boy - the Pachen Lama who was ordained by the current Dalai Lama to be the next Dalai Lama. He and his family have never been heard from. The Chinese government has even officially admitted it.

The boy and his family were abducted by the Chinese government when he was 6 years old !!!!!!!!!!!!!

All you DFI members including the Chinese guys; Just pause for a few seconds, take a deep breath and ask yourself a very simple question - Which major power in a last 1000 years has ever kidnapped a 6 year old boy ????



How freaking bankrupt a society can you be if you are afraid of a 6 year old baby !

That is China for you today, folks - so why are you suprised if they are afraid of a much more powerful Catholic church when this so-called next great power is afraid of a child ??


Do you know whom this serf belongs to? Dalai lama!

Can you tell me why thousands of children were slaves and serfs when Dalai lama in Tibet? Why they were working in shackles?
 

F-14

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it is a thumb rule buddy do not belive communist propganda take it with a pinch of salt
 

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