United Kingdom's Daughters

[Kay]

Ban was not the issue, issue is that there was no official explanation of the ban.

GOI was free to lodge protest against the show citing official reasons. GOI quoted technical issues for the ban while statements from officials indicated the main reason for the ban was ideological. Ban is not ok - not only for this, but anything.

 

[ezsasa]

GOI was free to lodge protest against the show citing official reasons. GOI quoted technical issues for the ban while statements from officials indicated the main reason for the ban was ideological. Ban is not ok - not only for this, but anything.

Hypothetically : how would you feel if the killer gets his sentence commuted/delayed due to judge being influenced by the media trail?

 

[Kay]

@thethinker
Yes. The case of the documentary is definitely different - and GOI has/had the right to protest against it. But the reasons have to be clear and banning it does no good.

 

[Samar Rathi]

Anybody watching the Daily Show, the Nightly Show, the Colbert Report (concluded in 2014), Last Week Tonight by John Oliver and similar shows very well understand that not all is not well with the US.
These shows raise important issues in the form of satirical comedy. But they do help in generating awareness. In a representative democracy, we should constantly criticize (both positively and negatively) our government and politicians and hold them accountable for their jobs. Same goes with society and who's who of society. Would banning these shows help?
Here is the Last Week Tonight episode criticizing US prison system:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Pz3syET3DY

Hey mr nobody saying downplay this but they are generalizing Indian men as rapist which they are not so tell me if you agree to her concept than tell me how many women you raped?

Acording to her Indian society is rapist sick society.

 

[thethinker]

@thethinker
Yes. The case of the documentary is definitely different - and GOI has/had the right to protest against it. But the reasons have to be clear and banning it does no good.

The documentary was banned primarily on legal grounds as Udwin refused to comply with local laws.

Making that seem as if there is no free speech in India or the govt bans everything that is critical about India is incorrect. Western news channels reporting however have left no stone unturned in depicting the whole issue that way.

And just to be clear, Udwin seems to think that the documentary is a "gift to India".

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BBC documentary ‘India’s Daughter’ forces Bar Council to discuss ‘anti-woman remarks’ by lawyers | The Financial Express

On her part, Udwin appealed to Prime Minister Narendra Modi to view the documentary, which, she said, was a "gift to India", before any action was taken on it.

She said India has shown the lead globally in the wake of the horrific crime which had led to protests across the country. Rape was an issue of global concern which she has highlighted in the documentary, she said.

 

[Samar Rathi]

@thethinker
Yes. The case of the documentary is definitely different - and GOI has/had the right to protest against it. But the reasons have to be clear and banning it does no good.

Govt protest against BBC ?

are you kidding me?

whole world will laugh at us if Indian govt protest against some willy nilly foreign media :|

 

[Samar Rathi]

@thethinker
Yes. The case of the documentary is definitely different - and GOI has/had the right to protest against it. But the reasons have to be clear and banning it does no good.

Govt protest against BBC ?

are you kidding me?

whole world will laugh at us if Indian govt protest against some willy nilly foreign media :|

 

[ladder]

What is the issue? The documentary shouldn't be banned because the poster feelz so. The arguments that you provide will be skirted or he will agree. Thus he will write, 'I agree with all your points but I think the documentary shouldn't be banned'.

Conclusion,

Feelz>>>> Reason.

 

[Kay]

Hypothetically : how would you feel if the killer gets his sentence commuted/delayed due to judge being influenced by the media trail?

Frankly, the fear of the opposite is true. These four criminals are expected to get harsher sentences than people committing similar atrocities elsewhere in the country because of the symbolic nature of this case. Everybody wants to see them dead as opposed to deal with the greater issues, which are difficult to solve. The defense lawyer, among a number of stupid statements in the video pointed to one important thing - there are members of the parliament with pending rape charges. Should fast track courts apply to them as well? Would they receive similar judgements as well?
Justice is about fairness. It should be equal to all. If that is not met, people lose faith in the judicial system.
Personally, I am against capital punishments.

 

[ladder]

Typical frog in the well attitude.

Home Ministry asks States to fasttrack cases against MPs, MLAs

Home Ministry asks States to fasttrack cases against MPs, MLAs - The Hindu

 

[Kay]

@thethinker
The legal grounds are contested.
I am aware of the propaganda associated with the video.
The fact remains, that the ban failed and the government was the one who came out in poor light.

 

[sorcerer]

Govt protest against BBC ?

are you kidding me?

whole world will laugh at us if Indian govt protest against some willy nilly foreign media :|

So..just because the whole world will laugh at us means we should play along their propaganda?
Didnt they do the same thing against Devyani Case?
didnt they do the same thing when the old man was beaten up by US cops?

Govt should protest against any agency violating soverign rights of a country whether BBC or White house themselves.

 

[Samar Rathi]

So..just because the whole world will laugh at us means we should play along their propaganda?
Didnt they do the same thing against Devyani Case?
didnt they do the same thing when the old man was beaten up by US cops?

Govt should protest against any agency violating soverign rights of a country whether BBC or White house themselves.

My friend we protested against USA state department and judicial system and not on fox news ,i suppose you understand my point.

 

[ladder]

So..just because the whole world will laugh at us means we should play along their propaganda?
Didnt they do the same thing against Devyani Case?
didnt they do the same thing when the old man was beaten up by US cops?

Govt should protest against any agency violating soverign rights of a country whether BBC or White house themselves.

He says don't protest but take action. BBC violated Indian Law, so why protest? Take action for violating law.

 

[ezsasa]

Frankly, the fear of the opposite is true. These four criminals are expected to get harsher sentences than people committing similar atrocities elsewhere in the country because of the symbolic nature of this case. Everybody wants to see them dead as opposed to deal with the greater issues, which are difficult to solve. The defense lawyer, among a number of stupid statements in the video pointed to one important thing - there are members of the parliament with pending rape charges. Should fast track courts apply to them as well? Would they receive similar judgements as well?
Justice is about fairness. It should be equal to all. If that is not met, people lose faith in the judicial system.
Personally, I am against capital punishments.

So let me see if I am getting it right, you are saying these should not be hanged?

Coming back to my original question, ban technically was because the sentencing was sub judice. The assumption is that judges may be influenced by the media trail.

As per the amended law, death sentence is awarded only in the case of rarest of rare cases.

Justice is not about fairness, it is about the arguments and evidence. Fairness has nothing to do with it. This is one of first lessons judges are taught when they enter the academy. Remember "the lady is blind".

 

[sorcerer]

My friend we protested against USA state department and judicial system and not on fox news ,i suppose you understand my point.

Perhaps you should understand that in PROPAGANDA State dept use Media as a tool.
You can read about 5th estate on wiki and how they work.

So Naturally India protested against the Media.

People who say protesting against media made it worse is saying the same line as protesting rape kills the woman and make it more violent.
Its a parallel..

 

[thethinker]

@thethinker
The legal grounds are contested.
I am aware of the propaganda associated with the video.
The fact remains, that the ban failed and the government was the one who came out in poor light.

your discussion was about :

satire shows in US criticize their govt and don't get banned. So why this documentary was banned.

That comparison with this Brit documentary was invalid that's all.

 

[sorcerer]

He says don't protest but take action. BBC violated Indian Law, so why protest? Take action for violating law.

Okay..I missed that point..my bad.
I agree.. Thats something I wished GoI did. but wont the sickulars cry it as violation of freedom of speech?

 

[sorcerer]

UK has fifth highest number of rapes, claims new video
LONDON: Britain has the fifth highest number of rapes in the world but only one in 10 rapists are convicted, according to a video made by an Indian here in response to the BBC's controversial documentary which has been banned in India.

Leslee Udwin's documentary 'India's Daughter', which featured an interview with Mukesh Singh, one of five men convicted of the brutal gangrape and murder of a Delhi student in 2012, caused anger in India among nationalists who felt it had sought to tarnish the country's reputation and suggest many Indian men believed women were to blame for rape.

According to a report in The Telegraph, video-maker Harvinder Singh released 'United Kingdom's Daughter' in response to the controversial documentary to show how sexual violence is a universal problem and not unique to India.

The video begins with dramatic music and pictures of cowering, traumatised women, as subtitles highlight the scale of Britain's grim rape and sexual violence statistics.

"United Kingdom is fifth at the world's rape list," it said.

"The number of rapes is more because many do not report," it added.

"Ten per cent of women in the United Kingdom experience sexual victimisation," but "a third of Britons believe women are responsible for rape," the film claimed in a direct response to the BBC's documentary which suggested the views of a convicted gangrapist and murderer were more widely shared.

In the response video, a selection of photographs, graphic statistics and clips from another BBC documentary, the producer claimed women in Britain "don't resist the rape so killing figures are a few."

The claims made in his video reflect a widespread anger in India, especially among nationalists, who believe the BBC's 'India's Daughter' unfairly maligned the country and made false generalisations about the attitudes of its men.

Some of its claims appear to be factually incorrect, the paper said.

According to official figures, 233 women are raped in Britain every day, while the conviction rate is 60 per cent -- considerably higher than India's 24 per cent but regarded as shamefully low regardless.

The film also sought to make wider criticisms of British society -- 41 per cent of marriages "broken in just 20 years" while "11 per cent population living under the poverty line" and "31 per cent of people age of 65 or more living in old age homes."

UK has fifth highest number of rapes, claims new video - The Economic Times

 

[Kay]

@thethinker
My contention is fight media with media, propaganda with propaganda - not with bans. Fight against the content of media, don't use technicalities to bypass discussions.
Banning a documentary means you don't have anything to counter it, which is not the case here.