The forbidden public toilets of Beijing

[Ray]

Frankly, given the condition India is in right now, it does not behove us to point fingers at PRC. PRC is this, PRC is that - well, who cares? PRC is way ahead of India.

How about we think of stopping people defaecating on the railway tracks, installing selective discharge toilets in our trains, setting up public toilets and urinals, and maintaining those that exist?

This thread is turning into a prime example of throwing stones from a glass house. Sorry if this offends anyone - I will stand up for myself and defend my right to speak the truth here. Let's be real men and acknowledge our own problems, before we think of other people's problems.

Who is shying way from discussing our problems?

This forum is replete with the same.

But one can through the loss of character be pleasant and accommodating to the adversary.

I did not say that. Rabindra Nath Tagore said it!

"Don't look down upon someone if you are not helping him up."

Precisely.

That is my theme song to the Chinese.

As is this:

Doctor, Heal thyself!

I will concede I am not Goody Two Shoes or Pollyanna, but I do stand for just criticism and if someone thinks he can fool the people, they may succeed sometimes, but not all the times!

 

[Ray]

I personally think China is doing a great job in building her nation and marching ahead full steam.

But then I am a pragmatist and cannot blindly believe that there is nothing wrong in China.

That is where my disconnect with the Chinese posters lie, who feel that China has nothing wrong and India has everything wrong.

For instance , even if you report a train accident, you find obfuscation and total falsehood being pandered.

When we have a train accident, we go hammer and tongs on the threads.

Or that Pakistan was sponsoring the Uighur separatists.

The Chinese were in denial.

Till the Chinese media indirectly admit it so.

Even so, the comments are very guarded and sugar coated.

What do they fear to speak out the reality?

That is the difference.

 

[Ray]

It will also be observed that I am not a blind jingoist who goes berserk that India is on the way to superpower status. My refrain has been when we cross that bridge we shall talk about it.

I don't subscribe to day dreams that Mumbai is the next Shanghai and will even surpass it. Another figment of imagination.

Or say Indian highways are better than the Chinese or that the Indian railways is better than the Chinese. Why? Because in my opinion, it is not.

I have defended the Chinese who was declared to have taken performance enhancing substance.

I was the first to congratulate the Chinese on the organisation of the Olumpics itself!

I am a pragmatist.

I have even commented adversely on some Indian Army issues.

I believe in truth and not propaganda.

But I do see red (not communist red) when I find sneaky behaviour that is so cleverly injected to indicate India is but a third rate dump and China is at par with the western world. That is a canard and a falsehood that China is anywhere near the West in standards!

Obviously, the Chinese honed into believing the Communist propaganda finds it difficult to digest.

I have no regrets in telling it as it is, whether the Chinese like it or not, or whether some Indians want to appease them with cooing noises!

I don't hold it against such Indians either for they must be having the best interest in their hearts.

And as far as keeping the forum TRP is concerned as some Chinese have stated, it really not that paramount.

The contents gets the poster and not the sparring!

 

[J20!]

I personally think China is doing a great job in building her nation and marching ahead full steam.

But then I am a pragmatist and cannot blindly believe that there is nothing wrong in China.

That is where my disconnect with the Chinese posters lie, who feel that China has nothing wrong and India has everything wrong.

For instance , even if you report a train accident, you find obfuscation and total falsehood being pandered.

When we have a train accident, we go hammer and tongs on the threads.

Or that Pakistan was sponsoring the Uighur separatists.

The Chinese were in denial.

Till the Chinese media indirectly admit it so.

Even so, the comments are very guarded and sugar coated.

What do they fear to speak out the reality?

That is the difference.

Don't lie,... Name ONE Chinese poster who has ever said China has no problems. ONE. We always admit China has its dark side, human rights, human trafficking, corruption etc etc. There are enormous social problems in China as we are a DEVELOPING COUNTRY. Though our GDP is the world's second largest, we by no means live as well as the Europeans, Americans and Japanese that we rank amongst in GDP.

Our only problem is people like you Ray, who come on this subforum everyday to post some hate thread on anything negative on China you can find. Even things India is much worse off at(eg public toilets, poverty, women's rights, corruption etc etc.) Usually sinking to lows like calling over a billion people barbarians or immoral. Constructive criticism I can take in spades, but your hypocritical ridicule wont do much but start flame wars as you can see now. SOMETHING A MODERATOR SHOULD KNOW...

We could easily find as much negativity on India as you can on China and post articles and pics ridiculing India, throwing around generalizations, and posting insults directed at your entire race, but i for one am not as hateful as you...

There are just as many articles on good things in China, yet as I'm sure everyone here will testify, you have never posted any threads that have anything good to do with China as any neutral party would do. You're so allergic to Chinese achievements that you lash out at anyone who posts pics of tier 1 to tier 3 cities like Shanghai(you particularly hate this city), Beijing, Chengdu etc etc.

China may have major problems, but over the past two decades, China has achieved a lot, I don't see why you want members here not to be proud of our country's achievements. We don't rush in to post pics of the many Indian poor whenever you achieve something substantial in you own development, I don't see why you should.

Its amazing that anyone claiming to be a neutral can act all holier than thou pretending to be some evangelist of truth when you cant even criticize your own countries MUCH LARGER hygiene problem and rush to point fingers at China. As I said before, start a thread on India's "public toilets" problem, then we can discuss Beijing's public toilets. If you cant discuss India's shortcoming's as maturely as you want us to discuss China's, then you have no business eagerly commentating and ridiculing China's shortcomings considering that India is well behind China in development across many areas that you criticize China for.

 

[blank_quest]

Don't lie,... Name ONE Chinese poster who has ever said China has no problems. ONE. We always admit China has its dark side, human rights, human trafficking, corruption etc etc. There are enormous social problems in China as we are a DEVELOPING COUNTRY. Though our GDP is the world's second largest, we by no means live as well as the Europeans, Americans and Japanese that we rank amongst in GDP.

Our only problem is people like you Ray, who come on this subforum everyday to post some hate thread on anything negative on China you can find. Even things India is much worse off at(eg public toilets, poverty, women's rights, corruption etc etc.) Usually sinking to lows like calling over a billion people barbarians or immoral. Constructive criticism I can take in spades, but your hypocritical ridicule wont do much but start flame wars as you can see now. SOMETHING A MODERATOR SHOULD KNOW...

We could easily find as much negativity on India as you can on China and post articles and pics ridiculing India, throwing around generalizations, and posting insults directed at your entire race, but i for one am not as hateful as you...

There are just as many articles on good things in China, yet as I'm sure everyone here will testify, you have never posted any threads that have anything good to do with China as any neutral party would do. You're so allergic to Chinese achievements that you lash out at anyone who posts pics of tier 1 to tier 3 cities like Shanghai(you particularly hate this city), Beijing, Chengdu etc etc.

China may have major problems, but over the past two decades, China has achieved a lot, I don't see why you want members here not to be proud of our country's achievements. We don't rush in to post pics of the many Indian poor whenever you achieve something substantial in you own development, I don't see why you should.

Its amazing that anyone claiming to be a neutral can act all holier than thou pretending to be some evangelist of truth when you cant even criticize your own countries MUCH LARGER hygiene problem and rush to point fingers at China. As I said before, start a thread on India's "public toilets" problem, then we can discuss Beijing's public toilets. If you cant discuss India's shortcoming's as maturely as you want us to discuss China's, then you have no business eagerly commentating and ridiculing China's shortcomings considering that India is well behind China in development across many areas that you criticize China for.

Do one favor to your Brain. Stop SHITTING HOW GREAT CHINA IS. IT WERE YOU PEOPLE WHO CREATED THE THREADS FOR INDIAN POLLUTION IN FORUMS/BLOGS LIKE smakCHINA way BEFORE US. So , Peep WIDE . you may see your home is NOT Much BETTER THAN US. You talk of Moral ground CHINESE ARE NO MORAL GODS.

 

[Ray]

Don't lie,... Name ONE Chinese poster who has ever said China has no problems. ONE. We always admit China has its dark side, human rights, human trafficking, corruption etc etc. There are enormous social problems in China as we are a DEVELOPING COUNTRY. Though our GDP is the world's second largest, we by no means live as well as the Europeans, Americans and Japanese that we rank amongst in GDP.

Our only problem is people like you Ray, who come on this subforum everyday to post some hate thread on anything negative on China you can find. Even things India is much worse off at(eg public toilets, poverty, women's rights, corruption etc etc.) Usually sinking to lows like calling over a billion people barbarians or immoral. Constructive criticism I can take in spades, but your hypocritical ridicule wont do much but start flame wars as you can see now. SOMETHING A MODERATOR SHOULD KNOW...

We could easily find as much negativity on India as you can on China and post articles and pics ridiculing India, throwing around generalizations, and posting insults directed at your entire race, but i for one am not as hateful as you...

There are just as many articles on good things in China, yet as I'm sure everyone here will testify, you have never posted any threads that have anything good to do with China as any neutral party would do. You're so allergic to Chinese achievements that you lash out at anyone who posts pics of tier 1 to tier 3 cities like Shanghai(you particularly hate this city), Beijing, Chengdu etc etc.

China may have major problems, but over the past two decades, China has achieved a lot, I don't see why you want members here not to be proud of our country's achievements. We don't rush in to post pics of the many Indian poor whenever you achieve something substantial in you own development, I don't see why you should.

Its amazing that anyone claiming to be a neutral can act all holier than thou pretending to be some evangelist of truth when you cant even criticize your own countries MUCH LARGER hygiene problem and rush to point fingers at China. As I said before, start a thread on India's "public toilets" problem, then we can discuss Beijing's public toilets. If you cant discuss India's shortcoming's as maturely as you want us to discuss China's, then you have no business eagerly commentating and ridiculing China's shortcomings considering that India is well behind China in development across many areas that you criticize China for.

I don't lie.

Kickof is the only one who gave an honest view and he was shouted down. The remainder are merely 50 centers.

The problems in China has been highlighted by posters like me. And then you all started weaseling your way and going pop like the weasel.

There you go again. India has greater hygiene problems. Typically defensive when the truth is shoved in your face. In India, we rather live on a footpath than live in a public toilet. How come you convenient avoid this truth? And you say you have problems. Is this not one? Why do you shy away from this truth?

And you claim you raise issues of problems in China.

Show me one post that raises the issue of problems of China by a Chinese poster.

Therefore, disabuse yourself of your fanciful imagination and falsehood (note I don't call it lies as would a peasant). One has to show class!

Our threads are full of discussion of India's problems and shortcomings.

We are frank and free to do so and are not afraid of the midnight knock and re-education banishment!

 

[rockdog]

@Ray, i think as a Indian you must know the famous book "An Area of Darkness" from Naipaul, i have a Chinese version, there is a chapter to describing the "An Area of Darkness" is almost "as area of defecation". Even it read it around 4 yrs ago, i still remember two funny paragraphs:

1. "Indians defecate everywhere. They defecate, mostly, beside the railway tracks. But they also defecate on the beaches; they defecate on the hills; they defecate on the river banks; they defecate on the streets; they never look for cover"¦."

2. i would only write down some general meanings: during the crush of 62 war with China, the government and people in New Delhi were also shocked and scary, so the civil soldiers dig lots of trenches. But after the PLA withdraw the army, those trenches very quickly became a public pissing and shitting places...

 

[Ray]

Naipaul is not an Indian.

He is the progeny of indenture labour from India.

He naturally is not too happy to be of a labour class. Though I will give it to him that he can write.

I don't take him too seriously.

You were there in 1962 in India seeing trenches dug?

As a spy?

What is a 'civilian soldier'?

This is not China!

 

[parijataka]

@Ray, i think as a Indian you must know the famous book "An Area of Darkness" from Naipaul, i have a Chinese version, there is a chapter to describing the "An Area of Darkness" is almost "as area of defecation". Even it read it around 4 yrs ago, i still remember two funny paragraphs:

1. "Indians defecate everywhere. They defecate, mostly, beside the railway tracks. But they also defecate on the beaches; they defecate on the hills; they defecate on the river banks; they defecate on the streets; they never look for cover"¦."

2. i would only write down some general meanings: during the crush of 62 war with China, the government and people in New Delhi were also shocked and scary, so the civil soldiers dig lots of trenches. But after the PLA withdraw the army, those trenches very quickly became a public pissing and shitting places...

VS Naipaul has written a trilogy on India staring with the 60's and the last book placed in early 90's, reflects the changing face of India. Recommend you read all three.

 

[nimo_cn]

Naipaul is not an Indian.

He is the progeny of indenture labour from India.

He naturally is not too happy to be of a labour class. Though I will give it to him that he can write.

I don't take him too seriously.

You were there in 1962 in India seeing trenches dug?

As a spy?

What is a 'civilian soldier'?

This is not China!

Why does people have to be in India to understand what was going on there?

Sent from my T8830 using Tapatalk 2

 

[rockdog]

VS Naipaul has written a trilogy on India staring with the 60's and the last book placed in early 90's, reflects the changing face of India. Recommend you read all three.

Really? U mean the "area of defecation" has changed? I don't think so, let me show you some articles from your own media:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Half of India still defecates in the open
Half of India still defecates in the open - Times Of India

NEW DELHI: Half of the country's population still defecates in the open even after 60 years of independence, the Planning Commission has admitted.

Faced with the harsh reality of open defecation by a vast majority, affecting the dignity of women and girls the most, the plan panel is revamping its strategy and is set to raise spending on government programme on sanitation and drinking water.

"Around 60 crore people defecate in the open," plan panel member Mihir Shah said, admitting to the need for a change in government's approach. The panel is of the view that toilets should be constructed for hamlets too, apart from aiming to build toilets for households. The thinking is also to build bathrooms along with toilets.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2. Some comments:

arsh (India ) 28 mins ago (11:21AM)
CIVIC sense is
truly lacking in our country. I've lived in Africa and let me tell you, cities
there are cleaner than in India. And I am not joking

Jose (India/Qatar)1 hr ago (10:34AM)
TOI is just
creating hate within our countrymen,it is high time TOI stop publishing
comments of hate and publish geniune comments,we all know the facts of India
and we live with the least publicinfrasturcture in the world today.

dwivedi (US)
1 hr ago (09:58AM)
peepee and poopoo
not bad thing in Hinduism, they drink pee, and do not clean after peeing. It is
in the culture of hinduism. nange hago, nange mooto, nange nahao(ghaat pe). It
is the most peculiar culture.

S. Suchindranath
Aiyer (Kalyanipuri) 1 hr ago (09:52AM)
Half the
"Super Power", wannabe"Permanent Member" defecates in
public:

----------------------------------------------------------

Overview - WASH United

Lack of adequate sanitation is a huge problem in India. 626 million Indians have no access to any form of sanitation, turning India into the "world capital of open defecation" (Jairam Ramesh, Minister for Rural Development). As a consequence, more than 1,000 children under five years of age die from preventable diarrhea every day.


----------------------------------------------------------


The sad thing is: Some Chinese English fan already translate the full article and comments into Chinese and post on some

Full translation into Chinese here, became a popular thread there...

^_^ And i compared the situation with what happened from Naipaul's book, on "defecation" issue, seems no big differences...

 

[rockdog]

repeated, deleted

 

[Bangalorean]

The sad thing is: Some Chinese English fan already translate the full article and comments into Chinese and post on some

Full translation into Chinese here, became a popular thread there...

^_^ And i compared the situation with what happened from Naipaul's book, on "defecation" issue, seems no big differences...

Just proves what I was saying earlier on this thread, there are enough Chinese twats with enough time and hate to create such threads like that Chinasmack bullshit and this one. I don't see Indians going around doing such stuff. Just makes me more determined to create that blog on 'shitty China' with Japanese, Vietnamese and Korean translation. Till you buggers reform your habits, you deserve that kind of treatment.

 

[rockdog]

Just proves what I was saying earlier on this thread, there are enough Chinese twats with enough time and hate to create such threads like that Chinasmack bullshit and this one. I don't see Indians going around doing such stuff. Just makes me more determined to create that blog on 'shitty China' with Japanese, Vietnamese and Korean translation. Till you buggers reform your habits, you deserve that kind of treatment.

u are angry about the truth of "world capital of open defecation"? or angry with the translation of truth of world capital of open defecation"?

But if you google "India defacation", there are much more articles and images from westerners in English, i never see you said anything, why?

 

[rockdog]

Naipaul is not an Indian.

He is the progeny of indenture labour from India.

He naturally is not too happy to be of a labour class. Though I will give it to him that he can write.

I don't take him too seriously.

Who cares whether you take him seriously or not, i read his book, and also him get prized by western world (Nobel Prize).

You were there in 1962 in India seeing trenches dug?

As a spy?

Did you read the book from him? if not, it's a pit you lost such funny scene!

What is a 'civilian soldier'?

This is not China!

I meant the civil get trained for reserved soldier, and here comes the link from DFI:
http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/...e-indian-political-military-leadership-3.html

Yes, "this is not China", during 1962 war, we don't need "civilian soldier" to prepare to crush your army...

 

[Bangalorean]

u are angry about the truth of "world capital of open defecation"? or angry with the translation of truth of world capital of open defecation"?

But if you google "India defacation", there are much more articles and images from westerners in English, i never see you said anything, why?

An article based on facts, such as a UN report on health, is a different matter.

A Chinese twat making a collection of filthy India images, including old images, outdated images, some images not from India at all, and images of old and diseased people in hospital, etc. - that is the sign of a sick mind. Also, taking negative articles and taking the trouble to translate them is the sign of a sick mind.

I've had enough of this crap. You people need some crap dished out to you in return. Please wait for it, you have asked for it.

 

[blank_quest]

u are angry about the truth of "world capital of open defecation"? or angry with the translation of truth of world capital of open defecation"?

But if you google "India defacation", there are much more articles and images from westerners in English, i never see you said anything, why?

on a serious note : WHO | Fast facts

593 million in China and 251 million in India gained access to improved sanitation since 1990. at same scale of 100 person India will show more people added in absolute term when compared.
(2011)
Population growth rate in India = 1.37%
Population growth rate of China = 0.47%
for every 100 capita India produces ~ 0.9 child extra than China.
This means India added X 1.9 the population as China did @same scale during 2001-2011.

(2001)
Population growth rate in India = 1.64%
Population growth rate of China = 0.73%
for every 100 capita India added ~ 0.9 child extra than China.
This means India added X 1.9 (double) the population as China did @same scale during 1991-2001.

so , assuming approx. values @same scale India Added double the China added to its population (1991-2011)

you can't simple say India is not sanitizing its people. our govt. is more efficient that China if you take the Economic Scale into the account and the BOP crisis of 1991. The way India is moving forward will show its effects in one or two decades. The growth rate will drop in next decade and it will show better result. The population growth rate will be a big factor.It nullifies the sanitation success.



World Development Indicators and Global Development Finance - Google Public Data Explorer

 

[Ray]

Why does people have to be in India to understand what was going on there?

Could I ask you the same question?

You asked me if I have been to rural China!

 

[Ray]

Who cares whether you take him seriously or not, i read his book, and also him get prized by western world (Nobel Prize) [/quote\].

Typical Chinese hypocrisy and double talk!

While you are brandishing the 'Nobel Prize' as the last word for propriety, how come you did not display the same for Liu Xiaobo, the Chinese literary critic, writer, professor, and human rights activist who called for political reforms and the end of communist single-party rule in China?

You may not recall since your Communist party must have re-written history, he was formally arrested on 23 June 2009 on suspicion of "inciting subversion of state power." He was tried on the same charges on 23 December 2009, and sentenced to eleven years' imprisonment and two years' deprivation of political rights on 25 December 2009.

On 8 October 2010, the Nobel Committee awarded Liu the Nobel Peace Prize "for his long and non-violent struggle for fundamental human rights in China,"[saying that Liu had long been front-runner as the recipient of the prize.

Selective amnesia and trotting out to suit the scriptures?

Did you read the book from him? if not, it's a pit you lost such funny scene!



I

meant the civil get trained for reserved soldier, and here comes the link from DFI:
http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/...e-indian-political-military-leadership-3.html

Yes, "this is not China", during 1962 war, we don't need "civilian soldier" to prepare to crush your army...

You go by what ajtr has to write?

A Pakistani to vouch for what happens in India?

First of all delude yourself of the dream that you can crush India or any other country.

Try it and it will be a perpetual nightmare for China require serious psychiatric attention.

Your PLA is full of so called 'civilian soldiers'.

The PLA encompasses five main service branches: Ground Force, the Navy, the Air Force, the Second Artillery (strategic missile force), and the People's Armed Police.

They could not even crush the unarmed Tibetans!

 

[nimo_cn]

Could I ask you the same question?

You asked me if I have been to rural China!

You should. You claimed to know about China even though you have not been to China; but questioned another one's article about India because he wasn't in India.

So what? One doesnt have to be in China to understand China, but has to be in India to understand India.

By the way, you asked if I have visited Chinese rural area before I asked you. May I ask why did you ask that question?

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