The Rise of China : Strategic Implications.

[EnlightenedMonk]

Ok... Chill guys... Back off... he's gone now... let's continue with our fruitful discussions...

 

[masterofsea]

there is a reasonable post on redif
One thing I found interesting is that, in democratic system such India, politicians trend to exaggerate the hatred because it seems to be the cheapest and fastest way to gain support from voters. In China, since the government do not need to worry about election and vote, they have a lot of space to make their decision only based on the interest of the country. In china, you barely seem much news about India, no matter good or bad. Government avoid anti-India atmosphere growing, I think I am with Chinese government on this point, because getting along with our Asian neighbors is very important to China's interest. This is not about who fears who, this is about the understanding of what is the best for the country.

 

[Yusuf]

Being anti China is not going to get you votes in India. Pakistan yes, China no.

 

[Daredevil]

I think I am with Chinese government on this point, because getting along with our Asian neighbors is very important to China's interest

And that' why it spread nuclear weapons to Pakistan??. Gimme a break. China's intentions are not as peaceful as you are trying to portray here. It has so far worked against the Indian interests as far as Indian economy/security is concerned.

 

[RPK]

China opens up a little

China opens up a little

scene looked like Beijing’s version of Mumbai’s Nariman House siege last November. Chinese counter-terrorism commandoes stormed a three-storey building while explosions covered the white structure in smoke. After a brief battle the ‘terrorists’ were silenced.

The battle was staged this week for foreign journalists invited inside barracks of a division of the People’s Liberation Army (PLA). The PLA, which has grown from its origins as a peasant army in 1927 to becoming a sophisticated 2.3 million-strong military force, is the world's biggest army.

The PLA, feared because of its secrecy and double-digit budget budget, is now experimenting with an open image. On the PLA’s 82nd anniversary on August 1, the defence ministry will launch its first official website ---Chinese analysts call it a ‘leap forward’.

The opaqueness of Beijing's military system has attracted criticism from many countries. The former Pentagon chief Donald Rumsfeld became famous for repeated public demands that China explain why its defence budget was growing at such a fast pace.

India’s defence ministry has recently called for ‘greater transparency’ and monitoring of China’s defence policy and China’s $70 billion military budget for 2009. India is the world’s third-largest military force after the US, with a defence budget less than half the size of China’s. But while India's defence budget has remained largely static in budget terms, China's has grown 15 per cent from the previous year.

The two neighbours share one of the world’s longest disputed borders and there is growing concern in New Delhi about reported Chinese transgressions in Sikkim. China is also strategically inching closer to remote and rugged Indian borders with a modern transport network including a planned China-Pakistan railway.

“We will speed up our opening process,’’ senior colonel Leng Jiesong of the Third Guard Division told the media. “China is more open to the outside world and so is the PLA.’’

On the October 1, 60th anniversary of the founding of the People’s Republic, the PLA will march down Beijing’s main east-west avenue in its first military parade since 1999. The government-run Chinese media has said that the parade will be the biggest-ever and include ‘new weapons.’

But as the US, India, Japan and self-ruled Taiwan worry about China’s military modernisation and plans to build an aircraft carrier, the PLA’s image-makeover is focussed on counter-terror operations.

“We are learning from terror incidents the world over,’’ senior colonel Li Shao Jun told the Hindustan Times. “The Mumbai terror attack was also a lesson for us. We can mobilise our counter-terrorism group very fast.’’

The rare media visit included a stroll through spartan dormitories with bunk beds, a dining-hall where dumplings were placed beside cupcakes and front-row seats as soldiers blasted targets on a mountainside.

"The degree of openness is an expression of national confidence,” Ma Zhengang, president of the China Institute of International Studies, told Reuters. “A rich household is willing to welcome guests, but a poor family would be embarrassed.”

 

[Flint]

You have a point here masterofsea. The Chinese government does not need public support to make strategic decisions, so they don't bother with all the PR stuff.

They can make major concessions (like the recent one with Russia where Chinese government gave up a portion of its land to settle a border dispute)
Something of this sort will be impossible to do in India because it will make the government highly unpopular.

This is also why Chinese foreign policy is highly unpredictable. They can appear to be on friendly terms with India, while preparing for war behind the scenes.

there is a reasonable post on redif
One thing I found interesting is that, in democratic system such India, politicians trend to exaggerate the hatred because it seems to be the cheapest and fastest way to gain support from voters. In China, since the government do not need to worry about election and vote, they have a lot of space to make their decision only based on the interest of the country. In china, you barely seem much news about India, no matter good or bad. Government avoid anti-India atmosphere growing, I think I am with Chinese government on this point, because getting along with our Asian neighbors is very important to China's interest. This is not about who fears who, this is about the understanding of what is the best for the country.

 

[Ray]

there is a reasonable post on redif
One thing I found interesting is that, in democratic system such India, politicians trend to exaggerate the hatred because it seems to be the cheapest and fastest way to gain support from voters. In China, since the government do not need to worry about election and vote, they have a lot of space to make their decision only based on the interest of the country. In china, you barely seem much news about India, no matter good or bad. Government avoid anti-India atmosphere growing, I think I am with Chinese government on this point, because getting along with our Asian neighbors is very important to China's interest. This is not about who fears who, this is about the understanding of what is the best for the country.

It is no virtue that there are no news of India in the Chinese media, good or bad.

The media's job is to inform the people as to what is happening in their own country and in the world outside. A govt own media does tailor the news to suit the govt's need, but it can still inform and even educate, as does our national TV channel, Doordarshan.

The private TV channel and media have no such responsibility and tend to sensationalise.

Yet, every Indian has the choice of seeing or rejecting the channels or the print media.

We. too want to get along with every country in the world, but we will not accept our govt to Shepard us into one line of thinking or what suits the govt policy. We maintain the right as free individuals to decide what we should do and should not do.

It is an incorrect belief that China is on the average Indian's radar. No. China is not that important to us in our daily life.

Pakistan is on the average Indian's mind, irrespective of religion or community, since terrorism in Kashmir and even within the hinterland sponsored by the ISI affects our daily life.

I will concede that when we buy the cheap Chinese product (and they get spoilt quite quickly) we do think of China and its progress and how cheaply they can produce items, and wonder why we can't do so ourselves. Extraordinary is that while the Chinese are supposed to not have any religion, they are manufacturing Indian Gods and Goddesses, which have a huge market in India!

 

[hit&run]

You have a point here masterofsea. The Chinese government does not need public support to make strategic decisions, so they don't bother with all the PR stuff.

They can make major concessions (like the recent one with Russia where Chinese government gave up a portion of its land to settle a border dispute)
Something of this sort will be impossible to do in India because it will make the government highly unpopular.

This is also why Chinese foreign policy is highly unpredictable. They can appear to be on friendly terms with India, while preparing for war behind the scenes.

They are very predictable, sir. They understand the language of power. If you have that in your cords then they are very predictable. Same is with Pakistan. Unfortunately spineless Indian politicians have never understood this with time passing on. That is why both can piss on our cot any time. That is why they are here and daring to argue with you.

 

[Ray]

That is why they are here and daring to argue with you.

That is the price of what is known as freedom and right to speech and thought.

This luxury is unknown in totalitarian regimes.

Here is a report:

In order to suppress unfavorable news coverage, the Chinese government has adopted a two-pronged approach. First, Beijing has attacked the source of dissent, threatening any grieving parents who persisted in their protests. Second, the government has embarked on an extensive campaign of media censorship. For instance, foreign reporters covering the parents' demonstrations in Sichuan were detained and deported from the towns where the protests took place. The Los Angeles Times notes that "web discussion groups have seen postings deleted" magically, as if by some unseen Web umpire.[2] And The Washington Post notes that at least one web journalist, Huang Qi, along with two associates, was arrested for posting revealing commentary on the aftermath of the disaster
Hide the Reality and Truth

Notwithstanding the remarkable progress China has made, I would not ever barter my freedom and the right to freedom in thought and speech for all the gold in the world!!

I would not like to a an exotic bird in a gilded cage to entertain those who imprison me for their entertainment and pleasure!

 

[masterofsea]

The private TV channel and media have no such responsibility and tend to sensationalise.

Yet, every Indian has the choice of seeing or rejecting the channels or the print media.

In fact,most people were drived by the media,they don't have the ability of seeing and ejecting.Most are too stupid or too uneducated(or due to lack of knowlege) to distinguish the truth and false appearance.e.g.your naval commander recently said "Indian navy is no much with PLAN".Maybe,he just want to get more fund from your parliament.What is the truth,may be only he hnows.

 

[Yusuf]

In fact,most people were drived by the media,they don't have the ability of seeing and ejecting.Most are too stupid or too uneducated to distinguish the truth and false appearance.e.g.your naval commander recently said "Indian navy is no much with PLAN".Maybe,he just want to get more fund from your parliament.What is the truth,may be only he hnows.

Even the US Military does that to get funds. But funds dont just drop in. They are deliberated. But such statements only awaken the politicians from their slumber and bring them up to speed with reality.

 

[hit&run]

Even the US Military does that to get funds. But funds dont just drop in. They are deliberated. But such statements only awaken the politicians from their slumber and bring them up to speed with reality.

That encouraging Yusuf, hope our politicans will awake up.

 

[RPK]

China's India policy: Murder with borrowed knives

China's India policy: Murder with borrowed knives


Fears that China could employ a strategy of “murdering with borrowed knives” against India does not seem totally unfounded. A leading
Chinese think-tank , whose views count with the Beijing’s Communist administration, has put forward an outrageous suggestion that China should break India into 20-30 independent states with the help of “friendly countries” like Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nepal and Bhutan.

The article, written by Zhan Lue and titled “If China takes a little action , the so-called Great Indian Federation can be broken up,” has aroused strong sentiments in India where many see this as a reflection of the hardline thinking in Beijing.

Published on the website of a think tank that advises Beijing on global and strategic issues, the article makes a series of preposterous suggestions saying that a fragmented India would be in China’s interests and also lead to prosperity in the region. Responding to the inflammatory nature of the suggestions, India issued a warning and a word of caution.

“We continue to maintain that opinions and assessment on the state of India-China relations should be expressed after careful judgment based on the long-term interests of building a stable relationship between the two countries,’’ MEA official spokesperson Vishnu Prakash said.

Giving the benefit of doubt to Beijing, MEA said the article “appears to be the expression of individual opinion and does not accord with the officially stated position of China on India-China relations” , conveyed to India on several occasions most recently by the State Councilor Dai Bingguo during border talks last week.

Nevertheless, the reaction suggests that the article is not being taken lightly by New Delhi. China watchers point out that an article of this nature would have been vetted by the Chinese government. The article, which is published on the website of the China International Institute for Strategic Studies (CIISS), suggests that China should work towards breaking up India into 20-30 nation-states like Europe so that social reforms in South Asia can be achieved, the caste system can be eradicated and the region can march towards prosperity.

Asking the Communist party to exploit regional sentiments in India, the article says that China can seek support of friendly countries including Pakistan, Nepal and Bhutan to further this strategy. The article terms India as “Hindu religious state” that is based on caste exploitation which is coming in the way of modernisation.

It further argues that China in its own interest and the progress of whole of Asia should join forces with “different nationalities” like Assamese, Tamils and Kashmiris and support them in establishing independent nation states of their own. The article further said Beijing should support the United Liberation Front of Asom to help achieve independence for Assam from India.

Yet another suggestion is that China give political support to Bangladesh to encourage ethnic Bengalis in India get rid of “Indian control” and join Bangladesh as one Bengali nation. The strategist contends that if that is not possible then China should encourage the creation of a Bengali nation state for the aim of weakening India’s expansion and then recover the 90,000 sq km territory in Arunachal Pradesh, which Beijing claims as its own.

The publication of the article has coincided with the 13th round of India-China border talks, which both sides have termed as positive. But pressure points have remained in Sino-Indian ties which have continued to flare up at regular intervals.

This includes the recent attempt by China to block an ADB loan to Arunachal Pradesh. Strategic experts here see it as a reflection of the growing hardline approach in China towards India. `This is part and parcel of hardline approach of think tanks (in China). They are trying to take advantage of India’s pliability,’’ said Mr Brahma Chellaney.

 

[RPK]

Tibet 'Chinese issue' says Dalai lama

Tibet 'Chinese issue' says Dalai


The Tibetan spiritual leader, the Dalai Lama, has said the Tibetan issue is a Chinese domestic problem.

His statement, given in an interview with the BBC, may breathe new life into the deadlocked talks between him and the government in Beijing.

But he also said Beijing's policy on ethnic minorities was a "failure".

The Dalai Lama has been campaigning for "meaningful autonomy" for Tibetans within China, but talks ended last year in bitter accusations from Beijing.

Between 2002 and 2008, nine rounds of negotiations were conducted between Chinese officials and his representatives.

They degenerated from the initial cautious welcome to recriminations from the Chinese side.

Waiting for signals

In an exclusive interview with the BBC Chinese.com, the Dalai Lama said: "The Chinese government considers our problem a domestic one. And we also."

From the late 1980s, his "middle way" approach to the Tibet issue has gained international sympathy and eventually won him the Nobel Peace Prize.



But his proposals, including autonomy for Tibetans outside the present boundary of the Tibet Autonomous Region, have been described by Beijing as a "back door to splitting the motherland".

The mood worsened last year after the riots in Lhasa and other Tibetan communities surrounding Tibet.

The 74-year-old Dalai Lama put on a brave face during the wide-ranging and candid interview.

However, he admitted there had been no contact with Beijing after the talks with the Chinese government became deadlocked last year.

"We are simply waiting" for Beijing to send signals, he said.

On the future of the relationship between the Chinese government and the Tibetan community, the Dalai Lama pointed out that there were growing signs of frustration and resentment among the younger generation.

As long as he lived they would follow his instructions on non-violence, he said, but after he was gone they would have a free hand, something he called "quite serious".

The Tibet issue reflects wider ethnic problems in China.

While acknowledging the Chinese Communist Party as adaptive to new realities, the Dalai Lama described China's policy on ethnic minorities as "a failure".

He said Beijing's approach to the autonomous regions of Xinjiang and Tibet was not realistic.

"They always look from only one angle - how to keep, how to control. Only that angle. They don't care about what the local people are feeling."

Nevertheless, the Dalai Lama called the recent riots in Xinjiang "very sad", saying he totally disagreed with violence and that "that kind of riot is no help to solving the problem".

The Chinese embassy in the UK was shown the interview and asked for a response, but declined to do so.

 

[Antimony]

As a respected member of this forum said:

The Chinese will fight Indians to the last Pakistani

 

[johnee]

^^ now, the chinese want to give same respect(that they give to Pakistanis) to Nepal, Bangladesh, Burma, and Sri Lanka.

 

[不明真相的群众]

Is Nazi China rising?

Don't fall for such nonsense.

 

[india3]

who is nazi now,always be the yankees,did waht hitler did in ww2,

 

[advaita]

who is nazi now,always be the yankees,did waht hitler did in ww2,

Yankees compared with Nazis. You want to start a war in this forum. Its good we dont have as many Yankees interested in this forum as there are Chinese.

See the trouble is that nobody knows what goes on behind closed doors.

In fact most people (with average education) in India think CCP got you guys rich so it must be great and they think that since Chinese attacked Indians in 1962 so the society must be bad. It is only the people with deeper learning that treats CCP as the real threat and empathises with the Chinese people because they know we were in the similar position for large parts of our history. During actual fight this time however, the distinction in the minds of both types of people will simply go away for the simple reasons of
1. uncertainity
2. Indians esp. Hindus are made to believe since childhood in the totality of life, which implies totality of covert ops, which implies totality of warfare.

 

[advaita]

Thats called poverty of Ideas in the face of overwhelming propaganda. Had my society been suffering from some misplaced sense of superiority, I would have been sorry for it.