Skirmishs at LOC, LAC & International Border

Discussion in 'Indian Army' started by Kunal Biswas, Aug 27, 2017.

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  1. Indrajit

    Indrajit Senior Member Senior Member

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    Indian “losses” aren’t clear, the figures quoted are additional costs supposedly incurred by airlines which they would have recouped from passengers. Pakistani losses are direct, related to overflight charges that they would have received.
     
  2. uoftotaku

    uoftotaku Regular Member

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    One of the many examples when our own media does a better job at enemy propaganda than ISPR...so many Porks gleefully quoting these figures on SM
     
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  3. Indrajit

    Indrajit Senior Member Senior Member

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    I don’t think Indian media is accidentally helping enemy propaganda, it’s always a deliberate attempt to mould the conversation. Almost always, these figures appear simultaneously in many newspapers / online sites quoting unnamed sources, only the last one was official and as I said, I have no idea how these “losses” are calculated. Either the government is cooking something up or someone else is. My bet is on the government, trying to soften public opinion before doing an U turn.
     
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  4. Chinmoy

    Chinmoy Senior Member Senior Member

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    Govt would have to come out with official data eventually. There is nothing like taking a U turn or going straight through. Do you think govt would not have published it if we were at war?

    As far as unmanned source is concerned, the sources are always the lose bearers or institutions who keep tab on these things. Now Spice Jet would not directly complain of their loss in media as it would not go their way. So the easy way out is to leak these info to media houses and try to build up narrative. These narratives acts as pressure on government. They would simply show that the hotheadedness and ego of GOVT is hurting the economy.
     
  5. Holy Triad

    Holy Triad Senior Member Senior Member

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  6. Brood Father

    Brood Father Senior Member Senior Member

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    Question.. Does India complied to all the stupid request by Porkies like removal of fighter jets and assurance for no balakot like strikes
     
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  7. mist_consecutive

    mist_consecutive Flight Lieutenant, 17th Squadron, "Haram Trolls"

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    Moving fighters takes 2-3 hours at best. Both sides. Doesn't affect anything, IAF might as well done it while laughing hysterically.
     
  8. Chinmoy

    Chinmoy Senior Member Senior Member

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    If you happen to look at the Indian bases, all the fighters are there in place where they were. Its not like we have done a massive mobilization.

    Pakis had to open up their air space anyhow. The economic condition they are in right now is not conducive for them to keep it closed. So they had to form some story for their Aam Abdul and they came out with this.

    Even now they have not said anything about India removing its fighters from forward bases.
     
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  9. Indrajit

    Indrajit Senior Member Senior Member

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    My point was that data is not clear since all the cost would have been passed on to customers. Exactly how the “losses” are calculated is not apparent straightaway.

    As far as U-turn is concerned, we will know soon enough.
     
  10. Babloo Singh

    Babloo Singh Regular Member

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    In case of India losses were incurred by airlines, by way of higher fuel cost. This was probably recovered from passengers. As far as Indian Govt goes it actually collected more duties on sale of additional fuel, so GOI lost nothing, and may have gained additional revenue in form of duties on higher sale of aviation fuel.
    On other hand Pakistan lost revenue from direct over flight charges.
    We had hard time connecting to AFG & Central Asia.... and Paki's had to forego Bangkok, Pattya, KL & Singapore. Guess who was inconvenienced more :)
     
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  11. mayfair

    mayfair Elite Member Elite Member

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    Do read up Minister Puri's statement in Parliament on these details.
     
  12. sorcerer

    sorcerer Senior Member Veteran Member Senior Member

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    Jammu & Kashmir: One militant killed in Sopore Encounter
    Sopore: A Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT) militant was killed in an encounter in Baramulla’s Sopore on early Wednesday.

    The gunfight started on early Wednesday between the security forces and hiding militants in Sopore area, police said.
     
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  13. tomato

    tomato Regular Member

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    Ya..thats Adnan Channa... boys telling he was pleading for surender, but was given lead on his head.. hail Mota bhai
    20190717_214202.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2019
  14. Darth Malgus

    Darth Malgus Senior Member Senior Member

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    Usually Folks from Valley are allowed to surrender. This guy must have been from across the border.
     
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  15. LordofLight

    LordofLight Regular Member

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    This guy will now be singing “Channa Mereya” with 72 hooris in jannat :cruisin2:
     
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  16. samsaptaka

    samsaptaka तस्मात् उत्तिष्ठ कौन्तेय युद्धाय कृतनिष्चय

    Another stupid policy, if you pick up a gun against the nation, you deserved to be killed, whether it be paki or our own ! TAKE NO PRISONERS (if you take, extract intel and then shoot them)
     
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  17. Mikesingh

    Mikesingh Senior Member Senior Member

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    In the 90s there was no question of allowing terrorists to surrender - local, Paki or Afghan. They were given lead in their head instead. This was because in those days most of the JK police were in cahoots with terrorist organizations and the surrendered terrorists were released the very next day by them! This pissed off a lot of us. So the unwritten order which spelt: ELIMINATE!

    But now things have changed and the Police are are doing a fine job! Have we been able to rehabilitate surrendered terrorists? Some yes, but most have been brainwashed to such an extent that there's little or no hope to get them to join the mainstream. These buggers are sent to jail till the end of days.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2019
  18. Absolut_Vodka

    Absolut_Vodka Abdul puncture repair Senior Member

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    Were you in Armed forces? Why don't you have Professionals tag?
     
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  19. Mikesingh

    Mikesingh Senior Member Senior Member

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    That question you need to ask the Admin!! :biggrin2: Anyway, adding the tag doesn't make any difference! Not a big deal!
     
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  20. Holy Triad

    Holy Triad Senior Member Senior Member

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    Why India won't remember the day Kashmiri Pandits were left to die
    Not one person has been convicted, leave alone punished for the massacre of more than a thousand Hindus of the Valley.



    January 19, 1990, a date etched in our collective memory, a date that is hard to forget no matter how hard one tries to erase the memories of that night, they come back to haunt you again and again.

    But then January 19, 1990 did not happen in a day.

    For years, Pakistan kept training and indoctrinating many young Kashmiri Muslims to wage a jihad against India in Kashmir. Training camps were being operated in PoK and many Kashmiri Muslim boys were being trained to fight the infidels. Armed with Kalashnikovs and the ideology of hate these terrorists came back to Kashmir to kill, maim and separate Kashmir from India. It wasn’t as if the state government or the central government did not know that all this was happening, but almost as if in a tacit understanding with the terrorists it did nothing to tackle the surge of terrorism. On the contrary, the NC government kept releasing dreaded terrorists - almost 70 of them:mad2: between July to November 1989. During all this time, the writ of the terrorists went unchallenged. The National Conference government had run away and abdicated all its responsibilities. There was no administration at all.

    The Kashmiri Pandits were sitting ducks waiting to be murdered.

    Already the diktat of militants ran in vast swathes of Kashmir valley. Strange diktats started appearing on the walls. Everything Indian was the new untouchable. Terrorists would put out hit lists of people to be killed for being pro-India or “anti-movement”.

    Prominent Kashmiri Pandits were already being targeted and killed.

    • BJP leader and prominent social activist Tika Lal Taploo was killed in broad day light in down town Sringar...
    • Justice Nilakanth Ganjoo was gunned down and it took hours for his body to be picked up from the road.
    • Advocate Prem Nath Bhat was brutally killed in Anantnag area of South Kashmir.
    Many more not so well known were killed. The message was loud and clear. Kashmiri Pandits were targets and no one could save them. It seemed nobody cared about whether they lived, died or perished. It still wasn’t January, 1990. But Kashmiri Pandits hoped against hope that the powerful Indian nation would come to their rescue. They stayed put in the only place they knew as home.

    On January 4, 1990, Aftab published a press release of Hizbul Mujahideen asking all Hindus to leave. Another newspaper Al-Safa published the same press release. Soon notices to leave were pasted on the doors of Pandits.

    Yet all that happened so far would now pale into insignificance compared to what was to happen on the fateful night of January 19, 1990. It wasn’t as if one gali or one mohalla or one road was to erupt in a forceful orgy to scare and drive away Pandits.

    As the darkness of the night overtook the feeble sunlight of the day the forces of evil had taken over entire Kashmir. From the bylanes of downtown Habbakadal to the nooks and corners of Rainawari, from the apple towns of Sopore and Shopian, from the bustling upscale Srinagar to sleepy hamlets of Kupwara and Handwara, there was just one cry. The one to drive away Pandits.

    Thousands, nay lacs of adrenalin pumped Kashmiris, marched into the streets of the Valley shouting slogans never heard before. Mosques all over Kashmir blared out loud that Kashmir was to become Pakistan. Songs eulogising the Mujahideen were played over and over again.

    Jago Jago Subah Huyee; Rus ne Baazi Haari Hain, Hind par larzaan tare hain, Ab Kashmir ki baaree hain

    (Wake up, Russia has fallen and India eyes defeat, It is the turn of Kashmir to be freed.)


    This song was played for a long duration, many times over and as soon as it ended, it gave way to sloganeering of a different kind, the kind that did not just target the establishment of India, but one which targeted the Pandits directly.

    The slogans that were now filling the air left us in no doubt that we were about to be defiled or killed.




        • Hum Kya Chahte Azadi… (We want freedom)
        • Azzadi Ka Matlab Kya, La Illah Il lallah (Freedom means La Illah Il Laalh)
        • Agar Kashmir Main Rehna Hoga, Allah-u-Akbar Kehna Hoga (If you want to live in Kashmir, you have to say Allah-u-Akbar)
        • Ae Zalimo Ae Kafiro, Kashmir Hamara (Chod Do Oh Cruel people, you the Kafirs, Leave our Kashmir)
        • Yahan kya Chalega Nizam-e-Mustafa...
    The rule of the Prophet will reign here... was still resounding in our ears when we started hearing:




        • We want Kashmir to become Pakistan without Pandit men but with their women.
    It was this last slogan that terrified Kashmiri Pandits more than the fear of imminent death. Most families hid their womenfolk in attics or store rooms and gave them clear instructions to kill them just in case the crowd barged in. This was the night of doom and gloom one that refused to end. The darkness hid faces of people who were our friends and neighbours, our classmates and teammates, ones we had grown up with, yet those who were baying for our blood or wanting to rape our daughters and sisters.

    The message was loud and clear.
    Raliv Galiv ya Chaliv - Join us, Die or Flee.


    There wasn’t one village, one street, one locality, one society where these slogans weren’t shouted. The pre-planned and well orchestrated mobs that had descended on the streets of Kashmir left no one in doubt about the fate that awaited Kashmiri Pandits. As usual the administration or police was nowhere to be seen or heard of. It was an era when there was no social media and no mobile phones, and telephone density in Kashmir was next to nil. The unthinkable was to be done. Most Kashmiri Pandits started packing whatever little they could under the given circumstances and started fleeing to save their honour and lives. People fled in whatever they could.

    They hid under canvas covers of trucks, left in buses, hired taxis.


    The exodus had started.


    The government, intelligentsia, the seculars, the conscience keepers of this nation -
    all had gone to sleep. No one even talked about it.


    The days that followed the night of January 19, 1990 saw Kashmiri Pandits being killed in scores every day. Atrocities against KPs had become the order of the day.

    From Budgam to Brijbehara,
    from Kupwara to Kanikadal there was hardly a day when Kashmiri Pandits weren’t been killed.


    Most brutal forms of torture from gouging out of eyes, to cutting genitals, to burning bodies with cigarette butts and even chopping off body parts were used to kill Pandits.

    • Sarwanand Kaul Premi, a noted scholar had nails were hammered in place of his tilak.
    • BK Ganjoo was killed in his home and his wife was asked to eat the rice soaked in his blood.
    • Sarla Bhat a nurse was gangraped before being killed and her naked body was thrown on the street.
    • The killers of Ravinder Pandita of Mattan danced over his body.
    • The bodies of Brijlal and Choti were tied to a jeep in Shopian and dragged for 10 km.
    • Girja Tikoo, a school teacher in Bandipora, was gangraped before being killed.
    There are hundreds of such stories. One can almost write a book on the people who suffered at the hands of the terrorists while the meek and feeble Indian state looked the other way. A notorious terrorist named Bitta Karate alone killed more than 20 Pandits and had no shame accepting the same. JKLF was responsible for almost all the killings in 1990. More than a thousand Pandits were killed, tortured and raped.


    The exodus meanwhile carried on.



    By 1991, most Pandits had fled the valley. They were housed in huge inhospitable torn tented camps on the fringes of Jammu city. More than 50,000 families had fled and were living in camps which were bereft of even basic facilities like toilets. Each family was allotted a tent, sometimes more than 10 members shared a ramshackle tent where privacy was literally non-existent. In these camps, deaths were reported because of disease, more because of snakebites and, as the summer came, hundreds died of sun stroke and heat. No one seemed to bother. Neither the state administration nor the champions of human rights. No international aid agencies came to their rescue, neither did the government of India. The Kashmiri Pandits were left to die.

    No more than 20,000 Pandits were living in Kashmir now. The process of ethnic cleansing continued in Kashmir with terrorists and a lot of Kashmiri Muslim population burning and desecrating shrines and temples of Hindu worship.
    Looting and arson took place in abandon. Thousands of Pandit homes, hundreds of temples were burnt and razed to ground.
    The land was later encroached upon. All this was happening in a multicultural, secular India but the secularists did not seem bothered.


    But the Pakistan backed terrorists weren’t done yet. Their insatiable appetite for killings wasn’t satiated yet. More Pandits were to be killed. Seven massacres were inflicted on the hapless community. The terrorists did not even spare two-month old kids. Entire villages of Pandits were wiped off. Yet not a tear was shed, not an award returned, no protest marches taken out, no press statements came from film stars condemning the killing of an entire race.



    As we stand today, not one person has been convicted, leave alone punished for the killing of more than a thousand Kashmiri Pandits.

    No commission of enquiry on the lines of 1984 anti Sikh riots or 2002 post Godhra riots has ever been commissioned to go into the cause of killings and exodus of Kashmiri Pandits.

    No government has bothered to go after the murderers of Kashmiri Pandits.


    As our homes lie deserted, encroached and our temples in ruins, we stand at the verge of extinction, but that doesn’t seem to be an issue bothering either our political parties or the so called human rights activists.




    https://www.dailyo.in/politics/kash...hideen-yasin-malik-pakistan/story/1/8533.html


    My blood boils reading this,the worst part is

    We let it happen

    Thank you RASHNEEK KHER,for recording this horrific event.
     
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