Skirmishs at LOC, LAC & International Border

[HindaviSwarajya]

We should not stop because they regroup and again send terrorist. Let them feel the pain

 

[Babloo Singh]

Six month nightmare for Pakistan on LOC

Paki establishment which is desperately praying & trying their best through social media & their sleeper cells in India to keep Modi out of power, are looking at nightmarish six months before Indian general elections.

It is the time when they are forced to grin & bear all the beating by Indian army.
Indian govt will be eager to escalate any incidence as it will benefit ruling party in elections. Paki's won't like that to happen, god send opportunist to aggressive army commanders to beat the enemy as and when they want. They won't escalate if they try we will escalate it further.....

No wonder Bajwa is talking peace...... mind it this is only till 5:00 PM on last day of voting of GE 2019.
Hope Indian Army will make full use of it. :biggrin2:

 

[hit&run]

Hmmm......

"I see Massive trucks and vehicles these recent days of army. i see Flights of Helicopters. too many to count. i think somehting is up on LOC. i live in Muzaffarabad azad kashmir. too much troop movment. Something is up on kashmir front."


Helicopters evacuating casualties from frontline?
...................................
..........................

They are fortifying LOC, the same will be done at IB; just in case JeM targets high profile Indian leaders.

 

[pankaj nema]

Don't need surgical strike to stop another 26/11, have many options: Army chief Bipin Rawat

The Indian Army now has ‘options’ to tackle a major terror attack like Mumbai 26/11, says General Rawat.

https://www.indiatoday.in/mail-toda...ary-army-chief-bipin-rawat-1395688-2018-11-25

 

[indus]

Don't need surgical strike to stop another 26/11, have many options: Army chief Bipin Rawat

The Indian Army now has ‘options’ to tackle a major terror attack like Mumbai 26/11, says General Rawat.

https://www.indiatoday.in/mail-toda...ary-army-chief-bipin-rawat-1395688-2018-11-25

The keyword is NOW. What is now in place which was not there before.

 

[sorcerer]

The keyword is NOW. What is now in place which was not there before.

The free hand and the Political wiill.

 

[Suryavanshi]

The free hand and the Political wiill.

It'll all go down the ditch if Rahul Baba comes to power in 2019.

 

[Haldiram]

The keyword is NOW. What is now in place which was not there before.

Our only option is to break Pakistan into 4 states and turn them into vassal states. Israel has an arrangement with Jordan where Jews can go and buy land and homes in Jordan but the reverse is not possible. We should have that with all our potential vassal states : Sindh, Bangladesh, Baluchistan. Indian population must spill over into neighboring states without giving the host nations any reciprocal visiting or voting rights in Indian politics.

Any talk of temporary punishment is inconclusive. The Pakistani establishment doesn't even bother to take their dead soldiers back. They don't care about our "punishment". Nor do we really care about the loss of our lives in terror attacks. Human life has no value in Asia. The Pakistani establishment only cares about its survival. That's where we must hit at. Few people dead here and there makes no difference to either side. Pakistan has killed 20k in Punjab during the Sikh insurgency, 40k in Kashmir, and 15k in miscellaneous attacks all over India and we're talking about the loss of another 200 people in another 26/11? We lose 10k people to dog bites every year. Let's not kid ourselves.

Pakistan is a cancer. It doesn't need Paracetamol. It needs permanent amputation. If we decide to go in, we must finish the job once and for all. We don't need this on-and-off sparring we've been doing since 1947.

 

[nongaddarliberal]

Our only option is to break Pakistan into 4 states and turn them into vassal states. Israel has an arrangement with Jordan where Jews can go and buy land and homes in Jordan but the reverse is not possible. We should have that with all our potential vassal states : Sindh, Bangladesh, Baluchistan. Indian population must spill over into neighboring states without giving the host nations any reciprocal visiting or voting rights in Indian politics.

Any talk of temporary punishment is inconclusive. The Pakistani establishment doesn't even bother to take their dead soldiers back. They don't care about our "punishment". Nor do we really care about the loss of our lives in terror attacks. Human life has no value in Asia. The Pakistani establishment only cares about its survival. That's where we must hit at. Few people dead here and there makes no difference to either side. Pakistan has killed 20k in Punjab during the Sikh insurgency, 40k in Kashmir, and 15k in miscellaneous attacks all over India and we're talking about the loss of another 200 people in another 26/11? We lose 10k people to dog bites every year. Let's not kid ourselves.

Pakistan is a cancer. It doesn't need Paracetamol. It needs permanent amputation. If we decide to go in, we must finish the job once and for all. We don't need this on-and-off sparring we've been doing since 1947.

But now the question of nukes arises. I don't believe in the paki nuclear red lines that they regularly shout about. But in the event of our tanks rolling in Islamabad and our army taking all their major cities, I think they will resort to nuclear weapons.

 

[Haldiram]

But now the question of nukes arises. I don't believe in the paki nuclear red lines that they regularly shout about. But in the event of our tanks rolling in Islamabad and our army taking all their major cities, I think they will resort to nuclear weapons.

Right. One can't wish away the nukes but at the same time, we cannot overemphasize their impact. It's a reality that they have them and will use them when their nation is on the verge of collapse. We just have to quantify the impact.

I don't believe they will have a 100% hit rate, but let's assume they launch all 100 nukes, and 2-3 get through our safety net and hit somewhere. India will not turn into one large black spot if hit by nukes.

In our minds, we have created a larger than life image of the damage we will suffer. We have lost 80k civilians and 22k armed forces personnel in terror incidents since independence, plus 3L+ Pandit exodus. Our economy is being hollowed out due to the fake currency racket. Will the economic and human cost of a stray tactical nuke hitting us be more than the damage we will continue to suffer if Pakistan is not neutralized? We should be prepared to lose 10k people in a nuclear strike, it's much better than the number of people we are losing due to the war of a thousand cuts.

The economic benefits that will come from the disappearance of Pakistan will more than cover up for the investment we make towards the war. No fake currency, no thousand cuts, no wasteful war expenditure, trade connectivity to central Asia, secure oil lines via land and knocking China's influence out of our western theater. The uneasy peace we have now is not getting us anywhere. We are losing soldiers and civilians in the proxy war, we are getting tied into China's string of pearls and having to rely more and more on American weapon imports to offset the deficit. The quest for mere survival is hurting our security and growth prospects. Let us kill the enemy and prosper peacefully.

 

[mayfair]

The thing is breaking once cancer into four will not have much of an effect till the cancer itself is eradicated.

A Pakjab where the Pakjabis are still active will remain a pebble in our shoe. Ditto for Sindh.

Think of a buffer.

 

[indiatester]

Right. One can't wish away the nukes but at the same time, we cannot overemphasize their impact. It's a reality that they have them and will use them when their nation is on the verge of collapse. We just have to quantify the impact.

I don't believe they will have a 100% hit rate, but let's assume they launch all 100 nukes, and 2-3 get through our safety net and hit somewhere. India will not turn into one large black spot if hit by nukes.

In our minds, we have created a larger than life image of the damage we will suffer. We have lost 80k civilians and 22k armed forces personnel in terror incidents since independence, plus 3L+ Pandit exodus. Our economy is being hollowed out due to the fake currency racket. Will the economic and human cost of a stray tactical nuke hitting us be more than the damage we will continue to suffer if Pakistan is not neutralized? We should be prepared to lose 10k people in a nuclear strike, it's much better than the number of people we are losing due to the war of a thousand cuts.

The economic benefits that will come from the disappearance of Pakistan will more than cover up for the investment we make towards the war. No fake currency, no thousand cuts, no wasteful war expenditure, trade connectivity to central Asia, secure oil lines via land and knocking China's influence out of our western theater. The uneasy peace we have now is not getting us anywhere. We are losing soldiers and civilians in the proxy war, we are getting tied into China's string of pearls and having to rely more and more on American weapon imports to offset the deficit. The quest for mere survival is hurting our security and growth prospects. Let us kill the enemy and prosper peacefully.

You are severely underestimating the impact of nuclear weapons. Lets assume that the Pakis were able to airburst a 60kt bomb (I know they only showed 40kt) on Mumbai.

Estimated fatalities: 744,700
Estimated injuries: 1,184,010
In any given 24-hour period, there are approximately 3,280,689 people in the 1 psi range of the most recent detonation.

That is a big big number.

So unless you have a got hold of their kill switch, I will pray that we don't get into a nuclear war where the casualties are such incredible numbers.

https://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/

 

[nongaddarliberal]

Right. One can't wish away the nukes but at the same time, we cannot overemphasize their impact. It's a reality that they have them and will use them when their nation is on the verge of collapse. We just have to quantify the impact.

I don't believe they will have a 100% hit rate, but let's assume they launch all 100 nukes, and 2-3 get through our safety net and hit somewhere. India will not turn into one large black spot if hit by nukes.

In our minds, we have created a larger than life image of the damage we will suffer. We have lost 80k civilians and 22k armed forces personnel in terror incidents since independence, plus 3L+ Pandit exodus. Our economy is being hollowed out due to the fake currency racket. Will the economic and human cost of a stray tactical nuke hitting us be more than the damage we will continue to suffer if Pakistan is not neutralized? We should be prepared to lose 10k people in a nuclear strike, it's much better than the number of people we are losing due to the war of a thousand cuts.

The economic benefits that will come from the disappearance of Pakistan will more than cover up for the investment we make towards the war. No fake currency, no thousand cuts, no wasteful war expenditure, trade connectivity to central Asia, secure oil lines via land and knocking China's influence out of our western theater. The uneasy peace we have now is not getting us anywhere. We are losing soldiers and civilians in the proxy war, we are getting tied into China's string of pearls and having to rely more and more on American weapon imports to offset the deficit. The quest for mere survival is hurting our security and growth prospects. Let us kill the enemy and prosper peacefully.

Such a waste of 50 years. From 47-98 The nuclear question wasn't even relevant. We could have easily broken them in 4 in the 70s or 80s, or even the early 90s. Operation brasstacks was an endeavour to that end but it was blocked by Rajiv Gandhi. Now it occurs to us when the costs are so high.

 

[Kshatriya87]

Hmmm......

"I see Massive trucks and vehicles these recent days of army. i see Flights of Helicopters. too many to count. i think somehting is up on LOC. i live in Muzaffarabad azad kashmir. too much troop movment. Something is up on kashmir front."


Helicopters evacuating casualties from frontline?
...................................
..........................

This might be additional temporary security cover for Bajwa who visited the front lines ? Just my thoughts.

 

[Haldiram]

You are severely underestimating the impact of nuclear weapons. Lets assume that the Pakis were able to airburst a 60kt bomb (I know they only showed 40kt) on Mumbai.

Estimated fatalities: 744,700
Estimated injuries: 1,184,010
In any given 24-hour period, there are approximately 3,280,689 people in the 1 psi range of the most recent detonation.

That is a big big number.

So unless you have a got hold of their kill switch, I will pray that we don't get into a nuclear war where the casualties are such incredible numbers.

https://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/

60kt is no tactical nuke. I am assuming that all of their bigger bombs are being tracked and will be contained in a preemptive strike, if it comes to that. I don't see us being so careless or the Pakis being so ingenious so as to manage to successfully penetrate a big bomb through our air defense grid. The only ones that may sneak in are small tactical nukes fired from artillery guns. If we base the whole threat assessment on the assumption that they will manage to break in, then the numbers would be far worse. Also, deterrence has its own psychological value. Imagine a case where India manages to break off 3 states and the Pakjabis are mulling the nuclear option. We can simply tell them that we are willing to let them have one small state to themselves and they can continue to live in their palaces and enjoy their ill gotten wealth or nuke India and we will destroy whatever remains.

@mayfair Punjab will continue to remain a problem, but Sindh and Balochistan can be denatured at least.

Sindh can become more Sindhi than Muslim. Sindhi and Baloch Muslims are not radical Wahabbis. They can be co-opted to act against Pakistan. They may not become pro-India, but what do we care; It's not like we are including them to be a part of our polity. Even if we achieve the limited goal of breaking off these resource rich regions from the Pakjabis, the central military planners in Rawalpindi will have lesser resources at their disposal to run their anti-India campaign and Pakistan will lose its strategic bargaining power for which they are coveted by the West. With no access to Baloch gas fields or Sindhi sea ports, Pakjab will become an irrelevant land locked state. We can keep hammering them for the next 50 years. The current state of Pakistan with 4 big states is an eye sore. We should cut them to size.

 

[indiatester]

60kt is no tactical nuke. I am assuming that all of their bigger bombs are being tracked and will be contained in a preemptive strike, if it comes to that. I don't see us being so careless or the Pakis being so ingenious so as to manage to successfully penetrate a big bomb through our air defense grid. The only ones that may sneak in are small tactical nukes fired from artillery guns. If we base the whole threat assessment on the assumption that they will manage to break in, then the numbers would be far worse. Also, deterrence has its own psychological value. Imagine a case where India manages to break off 3 states and the Pakjabis are mulling the nuclear option. We can simply tell them that we are willing to let them have one small state to themselves and they can continue to live in their palaces and enjoy their ill gotten wealth or nuke India and we will destroy whatever remains.

@mayfair Punjab will continue to remain a problem, but Sindh and Balochistan can be denatured at least.

Sindh can become more Sindhi than Muslim. Sindhi and Baloch Muslims are not radical Wahabbis. They can be co-opted to act against Pakistan. They may not become pro-India, but what do we care; It's not like we are including them to be a part of our polity. Even if we achieve the limited goal of breaking off these resource rich regions from the Pakjabis, the central military planners in Rawalpindi will have lesser resources at their disposal to run their anti-India campaign and Pakistan will lose its strategic bargaining power for which they are coveted by the West. With no access to Baloch gas fields or Sindhi sea ports, Pakjab will become an irrelevant land locked state. We can keep hammering them for the next 50 years. The current state of Pakistan with 4 big states is an eye sore. We should cut them to size.

Its not easy for us to ignore the impact of even one strategic nuclear weapon surviving or worse getting into the hands of jihadis.
So unless we are very confident that the strategic weapons have been taken care of, we cannot go in for an overt action.

I am a fan of the current covert action that is going on. By the looks of it, we have utilized Afghanistan and Iran to build some assets in Baluchistan and the anti-Paki Taliban. I believe we should cultivate the existing indoctrination and low employment amongst the Pakis (read Pakjabis) to build a drive them further down.

 

[Haldiram]

I am a fan of the current covert action that is going on. By the looks of it, we have utilized Afghanistan and Iran to build some assets in Baluchistan and the anti-Paki Taliban. I believe we should cultivate the existing indoctrination and low employment amongst the Pakis (read Pakjabis) to build a drive them further down.

...the end game being?

The Paki establishment has enough bullets to gun down their entire civilian population. Sooner or later India will have to step in if geographical borders have to be changed.

And every time we step in, the nuclear sword hangs on our head. I still feel, Pakistan does not have the technology to deliver a big nuke to any of our large cities. They don't have the stealth planes or the blue water navy to carry it beyond their shores. Doval goes one step ahead and calls it a bluff.

 

[pankaj nema]

Cease Fire violation
One Indian soldier hit by Paki Sniper

 

[patriots]

one soilder.. injured by sniper fire

 

[indus]

...the end game being?

The Paki establishment has enough bullets to gun down their entire civilian population. Sooner or later India will have to step in if geographical borders have to be changed.

And every time we step in, the nuclear sword hangs on our head. I still feel, Pakistan does not have the technology to deliver a big nuke to any of our large cities. They don't have the stealth planes or the blue water navy to carry it beyond their shores. Doval goes one step ahead and calls it a bluff.

End game is balkanisation of Pakistan. Nukes will not be used on day one of war. And the moment they mobilise nukes, we will know. Even during Kargil USA came to knew the moment Mushhy moved nuke missiles. In a window of opportunity we can take out their nuclear establishments in a preemptive strike. Then the sword will be gone.