Sukhoi Su 30MKI

[HariPrasad-1]

(Assuming HTFE-25 has 25KN dry thrust)

It has 25 KN thrust and it is tested on that thrust level already. Any reason for doubting?

 

[Steven Rogers]

1. HAL IS the problem. Unions, corruption, lackluster work culture. This causes more problems than it aims to solve. There is a reason Rafale production will be given to a Franco - Indian consortium like BrahMos not HAL.

2. Same AESA and EW suit is in Jaguar upgrade. These HAL folk think MoD and IAF are ch***yas. If you have 83 in production, you can bulk buy to reduce costs. There is definitely something fishy here.

3. We OWN HAL. Why not put IAF directly in charge of QA and corporate side while HAL does floor management, production and R&D?

These chaps could have been bifurticated into 2 PSUs and made to compete against each other like Mikoyan & Gurevich and Sukhoi or Lockheed and Boeing. Single supplier monopoly by a PSU is asking for trouble.

Jagaur aesa and ew is not same as that of mk1 a,jagaur has a smaller aesa than what it will be on mk1a . Worker union is to be blamed ...nepotism is very high and they always go on strike for anything that is done to reform.

 

[Enquirer]

Jagaur aesa and ew is not same as that of mk1 a,jagaur has a smaller aesa than what it will be on mk1a . Worker union is to be blamed ...nepotism is very high and they always go on strike for anything that is done to reform.

Both will have ELM 2052!
That was the deal done with Elta! That Tejas would also have the same radar as Jaguar!
EW suite may vary.

 

[Enquirer]

It has 25 KN thrust and it is tested on that thrust level already. Any reason for doubting?

It's rare for Indian orgs to achieve the parameters that they initially set out to achieve. I've read it's tested for 'full' thrust.........but I don't remember reading the exact number for the thrust achieved.

 

[power_monger]

Htfe 25 does not have afterburner. This was confirmed by harsh vardhan thakur , chief test pilot of hal.

 

[uoftotaku]

Htfe 25 does not have afterburner. This was confirmed by harsh vardhan thakur , chief test pilot of hal.

Yeah...cause it was originally meant to power the HJT-36 which doesn't require afterburner as its not supersonic. The inordinate delay in both projects lead to de-coupling of the development and HJT-36 is now made with imported Saturn Al-55 engine from Russia

As a result the HTFE-25 currently has no actual utilization plan. Its development is taking place in a vacuum for R&D purposes only.

 

[Enquirer]

Yeah...cause it was originally meant to power the HJT-36 which doesn't require afterburner as its not supersonic. The inordinate delay in both projects lead to de-coupling of the development and HJT-36 is now made with imported Saturn Al-55 engine from Russia

As a result the HTFE-25 currently has no actual utilization plan. Its development is taking place in a vacuum for R&D purposes only.

Geniuses at work.................

 

[uoftotaku]

Geniuses at work.................

Yeah bhai...90% of the problems with R&D in Indian defense would be solved if the great geniuses simply let go of the notion that they are somehow all knowing gyaani brahma blessed special super brain descendants of Aryabhata

 

[IndianHawk]

280 su30mki upg (14 squadrons)(18 new)
86 mig 29upg (4 squadrons)(21 new)
48 mirage2k upg (3 squadrons)
40 Lca mk1 (2 squadrons)
83 lca mk1a (4 squadrons)
36 rafales (2 squadron)

29 squadrons are certain.Plus whatever jaguars can be retained as numbers slowly decline.
Jaguar (from 90 odd in 5 sq down to 3 sq by 2025 and retired by 2030 without engines)
Rafales,mirage and sukhoi swing fighters for both fronts.Tejas mk1 and 1a pak centric for forward bases.Mig29 pak centric .Same for remaining jaguars.

2 more rafale squadrons almost certain.So 31 certain squadrons.
The 7 mirage and mig29 squadrons will be replaced by amca.
Tejas mk2 mwf will replace jaguars and be used for filling squadron strength from 31- 42.Atleast 8-11 squadrons.Need single engine fighters to manage operating costs.

FGFA wont happen unless a panic buy is needed against chinese 5th gen.(rafale with irst can handle it).In that case it would likely be european or f35 rather than fgfa which has fake stealth as of now.

Some 50 jaguar were build between 2003-08 they will serve till 2045. And some 20-30 were of 1990s which will serve till 2030.

Jaguars will stay with iaf for a while.

About htfe 25 an afterburner added to it could solve the problem with 40 kn thrust with afterburner it can power jaguar.

Sent from my C103 using Tapatalk

 

[ezsasa]

The era of Dedicated bombers is gone. We need rafale type fighters who can perform all the roles . Su30mki is multirole too and getting batter at ground attack. No need for another aircraft to maintain .

Sent from my C103 using Tapatalk

Era of dedicated bombers has not gone away, those tactics have been brushed under the carpet for now.

This is a result of Kennedy and USSR understanding that they would fight limited wars, not full blown conventional war.

Strategic bombers will be back in action once there is a change in policy, depending on circumstances of course.

The way Putin and China are making their moves, we might be going back to that era in another 10 years.

 

[Akula]

Future stealth bombers
USA- X-21 Raider
Russia- Pak Da
China- Xi'an H-20

 

[ashdoc]

Some 50 jaguar were build between 2003-08 they will serve till 2045. And some 20-30 were of 1990s which will serve till 2030.

Jaguars will stay with iaf for a while.

About htfe 25 an afterburner added to it could solve the problem with 40 kn thrust with afterburner it can power jaguar.

Sent from my C103 using Tapatalk

The engine upgrade is very costly. Better to have new aircraft than spend such money.

 

[Punya Pratap]

The IAF will deploy according to the threat perception and Rafale will be more to deal with PLAAF with its ability to outgun and outbomb anything the chinks have. It's going to be Super Sukhoi providing top cover and Rafales in strike role.
For PAF a couple of Rafale squadrons with a mix of Mirage, Tejas and MIG 29's would be ample!!

So 250+ Sukhoi 30 mostly China Centric
110 Rafale mostly Pakistan centric.
120+ Tejas mostly China and Pakistan centric, Tejas has been demonstrated to fly in Ladakh so it could most likely fly in AP as well.
40+ Mirages 2000 mostly Paksitan centric
130+ Jaguar for CAS roles Pakistan centric.
70+ Mig 29 mostly gor coastal defence as they may carry 3 Brahmos NG and 2 A2A one day.

AMCA???????????????
FGFA???????????

 

[vampyrbladez]

Jagaur aesa and ew is not same as that of mk1 a,jagaur has a smaller aesa than what it will be on mk1a . Worker union is to be blamed ...nepotism is very high and they always go on strike for anything that is done to reform.

Both have the ELTA 2052 AESA and EW system.

HAL will die of its own fault.

 

[IndianHawk]

The engine upgrade is very costly. Better to have new aircraft than spend such money.

That is why htfe has to be developed.
These 2000s build jaguar have new airfram and new engine which will work well till 2040 atleast.

Engine performance has gone down for older jaguars.

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[IndianHawk]

Era of dedicated bombers has not gone away, those tactics have been brushed under the carpet for now.

This is a result of Kennedy and USSR understanding that they would fight limited wars, not full blown conventional war.

Strategic bombers will be back in action once there is a change in policy, depending on circumstances of course.

The way Putin and China are making their moves, we might be going back to that era in another 10 years.

Strategic bombers are a different category all together . We were discussing tactical bombers like jaguar ,su34 etc.

Even strategic bombers are facing increased threat from air defence , ever growing sam ranges. They will have to be stealth too. Stealth strategic bombers will be prohibitively costly for most airforces including us.

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[Shekhar Singh]

1 su30 for 2 jaguars. So for six squadron of jaguar 3 sq of su30mki needed.= 60 su30MKI.

I would rather see 40 su30mki + 40 more lca mk1a to replace them .

But it will eat into mwf orders which was supposed to replace jaguar by 2030.



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MWF will replace Mirage 2000 and Mig 29.

 

[Steven Rogers]

Both have the ELTA 2052 AESA and EW system.

HAL will die of its own fault.

Jagaur has smaller aesa with 300trm and dare developed ew suite, Mk1a will be carrying a bigger aesa with probably 500trm 2052 and elm8222wb jammer.

 

[Steven Rogers]

Both will have ELM 2052!
That was the deal done with Elta! That Tejas would also have the same radar as Jaguar!
EW suite may vary.

ELM2052 has 3re variants and jagaur will be getting smallest of all while Mk1a will be getting the mid one with 500trms. Their is no deal done for elm2052 for mk1a,Hal has yet to place order for bulk.

 

[Enquirer]

Jagaur has smaller aesa with 300trm and dare developed ew suite, Mk1a will be carrying a bigger aesa with probably 500trm 2052 and elm8222wb jammer.

Uttam is supposed to have 700+ trms....is the range of Uttam supposedly better than that of 2052 that might go on Mk1A?

Do you know of the actual range of 2052 that's in consideration for Mk1A?