Syria crisis: Russia circulates surprise UN resolution

agentperry

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i think russia and usa should finally get on table to mark go and no go areas and us should sort out all its ills with russia if they want to counter heavy weight china
 

The Messiah

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Oh well, constantly siding with losing parties is an excellent strategy... :pound:
We have not sided with anyone...we are neutral.

We can still have an opinion while being officially neutral...but you wont understand because your country doesn't have the bollocks to think for itself but it rather instructed by bigger powers.

Its astonishing how deluded you actually are that you think India has been siding with "losing parties". Name one country that has good relations with israel & iran and usa & russia ? :rofl:
 
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Virendra

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There must be a ceasefire first and then the talking.
Sir I don't see an organized opposition to cease fire against. They are as solvent as Talibans among the common Afghans.
How does a State ceasefire against the somewhat rookie, irregular but still very unpredictable and dangerous opposition?

What is the political future of Syria if Assad is out of equation by any means.
How do these permutations affect Iran? Relevant because Assad is a Shia and so are most of the elite in his forces.

Regards,
Virendra
 

pmaitra

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Oh well, constantly siding with losing parties is an excellent strategy... :pound:
AsianObserve, let's say it is realpolitik. Russia needs Syria for its base there. That's all.

Besides, even US has been siding with Pakistan for decades, and what's worse, Pakistan is worse than a losing party, it is an opponent. If the rebels agreed to let Russia retain that base, I won't be surprised if the Russians switched sides. In any event, that good thing is that this new UN document at least establishes a parity between armed soldiers and armed rebels.
 
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asianobserve

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i think russia and usa should finally get on table to mark go and no go areas and us should sort out all its ills with russia if they want to counter heavy weight china

Russia is no longer in a position to carve out the World... It's not the USSR.
 

asianobserve

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Its astonishing how deluded you actually are that you think India has been siding with "losing parties". Name one country that has good relations with israel & iran and usa & russia ? :rofl:

I think we can be articulate yet still short on memory.

Alliance to "all" is the absence of a strategic policy (reminds me of "jack of all trades master of none"). This is the failed policy of Nehru that wasted several precious opportunities in the past.
 
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asianobserve

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AsianObserve, let's say it is realpolitik. Russia needs Syria for its base there. That's all.

Actually, realistically speaking (in the spirit of "realpolitik") Russia is no longer in the position to counterbalance the West. It's just a nuisance now.
 

pmaitra

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Actually, realistically speaking (in the spirit of "realpolitik") Russia is no longer in the position to counterbalance the West. It's just a nuisance now.
Perhaps in your opinion. I think Russia is a good balance to the West and the only hope in the foreseeable future to a bipolar world. Russia right after collapse of the USSR is not the same as the Russia during Russo-Georgian War. Just to let you know how far Russia is willing and capable of going to defend its interests.
 

asianobserve

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Perhaps in your opinion. I think Russia is a good balance to the West and the only hope in the foreseeable future to a bipolar world. Russia right after collapse of the USSR is not the same as the Russia during Russo-Georgian War. Just to let you know how far Russia is willing and capable of going to defend its interests.

There maybe a Cold War 2.0 in the future but definitely it's not going to be Russia at the other end of the US. I agree with you on the bipolar World, I'd prefer it anytime than a historically chaotic multi-polar setup.

Anyway, Russia can't even remove Saakashvili from power. Just to illustrate to you the extent of Russian post-Cold War capability (or lack of it).
 

pmaitra

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There maybe a Cold War 2.0 in the future but definitely it's not going to be Russia at the other end of the US. I agree with you on the bipolar World, I'd prefer it anytime than a historically chaotic multi-polar setup.

Anyway, Russia can't even remove Saakashvili from power. Just to illustrate to you the extent of Russian post-Cold War capability (or lack of it).
How do you know that it was Russia's objective to remove Saakashvili? That would have made him more popular in his country when in reality he has many opponents that he is trying to stifle. Russia had four objectives: (1) securing freedom to the autonomous regions in Georgia that were formerly part of the Georgian SSR and eligible for their own vote of independence which Georgia denied, (2) scuttling the gas transit project, (3) keeping Georgia out of NATO and (4) tit-for-tat w.r.t. what NATO did in Kosovo. All objectives were met, so it is cool now.
 

asianobserve

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How do you know that it was Russia's objective to remove Saakashvili? That would have made him more popular in his country when in reality he has many opponents that he is trying to stifle. Russia had four objectives: (1) securing freedom to the autonomous regions in Georgia that were formerly part of the Georgian SSR and eligible for their own vote of independence which Georgia denied, (2) scuttling the gas transit project, (3) keeping Georgia out of NATO and (4) tit-for-tat w.r.t. what NATO did in Kosovo. All objectives were met, so it is cool now.

Stop believing the lies from Moscow. The objective for the Russian ops against Georgia was simple, remove Saakashvili (either directly or indirectly by humiliating him hard enough) and teach a lesson to other former Soviet Republics (Russia's so called "backyard") from becoming too cozy with NATO (West). Russia miserably failed in both objectives. Guess who are the most ardent supporters of the NATO missile shield? The same former Soviet Republics that Putin and Medvedev are intimidating.

Especially the "independence" of those Georgian provinces the alleged reasons you propounded are unbelievable at best. Since when did Russia care so much for the yearning for independence of some minorities?
 

pmaitra

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Stop believing the lies from Moscow. The objective for the Russian ops against Georgia was simple, remove Saakashvili (either directly or indirectly by humiliating him hard enough) and teach a lesson to other former Soviet Republics (Russia's so called "backyard") from becoming too cozy with NATO (West). Russia miserably failed in both objectives. Guess who are the most ardent supporters of the NATO missile shield? The same former Soviet Republics that Putin and Medvedev are intimidating.
Objective could have been removal of Saakashvili, but that war galvanised all Georgians to rally behind Saakashvili, who otherwise are against him. Russia had rather have control of those regions and have a weakened Saakashvili than remove him or annex Georgia. Moreover, they humiliated his and in that process, the US. Most importantly the scuttled the gas pipeline.

Especially the "independence" of those Georgian provinces the alleged reasons you propounded are unbelievable at best. Since when did Russia care so much for the yearning for independence of some minorities?
This is not the correct thread to discuss this. The USSR was a voluntary union of several SSRs. Some SSRs had autonomous SSRs within and had the right to secede in case the containing SSR seceded from the USSR. This right was denied by Georgia. This is a fact. Read up on it in the relevant thread instead of guessing around.
 

asianobserve

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Objective could have been removal of Saakashvili, but that war galvanised all Georgians to rally behind Saakashvili
Moscow twins' miscalculation. They really believed the Soviet propaganda that the people in these former Eastern Bloc countries love mother Russia... :laugh: Maybe we can agree on a partial success of Russian objectives. But for a country claiming to be a peer of the US this accomplishment is, well, embarrassing.

The USSR was a voluntary union of several SSRs.
Now that's a tall claim that I wish you never said. The eagerness of these former Soviet Satellites to break away from the USSR will tell you a lot about their voluntariness in the Union. Hence, when it was clear that Moscow will not violently crush the manic rush of East Berliners out of the Berlin Wall into West Berlin the Russia imposed Union simply collapsed like a deck of cards.
 
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pmaitra

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Moscow twins' miscalculation. They really believed the Soviet propaganda that the people in these former Eastern Bloc countries love mother Russia... :laugh: Maybe we can agree on a partial success of Russian objectives. But for a country claiming to be a peer of the US this accomplishment is, well, embarrassing.



Now that's a tall claim that I wish you never said. The eagerness of these former Soviet Satellites to break away from the USSR will tell you a lot about their voluntariness in the Union. Hence, when it was clear that Moscow will not violently crush the manic rush of East Berliners out of the Berlin Wall into West Berlin the Russia imposed Union simply collapsed like a deck of cards.
More BS. Read about the referendum:

 

agentperry

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putin shouldnt be favored in kremlin.
a weak successor of putin is required who makes good relations with usa so that pakistan can be screwed more, putin is firm in relooking its ties with India
 

civfanatic

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A little-known fact is that the Central Asian Republics were most in support of preserving the USSR. Indeed there was a time when Almaty, Tashkent, and Frunze were some of the best cities in Asia and the people there did not want their republics to become another Afghanistan. Also, Moscow was far more lenient with Islam than they were with Orthodox Christianity and other Christian denominations.

The Baltic Republics were most against the USSR due to historical and cultural reasons, followed by Georgia and Ukraine.
 

Param

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putin shouldnt be favored in kremlin.
a weak successor of putin is required who makes good relations with usa so that pakistan can be screwed more, putin is firm in relooking its ties with India
That will be good for India but bad for Russia.
Putin is the right guy to strengthen Russia.
 

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