Tajikistan gives land to China

civfanatic

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2) South Tibet is Indian land, when you have Arunachal state? 1986, right? why it is not 1947? I didn't say you gave you mother land to China, I said give the south tibet back to China, that is not your land. If you want peace and want your mother to be one piece, then return the chinese land you seized.
Arunachal Pradesh was always part of India, but before 1986 it was part of a bigger territory called North East Frontier Agency (NEFA). Arunachal Pradesh was created in 1986 to make administration easier. AP was not the only state created, but also Mizoram, Meghalaya, Nagaland, Manipur, and Tripura. All these used to be part of NEFA.

If you want to get AP come and get it, we are waiting :)

3) India won't be the only country has to return land to China, Japan also has to return Ryukyu island, Vietnam, philipine, Malaysia, Indonisia have to return return south chinese sea islands.
LOL. China tried invading Vietnam in 1979, do you know what happened?
 

civfanatic

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@lurker.baba

Don't forget, Southeast Asia and Indonesia are also Indian. :cool:

Chola Empire


I have a deal for our Chinese friends: we give you Arunachal Pradesh and we get the rest of Asia, how about it?? :rotflmao:
 

houde10000

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Unfortunitly, I can not right to free speak here.

My post had been removed. I don't know what's different CCP and you?
 

Daredevil

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houde,

This is not a thread to compare China and India and their languages or systems. Read the topic of the thread. Anything off-topic to the thread will be deleted like your previous post. Just to let you know DFI is not a democracy unlike India so don't expect us to allow you to post anything that you want anywhere in any thread you want. So, follow the rules, stick to the topic and your posts will remain as is without getting deleted.


The following rule violated by your post

5. Do not post irrelevant topics/replies. The DefenceForum.in, its moderators, and members of this community reserve the right to delete posts we determine are irrelevant to the discussion in which they're posted.

http://defenceforumindia.com/showthread.php?t=4
 

pmaitra

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Mr. Pmaitra,

1) I did search, this is real picture taken before 1990, about 20 years ago, the Armed Police wear the 1980s style uniform.

2) Do you know why those women were executed? They are drug traffickers, even today, no matter who you are, carry over 400 gram drug, will be sentenced to death in China. China is not foolish British and French, human right doesn't including freedom to sale drug in China!!!

3) The pictures are very bloody, I also feel very sick, but I understand, chinese law, police, government just did their job to protect innocent people.

4) There are many different way to execute people, shot is one of options. I don't think there is big different between hanging, shot, lethal injection, electric chair. The most importance is justice.
I do not know why these women were executed. I do know that you are claiming that these women were drug traffickers, but the way the woman is being held by two policemen and another one is aiming his gun, it looks like an extra judicial murder; or is it a standard practice to execute people on the streets? Sorry bud, you don't sound very convincing.

5) Burn brides because their family not offer large dowry? That's really barbarian, right? I read that from Indian news.
Upping the ante aren't you? Good job. It was in response to the following statement you made:
They were barbarian in chinese history.
It clearly shows what people like you think of Uighurs. People in East Turkestan aren't any further away from those in Tajikistan. PRC needs to first convince the world, and itself, that it can rule East Turkestan fairly, treat it's people humanely and then, and only then, may PRC even think of requesting Tajikistan to transfer some territories to it.
 

Ray

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LOL, did you ask Turkey when they knew how to write? They were barbarian in chinese history, this is nothing about racism, it is just like Aryan was barbarian in Roman history. Should I read rigorous history written by chinese historian in 8th century, or listen to barbarian's legend, of course, not read, they don't know how to write.

Xinjiang, the old chinese name is "Xiyu", means the west land, chinese empire had those land 100 years before Jeaus was born, before Turkey appear in history, before Uyghur tribe existed. In 8th century, after chinese Tang Dynasty Empirer beated Turk moving west and free Uyghur tribe, chinese kindly allow them settle in today's Xinjiang region, Uyghur is the guest of this land, Han is the master of this land. What do you mean RACIST? are you idiot?

"Most of Uyghur are illiteracy, they only recite Koran" did I lie here? what do you mean RACIST? Uyghur doesn't read any history, they just take grant to think they was born there, the land is theirs, the crazy Uyghur extremist want to kill all Han and Hui lived there for thousand years, who is RACIST? 200 PEOPLE were killed in Xinjiang on 2009, July 05, most of them are Han and Hui, who is the RACIST? kill people just because they don't speak Uyghur, look like Han or Hui? Is this RACIST?

Who tell you all Uyghur and Tibetan hate chinese? how many Uyghur and Tibetan you know? There are over 6 million tibetan and 12 million Uyghur living in China!!!

South Tibetan was not Indian land before 1947, if it is your land, your premier Nehru won't need "forward policy", you just need a "stay policy". Listen the land you took, soon or late, have to return back to China, if you don't want your mother land to be dismembered.
The problem with you houde is that your approach to discussion is juvenile and more of a Sir Oracle style, where what you write without quoting facts or links, you want all to believe is the Gospel Truth. You may feel that Mao's saying and the history conjured by the CCP or the imperialist historians of China is beyond doubt, unfortunately the world does not. I daresay, they did not research. Please visit the British Library when you find time in London.
Yes, there were barbarians in China, at least from the Han imperialist point of view – as if the Hans were some superior race descended from the Heavens! Please divorce yourself from such delusions. They were mere imperialists, who wrote history of the 'victors', if you understand what is meant by 'history is written by the victors'.
How does 'Xiyu' which you claims is west land makes it Chinese territory historically? Well , if such a vague term is applicable, what makes the remainder of the world that is west of the Han land, not then be claimed as part of China? A person of your outstanding logic would argue that it does mean so. Now, how can one discuss with a person who has blinkers on?
So, the Chinese started writing even before the world. Jolly good, if you ask me. Now, how many of such writings were available to the common man? Now, that issue is more pertinent than merely writing. It is only when literacy spread was the common man able to read. No, go ahead and tell me that there was universal literacy in China then! You would not surprise me!
It is also pertinent to know that history has also been known through the word of mouth. Modern research confirms many a fact and also many a myth. Do you mean to say that the written history does not contain myths? The Great Leap Forward or the Cultural Revolution was taken as great events in China by the Chinese when it occurred and so did the official history proclaim so. The West had commented on them as disasters, but not so in China because the official version did not say so and the Chinese had no access to the outside world. It is now that the Chinese grudgingly accept and even then they feel Mao was 70% right and 30% wrong. And yet, they flounder to indicate the rationale behind these magic percentages. In other words, this will also become a part of Chinese history that you will tout as the Gospel truth!
Is it surprising for you to be told that the Chinese or rather, the Han, are racists? They are. Or else, why did they call the non Hans 'barbarians' and whose culture, language and traditions the Hans crushed underfoot and made them embrace the Han ways? If that is not racism, what is?
The UIghurs are not guests, it is there land and so, it is the Hans who are the guest – uninvited at that, as are the Hans who took away the lands of the barbarians (as they called the Non Hans). So, revisit history and revisit lexicons!
Of course, those who contrary views to your propaganda and disinformation are idiots. But have you cared to know that you display an unique propensity to display that there is the ideal vacuum between your ears and that you require half a ounce more of brains to be classified as a half wit? Please desist from this obnoxious habit of abusive terms since the same can be said of you.
It is not the Uighurs who just taken for granted what they think it is theirs. It is those who have been brought up on imperialistic propaganda, couched in falsehood by contriving history, who think what is not theirs, as theirs. What is wrong in reciting the Koran. The Chinese parroted and recited Mao's Thoughts from the Little Red Book as if it were the Koran!
If the Uighurs killed the Hans, who came to take away their land, their culture and their religion and made them a minority in their land of their birth, did the Han just sit around meditating the sublime like the Buddha? Ask the Tibetans and the Uighurs of the repression carried out by the Hans.
If the Uighurs loved the Han, then why did the Hans have to kill them?
Arunachal was Indian Territory before 1947. However, it was a Frontier Agency and remote. After independence, infrastructural improvements were done, and the 'forward policy' was not for political reasons or to indicate it was Indian Territory, it was done to bring in military presence, which was absent, thanks to China's placating double speak using the Bandung Principles, and to counter the Chinese aggressive intent and deceit.
You must be daydreaming that you can wrest more land from India. This time around, if the Indian govt wisely applies itself, maybe you should be ready to lose some of your imperialist conquest. Just remember, Tunisia! A repressive govt has been overturned in a country that had religion as a binding factor. China is similar only that it has Communist repression and muzzling free thought as the binding factor.


South Tibetan was not Indian land before 1947, if it is your land, your premier Nehru won't need "forward policy", you just need a "stay policy". Listen the land you took, soon or late, have to return back to China, if you don't want your mother land to be dismembered.[/QUOTE]

The problem with you houde is that your approach to discussion is juvenile and more of a Sir Oracle style, where what you write without quoting facts or links, you want all to believe is the Gospel Truth. You may feel that Mao's saying and the history conjured by the CCP or the imperialist historians of China is beyond doubt, unfortunately the world does not. I daresay, they did not research. Please visit the British Library when you find time in London.
Yes, there were barbarians in China, at least from the Han imperialist point of view – as if the Hans were some superior race descended from the Heavens! Please divorce yourself from such delusions. They were mere imperialists, who wrote history of the 'victors', if you understand what is meant by 'history is written by the victors'.
How does 'Xiyu' which you claims is west land makes it Chinese territory historically? Well , if such a vague term is applicable, what makes the remainder of the world that is west of the Han land, not then be claimed as part of China? A person of your outstanding logic would argue that it does mean so. Now, how can one discuss with a person who has blinkers on?
So, the Chinese started writing even before the world. Jolly good, if you ask me. Now, how many of such writings were available to the common man? Now, that issue is more pertinent than merely writing. It is only when literacy spread was the common man able to read. No, go ahead and tell me that there was universal literacy in China then! You would not surprise me!
It is also pertinent to know that history has also been known through the word of mouth. Modern research confirms many a fact and also many a myth. Do you mean to say that the written history does not contain myths? The Great Leap Forward or the Cultural Revolution was taken as great events in China by the Chinese when it occurred and so did the official history proclaim so. The West had commented on them as disasters, but not so in China because the official version did not say so and the Chinese had no access to the outside world. It is now that the Chinese grudgingly accept and even then they feel Mao was 70% right and 30% wrong. And yet, they flounder to indicate the rationale behind these magic percentages. In other words, this will also become a part of Chinese history that you will tout as the Gospel truth!
Is it surprising for you to be told that the Chinese or rather, the Han, are racists? They are. Or else, why did they call the non Hans 'barbarians' and whose culture, language and traditions the Hans crushed underfoot and made them embrace the Han ways? If that is not racism, what is?
The UIghurs are not guests, it is there land and so, it is the Hans who are the guest – uninvited at that, as are the Hans who took away the lands of the barbarians (as they called the Non Hans). So, revisit history and revisit lexicons!
Of course, those who contrary views to your propaganda and disinformation are idiots. But have you cared to know that you display an unique propensity to display that there is the ideal vacuum between your ears and that you require half a ounce more of brains to be classified as a half wit? Please desist from this obnoxious habit of abusive terms since the same can be said of you.
It is not the Uighurs who just taken for granted what they think it is theirs. It is those who have been brought up on imperialistic propaganda, couched in falsehood by contriving history, who think what is not theirs, as theirs. What is wrong in reciting the Koran. The Chinese parroted and recited Mao's Thoughts from the Little Red Book as if it were the Koran!
If the Uighurs killed the Hans, who came to take away their land, their culture and their religion and made them a minority in their land of their birth, did the Han just sit around meditating the sublime like the Buddha? Ask the Tibetans and the Uighurs of the repression carried out by the Hans.
If the Uighurs loved the Han, then why did the Hans have to kill them?
Arunachal was Indian Territory before 1947. However, it was a Frontier Agency and remote. After independence, infrastructural improvements were done, and the 'forward policy' was not for political reasons or to indicate it was Indian Territory, it was done to bring in military presence, which was absent, thanks to China's placating double speak using the Bandung Principles, and to counter the Chinese aggressive intent and deceit.
You must be daydreaming that you can wrest more land from India. This time around, if the Indian govt wisely applies itself, maybe you should be ready to lose some of your imperialist conquest. Just remember, Tunisia! A repressive govt has been overturned in a country that had religion as a binding factor. China is similar only that it has Communist repression and muzzling free thought as the binding factor.
 

Ray

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Unfortunitly, I can not right to free speak here.

My post had been removed. I don't know what's different CCP and you?
You have the right to speak.

It has to be logical and based on facts and not on incoherence or hallucinations.
 
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kickok1975

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My friend Ray, thanks for your comments. Let's close this thread.
 

Ray

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Kickof,

You have a point.

Yet, the interaction, contentious that it maybe, is giving insight into the mindset of both side.

From that point of view, it is assisting in understanding each other of the people.

You will notice that there is no restrictions on views being expressed by anyone. It is only when things go off topic that Moderators remind all to return to the topic.

In fact, my own comments are merely to try to attempt to put things in the perspective that many here are airing. A sort of summing up. This was more so required to balance houdue's comments.

I could have replied to the post of houdue which has been deleted being off topic quite comprehensively, but I thought why flog a dead horse, as the English metaphor goes.
 
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captonjohn

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Mr. Pmaitra,

1) I did search, this is real picture taken before 1990, about 20 years ago, the Armed Police wear the 1980s style uniform.

2) Do you know why those women were executed? They are drug traffickers, even today, no matter who you are, carry over 400 gram drug, will be sentenced to death in China. China is not foolish British and French, human right doesn't including freedom to sale drug in China!!!

3) The pictures are very bloody, I also feel very sick, but I understand, chinese law, police, government just did their job to protect innocent people.

4) There are many different way to execute people, shot is one of options. I don't think there is big different between hanging, shot, lethal injection, electric chair. The most importance is justice.

5) Burn brides because their family not offer large dowry? That's really barbarian, right? I read that from Indian news.
If this is the way of justice in china then I don't see any difference between Al Quaida & China. I'm sorry to say if you don't care about human rights and freedom then you don't deserve to inter fare in anybody's matter and you can't call your country good at all. Tell me what legal actions were taken with them before sentencing them to death?

What happens when you are on a journey and someone left exactly similar bag filled with drugs and you took it by mistake?? If this is the justice then china is living in 18th century.
 

captonjohn

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I will be fine with India recognizing Aksai Chin as part of China in exchange for China recognizing Arunachal Pradesh as part of India.
I know there a lot of "patriots" on this forum who want to get back Aksai Chin, but that is simply not going to happen and we should deal with it. No humans have ever lived in Aksai Chin.

These border disputes between India and China are a big headache. The sooner we solve them the better.



I apologize for digressing, I forgot the topic was Tajiks and not Tibet.
I disagree with you friend, there are many areas where no human population exists but it doesn't mean that it can be handed over to any country. Kashmir and Aksai chin is area of strategic importance. China can place its missiles and troops in it and can pose major threat to India. Think 100 times before you agree with that. Arunachal pradesh is already India's part and India don't need anybody's certificate for it.
 

captonjohn

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in fact it was exact suggestion China raised in 1950s. If India had accepted it, there would have be no sino-India war in 1962 and the sino-india border disputes would have been solved long ago.

In fact, Burma accepted such a similar suggestion from China and China also acceptted the east section of McMahon-line as sino-Burma boundary.

However, at that time India rejected it and kept sending troops northward...so.we all know what happened later.

But now, CCP seems not to be satisfied with the suggestion raised by China in 1950 any more and wants Tawang back.
So you mean that if India don't give his part then china would take it by force? Man this is 2011 and nobody can dream about it even china too can't dare to do that. Why always other country should compromise? Why shouldn't china compromise and give land to others? Can you explain?
 

captonjohn

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As I know, most chinese people want to take the whole 90,000sqk land back, if China become a democracy country like India, i believe China will declaim a war tomorrow to get those land back.

If China can not get back the land peacefully, then chinese has to take it back voilently. But the best way for chinese to choose is: dismember India, support Assam Independant Campaign, take the whole east India, and get an indian ocean port.
Keep dreaming dear but some dreams never see day light. China can't take any part of India in any war in future as world research says that both countries are going to stronger day by day. Forget about 90,000 sq km, you can't take even 9 cm from India by war or by diplomacy.
 

captonjohn

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If indian doesn't want to talk, ok, then chinese can go with american way, let's fight, who win, who get the land.
You are giving impression that you understand only one language and that is language of power. Ok tell me in which war USA has get complete victory since world war II? Vietnam, Afganistan, Iraq etc given serious problem to USA. Now if you are comparing China and India then think twice because India has world's second largest land force and just behind you in numbers NOT in quality.

Try out man for war, but if china attack on India china will surely make biggest mistake as no country will be with him against china and US won't allow china to be master of whole asia. Read more about world politics.
 

Monkeyking

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So you mean that if India don't give his part then china would take it by force? Man this is 2011 and nobody can dream about it even china too can't dare to do that. Why always other country should compromise? Why shouldn't china compromise and give land to others? Can you explain?
'cuse china has compromised too much and give up too many lands thanks to those colonists!
And now India, the previous subject or victim of colonists, is trying to take the heritage of the previous colonists! Ironic, right?

if U think Arunachal Pradesh is a legal part of India, that means British colonization of India was legal, too.
So why bother being independent, Is Gandhi a hero?
 

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Out of curiosity, how about SIKKIM, if have a referendum today, choose join China or join India or be independent? what you think the result will be?
And how about having a referendum in tibet before having referendum in AP? What if they choose to leave china or to be independent?
 

Yusuf

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I will not allow threads to be hijacked. This is not about india china disputes. I expect mature posting.
 

captonjohn

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Yusuf thanks, I hope now I will see some relevant comment and we can back to the topic.
 

Tshering22

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Out of curiosity, how about SIKKIM, if have a referendum today, choose join China or join India or be independent? what you think the result will be?
Sikkim had a "referendum" genius. The people VOTED 98% in favour of acceding to Indian Union. And not the first time. The last time we were in a similar state was Mauryan empire 2,300 years ago. I would suggest you ask us from Sikkim rather than believe in what People's Daily feeds you.
 

Tshering22

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2) South Tibet is Indian land, when you have Arunachal state? 1986, right? why it is not 1947?
Yo genius! Heard about Parasurama Kund? It is a holy site in INDIA much older than the British-spread "5,000 years old Indus civilization" propaganda. This is in Lohit district of Arunachal Pradesh.

"Arunachal Pradesh attracts tourists from many parts of the world. Tourist attractions include Tawang, a beautiful town famous for its Buddhist monastery, Ziro, famous for cultural festivals, the Namdapha tiger project in Changlang district and Sela lake near Bomdila with its bamboo bridges overhanging the river. Religious places of interest include Malinithan in Lekhabali, Rukhmininagar near Roing (the place where Rukmini, Lord Krishna's wife in Hinduism, is said to have lived), and Parshuram Kund in Lohit district (the lake where Parshuram washed away his sins). Rafting and trekking are common activities. A visitor's permit from the tourism department is required. Places like Tuting have wonderful, undiscovered scenic beauty."

This is from the official tourism website of the state of Arunachal Pradesh and Wikipedia. Which part of Parashurama Kund, Rukmininagar and Vivekanandnagar sounds Chinese to you? And FYI sage Parashuram existed thousands of years back much before China was under proper empires.

Face it, our language both written and spoken originates from Sanskrit; our culture is Indian and I speak for both Sikkim and Arunachal (my relatives are also from Arunachal). Our customs are Indian. Heck! Even Tibetan is derived from Sanskrit, that your CCP is so keen on banning. Want proof? Check the Tibetan script yourself. And come down from the Red cloud. Everything doesn't belong to you.

Stop embarrassing yourself and ruining the name of good Chinese forum members like kickock.
 
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