Sri Lanka Air Force to buy FC-1

vishwaprasad

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
474
Likes
149
Country flag
LCA has 6 squadrons worth order from IAF which buys some of the best planes in the world after through scrutiny.That one order speaks about the quality of tejas.But JF-17 is not in service in the nation that designed it,which flies planes far inferior and older than JF-17.

Speaks volumes about it's credibility.Instead it is being sold to each and every member of the "broke and rogue nations inc", of the world.

Some nuts from across the border are celebrating it as deal of the century, and you are congratulating it and saying LCA is not even ready.

Do you know production line for tejas is already there?Do you know the significance of fly by wire controlled relaxed static stability?DO you know the significance of the deadly combination of fly by wire controlled relaxed static stability and low wing loading?

And they are buying a "BRAND NEW "plane which was not futuristic enough in the home country from where it was designed shows their intelligence.

Chinese airforce did not accept JF-17 because by the time it debuted it was below the modern military avionic world standard ,despite the fact that they have very many older obsolete planes that cry for replacement.

Because considering it as a frontline fighter and tying scarce resources like pilots and airbases to JF-17 for the next 30 years won't give them any significant edge over any other older enemy fighter let alone new fighters in service in the neighbourhood .This is glossed over by glibly saying"THAT JF-17 IS INTENDED FOR INTERNATIONAL CUSTOMERS".

Like every other item in PAK's missile inventory the pakis are claiming it is a joint venture and you are congratulation our SRILANKAN BROs for this sagacious move.
well whatever...still it does not change the fact that LCA is not yet operational...

significance of deadly combination of fly by wire and controlled relaxed static stability and low wing loading I will discuss when it is operational....

I said I wish it was LCA but it is not yet operational.....nothing offensive in my opinion....and I am no fan of JFT either....

Only thing I did not like the way some members are making fun of SL's choice....

anyway still I am sorry if my post seemed offensive to my Indian bros...
 
Last edited:

ersakthivel

Brilliance
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
7,029
Likes
8,762
Country flag
well whatever...still it does not change the fact that LCA is not yet operational...

significance of deadly combination of fly by wire and controlled relaxed static stability and low wing loading I will discuss when it is operational....

I said I wish it was LCA but it is not yet operational.....nothing offensive in my opinion....and I am no fan of JFT either....

Only thing I did not like the way some members are making fun of SL's choice....

anyway still I am sorry if my post seemed offensive to my Indian bros...
I have been through much worse here so no offence taken on your post.Every program faces problems and time delays owing to many counts and people have a right to criticize it. You should refer to Retd Airmarshal MSD Wollen's article posted in tejas -IV thread here to know how complex it is?

And also the earliest IAF ASR for tejas in 1984 was top speed mach -1.5 st service ceiling of 15 km with MTOW of 12 tons.And STR of 17 deg with AOA much lower not even specified.

But funding was given for two Tech demos only in1993.Before that just 500 cr was sanctioned and infra was set up with theoritical project definition phase.

The two tech demos were built and flew by 2001, just 7 years after funding.In 1984 there was no availability of 120 km weighing BVRs with 200 plus KG weight. So pylons were designed primarily for lower weight lesser range BVrs.Accordingly wing had lesser weight for lesser strength required for these missiles.

As the program progressed these higher weight longer range missiles were available and wings were strengthened to carry them leading to higher weight.This was explained by none other than scientific advisor to then PM Parthasaraty in an article which too was posted on tejas thread here.

So these re engineering lead to further delays, Nuclear tests and sanctions contributed their own bit to the delay. You should take it all into consideration before criticizing the program.Many trolls here know all these and act as if they are ignorant and take potshots at the so called delay.Please don't encourage them.

Now the mk-1 has design topspeed of mach 1.8 at 15 km same as rafale and has a MTOW of close to 14 tons with higher STR and AOA of 26 degree along with HMDS fired WVRs and can fire any 120 km range missile because it's radar has a tracking and detection range of 120 km ,other than sukhoi no fighter in IAf has this ability.

The mk-2 is going to have a mach 2 plus top speeds at much higher service ceiling and 5 ton pay load, with improvement in STR, AOA and all other parameters.The reason it can be developed so fast is all the hard work is already done on mk-1.


Also what is so innovative in JF-17?It is modeled on old russian airframe with available russian engines with conventional stable flight profile meaning plane always tend to oppose pilot's commands to maneuver it.Because it is modeled on stable flight profile meaning the fighter tends to return to level flight whenever maneuvered by pilot.This limits it's agility no matter what topspeed it has, meaning limits on maneuverability in critical close combat and missile evasion tactics .

But tejas doesn't suffer these limits because it is aerodynamically unstable controlled by FBW design conferring excellent maneuverability in these close combat situations


But tejas is unstable and always tend to go off in all directions departing from stable level flight and is constantly monitored by computer with adjustments of 10 to 12 times a second on it's control surfaces to just to make it fly level.All fly by wire unstable configuration fighters take more time to develop because of the complexity in writing software analyzing revalidating and finessing it .

This mastery of fly by wire tech will shorten the development time of new fighters considerably as the experience in writing this control laws for FBW is the most critical tech in future stealth planes as they tend to rely more on them just to fly.

A couple of prototype grippens crashed because of this FBW wire issues and they took consultancy with CASSIDIAN a firm in Us to solve it. Compare that to 2000 incident free flights of tejas and you can understand the enormity of this achievement.

What makes it even more significant is ot was fully developed indigenously after US confiscated all the code and equipments developed till then after the nuclear test by indian in the 1990s.

Why people do it?


because it makes plane more maneuverable and agile than the stable conventional layouts like JF-17 and Mig-21s.The first two fighters that did it were MIRAGE-2000 and F-16. Both are still regarded as gold standards in fighter world till this day with close to more than 4000 fighters built and sold. They are still modern because of this fly by wire unstable flight profile.

That's the reason crux of the fighter development here. But JF-17 has none of these complexities
 
Last edited:

farhan_9909

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Aug 30, 2012
Messages
5,895
Likes
497
@ersakthivel
LCA has 6 squadrons worth order from IAF which buys some of the best planes in the world after through scrutiny.That one order speaks about the quality of tejas.But JF-17 is not in service in the nation that designed it,which flies planes far inferior and older than JF-17.
sometime your statements are very dull.
there is nothing as such.JFT is a small fighter with very limited combat radius
*china already have option of j-10 series with much better range and payload

Speaks volumes about it's credibility.Instead it is being sold to each and every member of the "broke and rogue nations inc", of the world.
again dull statement

Some nuts from across the border are celebrating it as deal of the century, and you are congratulating it and saying LCA is not even ready.

Do you know production line for tejas is already there?Do you know the significance of fly by wire controlled relaxed static stability?DO you know the significance of the deadly combination of fly by wire controlled relaxed static stability and low wing loading?

Lol once again
production line with a capacity of producing 1 lsp in 11 months..do you call this speed?
if so is the case than brother indeed IAF might get its first squarden in 2017-18
And they are buying a "BRAND NEW "plane which was not futuristic enough in the home country from where it was designed shows their intelligence.

Chinese airforce did not accept JF-17 because by the time it debuted it was below the modern military avionic world standard ,despite the fact that they have very many older obsolete planes that cry for replacement.
do you have any reason to support this statement?any source?

your proved wrong about the FBW about JFT.again i repeat.your knowledge about jft is either limited or your too strickly hold by blind patrotism
Because considering it as a frontline fighter and tying scarce resources like pilots and airbases to JF-17 for the next 30 years won't give them any significant edge over any other older enemy fighter let alone new fighters in service in the neighbourhood .This is glossed over by glibly saying"THAT JF-17 IS INTENDED FOR INTERNATIONAL CUSTOMERS".

Like every other item in PAK's missile inventory the pakis are claiming it is a joint venture and you are congratulation our SRILANKAN BROs for this sagacious move.
there are many more customer inline

while IAF has rejected LCA tejas so far..correct me if i am wrong
 
Last edited by a moderator:

ersakthivel

Brilliance
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
7,029
Likes
8,762
Country flag
@ersakthivel


sometime your statements are very dull.
there is nothing as such.JFT is a small fighter with very limited combat radius
*china already have option of j-10 series with much better range and payload



again dull statement




Lol once again
production line with a capacity of producing 1 lsp in 11 months..do you call this speed?
if so is the case than brother indeed IAF might get its first squarden in 2017-18


do you have any reason to support this statement?any source?

your proved wrong about the FBW about JFT.again i repeat.your knowledge about jft is either limited or your too strickly hold by blind patrotism


there are many more customer inline

while IAF has rejected LCA tejas so far..correct me if i am wrong
The HAL produces so many other planes , so it is not that it does not know how to produce it. The term limited series production implies it is limited in speed and nos because each aircraft involves minor changes from the previous one.

So how do you mass produce with 10 or 12 a year?This limited series ends with LSP-8. The design will be fully finalized and Serial production will be lot quicker.

Well only thing I want to state here is JF-17 is conventional stable layout flight profile plane which uses FBW software alone in this axis or that axis..

And TEJAS is relaxed static stability platform meaning unstable flight profile which relies on FBW to fly.

You can exploit the potential of fly by wire only in a fully unstable platform that always try to veer out of control like TEJAS not in stable flight profile with just one axis fly by wire tech.If you have any doubt you can refer to MIRAGE-2000 and F-16 sites,

If JF_17 too was designed from ground up as fully relaxed static stability unstable flight profile platform show it and I will accept it.

fully relaxed static stability unstable flight profile must be adapted when they design the airframe from scratch .It is not a radar or missile upgrade that can be slung on latter.

If you don't understand that or don't want to understand that is something upto you.You can google and find out about it yourself.

I am a bit dull because I post technical stuff not sooth saying stuff.BTW how did you discover IAF rejected TEJAS?

Seems news to me.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

farhan_9909

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Aug 30, 2012
Messages
5,895
Likes
497
The HAL produces so many other planes , so it is not that it does not know how to produce it. The term limited series production implies it is limited in speed and nos because each aircraft involves minor changes from the previous one.

So how do you mass produce with 10 or 12 a year?This limited series ends with LSP-8. The design will be fully finalized and Serial production will be lot quicker.
better we leave this


Well only thing I want to state here is JF-17 is conventional stable layout flight profile plane which uses FBW software alone in this axis or that axis..

And TEJAS is relaxed static stability platform meaning unstable flight profile which relies on FBW to fly.

You can exploit the potential of fly by wire only in a fully unstable platform that always try to veer out of control like TEJAS not in stable flight profile with just one axis fly by wire tech.If you have any doubt you can refer to MIRAGE-2000 and F-16 sites,

If JF_17 too was designed from ground up as fully relaxed static stability unstable flight profile platform show it and I will accept it.
Upgraded in prototype stage.brother your that dumb or acting so?
do you know more than fighter aircrafts pilots like gambit or crobato?

According to the information obtained by the author, with surfers and explore! 1. 1 configuration. side of Xiaolong 04 and 16 similar to the configuration, Medium used pneumatic normal aspect ratio wing edge of the layout, highlighted the strong performance of low-altitude and high-subsonic mobility. But in the details, the two were different, Xiaolong 04 : First, the edge of the area and more than 01 planes. also much higher than the F-16. Aircraft wings are designed to improve the edge of the lift-to-drag ratio under a certain angle of attack, improving the performance of the aircraft at high angles of attack. But using such a large edge design of the aircraft is not, it is estimated that only a F-18E/F. Trouble from the edge of the 5.2 m 2 to 7 m 2, increased by 34%. It will not only raise the maximum lift coefficient aircraft, taking off and landing capabilities. also greatly enhanced the mobility of the aircraft at high angles of attack. extremely powerful vortex edge of the wing airflow postpone the occurrence and development. F-18E/F excellent performance at high angles of attack apparently inseparable from its side of the wing design. Meanwhile, behind the Xiaolong 04 / end up greatly, bow torque at high angles of attack can provide. Xiaolong 04 while increasing the use of its high angle of attack expected to further enhance mobility! But more important role is that of Xiaolong 04 will be significantly increased while the focus of aerodynamic brought forward. We know that while the focus of the aircraft is located, Lift edge of the vortex caused by the contribution of the wing while washing aerodynamic flow will significantly toward the center. Therefore side of the aircraft configuration is usually static longitudinal instability, active control technology needed to be addressed. For example, the F-16 is a typical "relaxed static stability" with the conventional design : layout, F-16 wings moved forward by 40.6 centimeters, so aerodynamic center forward. M0.9 at its static stability in slightly negative, and 8% at M1.2. Aerodynamic focus toward growing cause of the border, Xiaolong 04 will be the focus might change (after I speculated that it might be a slight shift : DSI weight because the more obvious the former fuselage, Yields rear edge of the electronic module will be partially offset by the increased weight and nose). Aerodynamic focus light Xiaolong 04, the focus changes I guess Xiaolong 04 earlier in the static stability will be further relaxed. And the use of "the entire longitudinal flight control authority fax + 40 degrees more than two simulated redundancy backup" system will be fully satisfy the static stability After the relaxation of control! Xiaolong 04 relaxed static stability will not only further enhance their mobility, More importantly, will be greatly reduced in the span of supersonic trim resistance and help span performance of the supersonic, DSI combination of the weight and the weight of the whole growth pushed down, The greatest number may be more than 04 M M1.6 the biggest increase in the original design! Of course, increasing the edge of the edge of the vortex induced intensity can also lead to larger aircraft pitch moment of non-linear problems, Early mechanical-hydraulic control system's apparent inability to solve, but a good example of Xiaolong 04 flight control solution! 2. Details from the wing of the main wings, Xiaolong 04 and F-16 are different, Xiaolong 04 wing leading-edge sweep angle of 42 °, composite wing bending and torsion, and the latter leading edge sweep angle of 40 °. Aspect ratio of about 3.0, both front and rear wing. F-16 wing no reverse! Contrast can see that Xiaolong 04 of the wing leading edge sweep angle greater aspect ratio smaller than the root shoot, Airfoil closer delta, in a large range of airfoil stall characteristics, and inter-and supersonic flight resistance small! Is likely to be absorbing the essence of the Russian type pneumatic three generations! Even more noteworthy is that Xiaolong 04 in a front flap with the same strain J-10 on the basis of bending and torsion using a composite wing design No composite wing bending and torsion and 16. Why? Design, I believe that this may be related to Xiaolong 04 delta is closer to the airfoil, delta is the biggest drawback of induced resistance, easy airflow vortex formation, loss of front lift. With the front flap and using composite reversed, can improve the overall speed of the largest lift-to-drag ratio. India's LCA has a similar design, I see in inspection data on the Indian side in the LCA had explained his comments : He said the purpose of this design is used to improve the characteristics of wing lift, as he thought the wing dihedral angles of attack. first stall at high angles of attack, time pressure center moves, bow torque produced, and yet Winglet stall. Therefore horizontal control. That the design can be used to enhance the lateral stability of aircraft at high angles of attack. As we all know, single Yields Yields larger aircraft to fly at high angles of attack is the reason, Yields will be shielded fuselage turbulence lose lateral stability, thereby restricting the mobility single Yields aircraft at high angles of attack. If the speculation is true, then the combined side of the design Xiaolong 04 will increase their ability to fly at high angles of attack. able to its excellent maneuverability at high angles of attack! Gen will bring slightly smaller than Winglet flutter, usually cut with a sharp or heavy objects to be resolved Xiaolong Winglet whose every missile in flight test of time with this estimate, and the increase in the electronic module Yields dropped after a sharp cut. While it can be resolved flutter, but feel a bit uncomfortable in the number of visual!
Last edited by crobato; 02-27-2007
Dnt you get this that since prototype 04 the complete fbw was changed so was major modification in the airframe such as

*lerx
*win ventral fins
*DSI



fully relaxed static stability unstable flight profile must be adapted when they design the airframe from scratch .It is not a radar or missile upgrade that can be slung on latter.
the reason it was done in prototype stage not after entering service

If you don't understand that or don't want to understand that is something upto you.You can google and find out about it yourself.

I am a bit dull because I post technical stuff not sooth saying stuff.BTW how did you discover IAF rejected TEJAS?

Seems news to me.
i do understand.it is upto you to get this into your mind or follow the blind patriotism

as a matter of fact both of them are aircraft pilots
 

ersakthivel

Brilliance
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
7,029
Likes
8,762
Country flag
better we leave this




Upgraded in prototype stage.brother your that dumb or acting so?
do you know more than fighter aircrafts pilots like gambit or crobato?



Dnt you get this that since prototype 04 the complete fbw was changed so was major modification in the airframe such as

*lerx
*win ventral fins
*DSI





the reason it was done in prototype stage not after entering service



i do understand.it is upto you to get this into your mind or follow the blind patriotism

as a matter of fact both of them are aircraft pilots

guess Xiaolong 04 earlier in the static stability will be further relaxed. And the use of "the entire longitudinal flight control authority fax + 40 degrees more than two simulated redundancy backup" system will be fully satisfy the static stability After the relaxation of control! Xiaolong 04 relaxed static stability will not only further enhance their mobility, More importantly, will be greatly reduced in the span of supersonic trim resistance and help span performance of the supersonic,
AFAIK fully relaxed stability unstable configuration in all AXES is built from the design phase as done in tejas.

Jf-17 has it only in pitch axis ( referred longitudinal as here)at present that is not the definition of fully relaxed stability unstable configuration.

It is not something you can add with every prototype because extensive revision of control laws are required.
 
Last edited:

farhan_9909

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Aug 30, 2012
Messages
5,895
Likes
497
Repost..from 2005 by janes..read the last para.

JFT saw major redesigning from pt-03 to pt04/pt06.

beside this i quoted that from JFT official site


Note:Full FBW was planned.extract from 2005..

so this is nt that yesterday we integrated full digital quadruplex FBW..bt since the prototypes stages
 

ersakthivel

Brilliance
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
7,029
Likes
8,762
Country flag
Repost..from 2005 by janes..read the last para.
It says it has FBW only in YAW axis not all axes fully relaxed stability platform.Note it.

The JF-17 is a copy of existing design with relaxation of yaw or longitudinal axis and DSI intake. It alone takes 18 years means you can understand the timeframe needed for tejas.

Unlike this J-10 is full relaxed stability FBw like tejas. That's why chinese are not inducting it and marketting it for INTERNATIONAL BUYERS(!!!) while keeping the J-10 which is more powerful and complex for themselves.

J-10 is still having fly by wire issues and a few crashes were attributed that issues.

The reason for this is russians wont allow it with their engine for export because it will under cut their products. Since russians no longer make mig-21s they have no problems with a little advanced mig-21 i.e jf-17 to be exported.
 
Last edited:

farhan_9909

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Aug 30, 2012
Messages
5,895
Likes
497
the serial production aircraft having a digital quadruplex (quad-redundant) FBW system in the pitch axis and duplex (dual-redundant) FBW system in the roll and yaw axis.[49]
Can post official JF-17 site link as well..jft in the first 3 prototypes indeed didnt had complete quadruplex digital fbw again in throttle only...wich was later upgraded complete quadruplex digital in the serial production variant.


JF-17 has Type 634 quadruplex digital Fly-By-Wire (FBW) for pitch axis and duplex analog FBW in roll axis. The maximum G and maximum Angle-of-Attack (AOA) values are set at limited values for different levels of flight. During a deep stall, JF-17's computer compares values of pitch, Angle-of-Attack, speed and attitude with default values of normal stall. Based on its instincts it decides to recover automaticall
JF-17 Thunder's Avionics - PAFwallpapers Blog


both JFT,J-10 use type 634 quadruplex digital fbw

JFT is full fbw except in throttle(again only in pitch) the production variant has been upgraded to provide full digital fbw in roll and yaw axis as well

f-16c/d,f-18 all uses the same
Now if you don't understant this.than either read about type 634 fbw system or ask someone else in the forum
 

farhan_9909

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Aug 30, 2012
Messages
5,895
Likes
497
It says it has FBW only in YAW axis not all axes fully relaxed stability platform.Note it.
The JF-17 is a copy of existing design with relaxation of yaw or longitudinal axis and DSI intake. It alone takes 18 years means you can understand the timeframe needed for tejas.
i posted this for the planned.so that you get it atleast that full quadruplex digital fbw was planned since prototype stages
yes indeed it had fbw only in yaw axis before the entry of 4th prototype..


the reason serial production variant has quadruplex digital fbw(type 634 the one developed for j-10 by china was later applied on jft as well)
 

ersakthivel

Brilliance
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
7,029
Likes
8,762
Country flag
Can post official JF-17 site link as well..jft in the first 3 prototypes indeed didnt had complete quadruplex digital fbw again in throttle only...wich was later upgraded complete quadruplex digital in the serial production variant.




Now if you don't understant this.than either read about type 634 fbw system or ask someone else in the forum
Full Quadreplex means a redundancy of 4 lines not all axes relaxed stabilitiy fly by wire.Do you get that?
Who doesn't understand what?
 

ersakthivel

Brilliance
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
7,029
Likes
8,762
Country flag
i posted this for the planned.so that you get it atleast that full quadruplex digital fbw was planned since prototype stages
yes indeed it had fbw only in yaw axis before the entry of 4th prototype..


the reason serial production variant has quadruplex digital fbw(type 634 the one developed for j-10 by china was later applied on jft as well)

Pity you don't understand that full relaxed stability FBw is unique to each fighter and it cannot be taken from one and deployed on another like a radar or missile upgrade.

Each system is unique to one fighter. Quadreplex means a four line redundancy not full relaxed static stability
 

ersakthivel

Brilliance
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
7,029
Likes
8,762
Country flag
yes in pitch and posted above as well

i gues your skipping my posts
Which post i skipped?
I guess you are don't understand all axes fully relaxed stability as well.
Full relaxed stability platforms like tejas have long and complex developmental time and flight envelope is opened step by step with caution. Proof is 2000 incident free even emergency free flight.

That's how ell tejas was built as opposed to some rip and join method adopted on JF-17 with another stable conventional layout airframe modified for relaxed stability in one axes with intake redesign.Even that took 18 years for jf-17 means you can understand the timeframe and slow Limited series production rate for tejas.
 
Last edited:

farhan_9909

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Aug 30, 2012
Messages
5,895
Likes
497
Pity you don't understand that full relaxed stability FBw is unique to each fighter and it cannot be taken from one and deployed on another like a radar or missile upgrade.

Each system is unique to one fighter. Quadreplex means a four line redundancy not full relaxed static stability
as if i dnt understand this.except in pitch
the same firm made it for jft fbw.
 

ersakthivel

Brilliance
Senior Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
7,029
Likes
8,762
Country flag
as if i dnt understand this.except in pitch
the same firm made it for jft fbw.
Show one authoritative link which says fully relaxed stability in all axes(as done for tejas) for JF-17. because as far as I know I haven't come across it.
 

farhan_9909

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Aug 30, 2012
Messages
5,895
Likes
497
Which post i skipped?
I guess you are don't understand all axes fully relaxed stability as well.
Unlike this J-10 is full relaxed stability FBw like tejas
lol.afaik
both jft and j-10 use quadruplex fbw.so does the f-16 c/d and later variant.so does the f-18 and majority of the 4th gen fighter.
all of them are considered as fully relaxed stability?
 

farhan_9909

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Aug 30, 2012
Messages
5,895
Likes
497
Show one authoritative link which says fully relaxed stability in all axes(as done for tejas) for JF-17. because as far as I know I haven't come across it.
Fighter aircraft with Quadruplex fbw is considered as relaxed stability design

if you dnt consider so than J-10,F-16,F-18,EFT and many more are not relaxed stability design..
 

farhan_9909

Tihar Jail
Banned
Joined
Aug 30, 2012
Messages
5,895
Likes
497
i am posting from wiki for faster approach.you can search and confirm it in any other site

F-18 SH
The Super Hornet has a quadruplex digital fly-by-wire system
Boeing F/A-18E/F Super Hornet - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

J-10

Due to the J-10's aerodynamically unstable design, a digital quadruplex-redundant fly-by-wire flight control system aids the pilot in flying the aircraft.
Chengdu J-10 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

EFT
It has a quadruplex digital fly-by-wire control system providing artificial stability, manual operation alone could not compensate for the inherent instability
Eurofighter Typhoon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Should i post about f-16 as well?

anyway your defination of relaxed stability is only limited to you i gues
 

Latest Replies

Global Defence

New threads

Articles

Top