Super pawaaarrrr

[JayATL]

Look guys , you can't look at this personally. If you are an avid student or wanna be student of foreign policy this article is amazing. I have to give credit to Ray for finding it( not in my Fab Fav 5 of friends in my phone) .

However, sometime I go I had an thread posted that China or India will not be superpowers in distant future too. They will be economic powers for sure BUT to be a super power you need to go up against NATO and US cumulative bases and military power.

Below is a lesson of how a Super Power works to diffuse any perceived threat to its status. Fantastic read for those who love politics , especially foreign policy and militray strategies. ( I assume this was not posted as a thread previously, lol)

again, don't get caught up in taking it personally ( talk about your countries).

This strategy came to light when Obama visited India, Indonesia, South Korea and Japan earlier this month, even as US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, Secretary of Defence Robert Gates and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Admiral Michael Mullen paid visits to six other countries in the Asia-Pacific area — Cambodia, Malaysia, Australia, New Zealand, Papua New Guinea and Tonga.

This is how Clinton summed up the message that the South Pacific visits sent: "What we are intent upon doing is not just demonstrating we're back by flying from capital to capital, but putting real meat on the bones of that position"¦ Obviously, our military, in close cooperation with yours, is looking at how we can upgrade the presence of the United States in partnership with Australia and others," she said in an interview to an Australian daily.

During Clinton's visit to New Zealand, the US effectively revived the Cold War-era Pacific Security Pact, ANZUS (Australia-New Zealand-US), which lapsed into a coma after New Zealand, in 1984, banned US nuclear powered warships from entering its harbours. The Wellington Declaration on a New Strategic Partnership between New Zealand and the US, which Clinton signed, paves the way for the full restoration of the tripartite defence pact.

Four days later, Gates, in Melbourne, announced the establishment of a new bilateral working group that, according to the Pentagon's American Forces Press Service, will be tasked with facilitating "greater US naval presence and port visits in the region."

US visitors also declared Washington resolve to expand its footprint in South-East Asia. Clinton called for beefing up US military presence in Singapore, which implies a firmer grip on the strategic Strait of Malacca, strengthening defence cooperation with Thailand and the Philippines in the fight against terrorism and natural disasters, and stepping up interaction with Vietnam.

Earlier this year the US decided to go through with $6.5 billion worth of weapons sales to Taiwan, provoking strong protests from China.

During his visit to Japan, Obama assured his hosts that the US-Japan alliance is "the cornerstone of American strategic engagement in the Asia Pacific" and "the commitment of the United States to the defence of Japan is unshakable." There is consensus in the Russian expert community that Obama's visit to India was focused on winning support for Washington's strategy of containing and encircling China. Most experts think that India is not willing to play the role of "a fulcrum of US anti-China policy," as one analyst put it.

However, India's reluctance to upset the US in the slightest way, displayed at the trilateral RIC meeting of Russian, Indian and Chinese foreign ministers in Wuhan, China, and which came on the heels of Obama's visit to India, raised concerns that New Delhi may be cozying up to the US a little too far for Moscow's comfort.

According to informed sources, Indian diplomats struck down a reference to "non-bloc" principles for building "an open transparent inclusive and balanced security and cooperation architecture in the Asia-Pacific region" in the Russian draft of the Wuhan communiqué.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.p...t=va&aid=22173

 

[warriorextreme]

USA has to do a lot if they want to get "close" to India.

 

[JayATL]

it is ... padawan. I believe India is enjoying unprecedented levels of cooperation , almost like a NATO partner and in some cases more.

 

[chex3009]

Indians will never trust the Americans.

They are the worst Mafia out there, they can side with anyone to reap benefits and give them some token in response.

 

[JayATL]

^^^ did you read the article? allow me to quote "

However, India's reluctance to upset the US in the slightest way, displayed at the trilateral RIC meeting of Russian, Indian and Chinese foreign ministers in Wuhan, China, and which came on the heels of Obama's visit to India, raised concerns that New Delhi may be cozying up to the US a little too far for Moscow's comfort.

According to informed sources, Indian diplomats struck down a reference to "non-bloc" principles for building "an open transparent inclusive and balanced security and cooperation architecture in the Asia-Pacific region" in the Russian draft of the Wuhan communiqué."

 

[chex3009]

^^^ So, what? We are still skeptical of their (American) Foreign policy.

If India was so comfortable with the US, then we might have cozied up with them on every front, especially when the dragon is rising in our backyard.

To trust Americans is like being a friend of cobra...

 

[JayATL]

OoooooKaaayyyyy then.

 

[A.V.]

Here is the Official line .............

AMERICAN VIEW
India asks too many questions to be an ally

Indian View
America puts too many conditions to be trusted.

 

[chex3009]

Here is the Official line .............

AMERICAN VIEW
India asks too many questions to be an ally

Indian View
America puts too many conditions to be trusted.

Agreed 100% with your take on it.

 

[captonjohn]

^^^ So, what? We are still skeptical of their (American) Foreign policy.

If India was so comfortable with the US, then we might have cozied up with them on every front, especially when the dragon is rising in our backyard.

To trust Americans is like being a friend of cobra...

Cool man in this world no permanent friends or enemies but permanent interests. They are saving their interests and we are saving our interests. Don't get hyper on US coz almost all nation do same when it come to their interests EXCEPT india. In india our leaders are so weak that they can't put their interest anywhere in the world.

 

[JayATL]

and then they meet in the middle, is my view . honestly, as I said , India is enjoying unprecedented access and relationship. watch it will only get better...they will sign trade deals with India and try to ease china's heavy stake in their market.

 

[chex3009]

and then they meet in the middle, is my view . honestly, as I said , India is enjoying unprecedented access and relationship. watch it will only get better...they will sign trade deals with India and try to ease china's heavy stake in their market.

Yes thats good for us but in return every six months we get to read that Pakistan is handed over 18 new F-16C/D and billions in aid, thats where the mistrust begins.

 

[JayATL]

why mistrust , those f16's were part of some package they had paid for years ago, I thought. and the aid, well they are broke and US wants them to be on the NWFP . don't worry about those loans that country is pretty much fubared for a decade atlest.

 

[chex3009]

why mistrust , those f16's were part of some package they had paid for years ago, I thought. and the aid, well they are broke and US wants them to be on the NWFP . don't worry about those loans that country is pretty much fubared for a decade atlest.

Still they are the only country with the fastest production of nuclear weapons in the world and US can't do much about it, can they?

 

[JayATL]

its a sovereign country, but US has all the nukes locked down( actually they are all separated and not assembled ) and is over its security. But let's get back to the topic on hand. did you find it a good read from a cerebral perspective?

 

[chex3009]

Good Read, and actually it put India into a very interesting position, we can have technological access from both Americans (they are ban-lifting spree from some of our premier institutes) and Russians, which no country has.

And by this we want to remain in good books of all the powers that we are playing with.

Jay, Can you elaborate more on India's position between these two powers, and ofcourse China, our neighbour.

 

[Oracle]

its a sovereign country, but US has all the nukes locked down( actually they are all separated and not assembled ) and is over its security. But let's get back to the topic on hand. did you find it a good read from a cerebral perspective?

Joke of the day : US has Pakistani nukes locked down

 

[JayATL]

Good Read, and actually it put India into a very interesting position, we can have technological access from both Americans (they are ban-lifting spree from some of our premier institutes) and Russians, which no country has.

And by this we want to remain in good books of all the powers that we are playing with.

Jay, Can you elaborate more on India's position between these two powers, and ofcourse China, our neighbour.

my perspective is two folds.

The first one is more anecdotal, in that the perception of the US public is very different of china from India. They look at china as more of a threat vs India. India is someone who is possibly taking away jobs from the US - But there is also a more welcoming attitude towards India, especially after the last visit when India signed the aircraft deal and the people learned of all the jobs coming with it for the US.

Alternatively, China is looked at as someone challenging America and being antagonistic. What does not help is, when pn every occasion the world body and US specifically attempts sanctions on rogue nations, china always blocks it. So the perception of china is that they make friends with the worlds pariah nations ( NK, Iran, Pakistan, Syria, Sudan, dictators in Africa)

Second opinion is more of what I have read and understood. This document states a lot of it. But the most important part is that US definitely wants to ally up close with India and use it to slow china's market share. Unlike Afghanistan where once the mission was accomplished the US left. China is not going anywhere but on top, so I believe that this would be a more sustained relationship and should not be seen through the eyes of how they dealt with Pakistan in the 80's. And as you pointed out India has not put all its eggs in one basket, it also works with Russia and so truly that non-aligned status is helping India now.

Another thought is that most markets are getting saturated and so it makes sense for NATO / US to look at India's vast market to sustain their exports. But the 800 pound gorilla in the room is still China's de-valuing of it's currency. It will have to be raised at some point, as it can't sustain itself at those rates. And it is here where India comes in and takes advantage of those markets.

I'll stop here with this last bit: Indians are very integrated in American politics and it helps. I read somewhere that there is an Indian in almost every US congressman and senators staff.

 

[Tshering22]

^^ The article is pretty interesting and certainly puts us in a great position. There is going to be cooperation but it will not be along the lines of what US gets from NATO. US in general is a friendly-to-India country but as a part of what we get from Russians (no meddling in our business), this is seen less in the US. Otherwise, you will find us pretty welcoming sort. It is just as A.V. put:

US POV:

India asks too many questions for being an ally

Indian POV:

US puts too many conditions for being an ally.

 

[JayATL]

I have never come across a truly equal partnership / relationship with any two countries. all I say is don't treat it as a zero sum game. You win some, you comprise and lose on others. So if you get a no from the US, remember India says plenty of no to the US too! ( NPT anyone? )