Russia To Nudge India Toward Buying BMP-3s

[Damian]

As a side note, you know what, the Abhay reminds me one of Polish Army projects dubbed BWP-2000.

It was armed with 60mm (yes!) automatic cannon made by OTO Melara, 7,62mm coaxial machine gun and ATGM launchers. Unfortunetalay whole project was cancelled. BWP-2000 was based on the same chassis as our currently manufactured SPH "Krab".

 

[Kunal Biswas]

There were no GSQR given to improve it, No GSQR no work..

Also, They did made an Improved Insas call Excalibur but never adopted..

Insas has been in service for over 15 years and has seen more than enough action in all possible terrains and still they failed to improve it. The INSAS is the perhaps worst example to defend the DRDO

 

[Snuggy321]

There were no GSQR given to improve it, No GSQR no work..

Also, They did made an Improved Insas call Excalibur but never adopted..

Well, I suppose they have at least tested the Excalibur?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

It was issued to elite units in IA including PARA..

Was a success but without reason pulled back and reissued with 1B..

Well, I suppose they have at least tested the Excalibur?

 

[pack leader]

don't buy Russian trash
the bmp family is a bomb on tracks with low armor
it is unergonomic crammed and has too many possible weapon systems

cv -90 is the ultimate in regular tracked ifv
reasonable price
many possible weapon loads
in use in many army's

 

[Snuggy321]

It was issued to elite units in IA including PARA..

Was a success but without reason pulled back and reissued with 1B..

oh, ok thanks for the info. Never heard about that.

 

[arnabmit]

FICV is already in advanced development stage. If we have to go for an interim solution, wouldn't the US made wheeled/tracked Stryker platform make better sense?

 

[Kunal Biswas]

If that thing is also available in tracked and amphibious, then one can think twice about it..

 

[arnabmit]

While not amphibious, the Stryker's watertight combat hatch seals allow it to ford water up to the tops of its wheels.

For the US Army's Armored Multi-Purpose Vehicle (AMPV) program to replace the M113 APC, General Dynamics has created a tracked version of the Stryker. The vehicle keeps the highly survivable double-V hull, and tracks were attached using externally mounted suspension. It is considerably heavier at 70,000 pounds (35 tons, 31,800 kg), but the tracked suspension can handle up to 84,000 lb (42 tons, 38,100 kg) to allow for additional armor, weapons, and cargo. Its powerplant offers 700 horsepower and the vehicle has greater than 60 percent commonality with wheeled Strykers. The Tracked Stryker also has greater fuel efficiency and a wider track for better mobility than the M113.

 

[Damian]

Hmmm, a tracked Stryker can be a good base for a tracked variant of M1128 MGS, which in the end might be interesting light tank concept.

 

[Sam2012]

I think India should go with FICV rather than opting to BMP-3 , because we don't need INS Vikramaditya or Akula submarine kind of thing delay & cost escalation tactics, Russia in recent time has never kept the timeline & uses excuse and bargains for cost escalation that is the reason why they lost MMRCA, Attack helicopter, heavy helicopter tender . Light utility helicopter tender Kamov is still in race but with cost escalation & delay tactics russia will sure that as well

More over FICV is a stepping stone to indian private company & indegeniousation of Indian armed equipment

MOD should not consider BMP-3

 

[arnabmit]

Update...

AUSA 2012: GDLS introduces 'Tracked Stryker' concept

 

[JBH22]

There was an article in Times magazine that the Stryker could not withstand a single shot from RPG and that US troops preferred M-113.

Anyway the next IFV India buys should be suited for COIN ops also capable of withstanding fougasse (IED), good protection for Troops. I would like to see the Patria in service

 

[Damian]

There was an article in Times magazine that the Stryker could not withstand a single shot from RPG and that US troops preferred M-113.

Please explain me how both vehicle could withstand RPG hit? When their armor is designed to protect against small arms fire, while RPG's can penetrate more than 200mmof RHA.

Later both vehicles received slat armor but it gives only 50% effectivenes, however Stryker have developed ERA kit, which can be installed if nececary, it use the same ERA as M1, M2 and M3 use.

As for M113, soldiers didn't liked it more, it is a myth propagated by a mentally ill fellow Mike Sparks called "Sparky". In fact soldiers like Strykers that are more survivable than M113.

PS. The tracked Stryker presented on AUSA 2012 was only quick made technology demonstrator. Here is how prototype look:

 

[kshkumsin]

Please explain me how both vehicle could withstand RPG hit? When their armor is designed to protect against small arms fire, while RPG's can penetrate more than 200mmof RHA.

Later both vehicles received slat armor but it gives only 50% effectivenes, however Stryker have developed ERA kit, which can be installed if nececary, it use the same ERA as M1, M2 and M3 use.

As for M113, soldiers didn't liked it more, it is a myth propagated by a mentally ill fellow Mike Sparks called "Sparky". In fact soldiers like Strykers that are more survivable than M113.

PS. The tracked Stryker presented on AUSA 2012 was only quick made technology demonstrator. Here is how prototype look:

well sir m113 is a very very old design.Plus the mobility of stryker is unmatched

 

[arnabmit]

...the Stryker could not withstand a single shot from RPG and that US troops preferred M-113.

True there were Stryker safety issues, but they were fixed... Now Stryker has ERA + Slat + DVH making it a pseudo MPV as far as safety is concerned.

CAUSE:

EFFECT:

 

[W.G.Ewald]

As for M113, soldiers didn't liked it more, it is a myth propagated by a mentally ill fellow Mike Sparks called "Sparky". In fact soldiers like Strykers that are more survivable than M113.

http://combatreform.org/mikesparksm113gavin.htm

https://www.strategypage.com/militaryforums/2-19258.aspx

 

[Damian]

Mike Sparks M113 Gavin

https://www.strategypage.com/militaryforums/2-19258.aspx

Oh no, not him!

Sparks is such a psycho that is is even difficult to keep your own mind in proper shape reading him.

And you know what guys, he even claimed that M60 is better armored than M1.

 

[methos]

The BMP-3 is not a bad IFV if you buy it in the right configuration. The BMP-3M has a pretty decent FCS allowing the use of programmable ammunition. The BMD-4M has nice armour thanks to the composite applique armour. Combine these two vehicles and the result would be nothing to be ashamed of.
But I don't think that the Russians will make offer such an upgraded BMP-3 and will rather try to persuade you buying an amphibious IFV (FICV is apparently not amphibious) - this would essentially mean that it is impossible to reach a decent level of armour protection.

The FICV seems to be the better choice, but it will likely take much longer. Also I wonder how the final FICV will look like, because the current models from Mahindra/BAe and Tatra/Rheinmetall seem to be rather expensive (the Mahindra/BAe design seems to be based on the SEP, which was to costly for anyone to adopt; the Tatra/Rheinmetall desgin features the Lance two-men turret with SEOSS sights and AZEV sensor units - damn expensive optronics/electronics).

 

[JBH22]

Idealistic representation of the BMP3 a bit hyped if you ask me