Recruitment and Minority representation in RAW

[abingdonboy]

A very unsceintific example, but here is a pic of some NSG (SAG) in Mumbai, of this group of 11, more than 1/4 of them are Sikhs (much more than the 2% the Sikhs make up in the Indian population and around the same, if not slightly more than the Sikh numbers in the IA).

@blueblood thanks for the pic bro!

 

[natarajan]

^^
Good example but sickular people here as well conkress want our country like somalia in future

 

[aliyah]

watch story of ravindra kaushik one of the best R&AW researcher on epic channel @ 7:00 pm & 11:00 pm on 13-11-2015 friday

 

[spikey360]

Great informative and balanced discussion going on here. To add my two bits, Muslims are generally less loyal towards any country, so leaving them out of special groups which are designed to assault Islamic Pakistan, makes sense. Leaving Sikhs out make lesser sense, since Sikhs and Muslims rarely see eye to eye. Having muslim informers is necessary, but having them as leadership will introduce uncertainty. So if the intel agencies are keeping them at an arms length, it is both understandable and commendable.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

Great informative and balanced discussion going on here. To add my two bits, Muslims are generally less loyal towards any country, so leaving them out of special groups which are designed to assault Islamic Pakistan, makes sense. Leaving Sikhs out make lesser sense, since Sikhs and Muslims rarely see eye to eye. Having muslim informers is necessary, but having them as leadership will introduce uncertainty. So if the intel agencies are keeping them at an arms length, it is both understandable and commendable.

So as per your logic Apj abdul kalam cannont be trusted with our missile programme?

Should not have trusted I H latif, mohhmmad usman , and many others ?

Air Chief MarshalIdris Hasan Latif (June 9, 1923 – present[1]) is a former chief of air staff of the Indian Air Force, having served as such from 1978 to 1981. After retirement, he has also served as the governor of the Indian state of Maharashtra(1982–85) and later as the Indian ambassador to France (till 1988).[2] He was the first and only Indian Muslim to become the head of the Indian Air Force, or of any Indian armed force.[3]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/I._H._Latif


Brigadier Mohammad Usman (15 July 1912 – 3 July 1948) (also known as Usman Mohomad) was the highest ranking officer of Indian Army killed in the Indo-Pakistani War of 1947, who as a Muslim became a "symbol of" India's "inclusive secularism".[1]At the time of partition of India he with many other officers declined to move to thePakistan Army and continued to serve the Indian Army.[2] He died in July 1948 while fighting the raiders in Jammu and Kashmir

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Usman

If i am to apply your logic the Sikhs cannont be trusted because of khalistani movenent, tamils, naga,assam, tripura people all should be generalised and kept out ?

 

[spikey360]

So as per your logic Apj abdul kalam cannont be trusted with our missile programme?

Should not have trusted I H latif, mohhmmad usman , and many others ?

Air Chief MarshalIdris Hasan Latif (June 9, 1923 – present[1]) is a former chief of air staff of the Indian Air Force, having served as such from 1978 to 1981. After retirement, he has also served as the governor of the Indian state of Maharashtra(1982–85) and later as the Indian ambassador to France (till 1988).[2] He was the first and only Indian Muslim to become the head of the Indian Air Force, or of any Indian armed force.[3]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/I._H._Latif


Brigadier Mohammad Usman (15 July 1912 – 3 July 1948) (also known as Usman Mohomad) was the highest ranking officer of Indian Army killed in the Indo-Pakistani War of 1947, who as a Muslim became a "symbol of" India's "inclusive secularism".[1]At the time of partition of India he with many other officers declined to move to thePakistan Army and continued to serve the Indian Army.[2] He died in July 1948 while fighting the raiders in Jammu and Kashmir

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Usman

If i am to apply your logic the Sikhs cannont be trusted because of khalistani movenent, tamils, naga,assam, tripura people all should be generalised and kept out ?

Citing one or two examples and broadbrushing everything is exactly what you commies have made an industry out of. I said, generally. I also wrote why excluding Sikhs is illogical. Don't argue for the sake of argument, if you can put something new on the table, do so.

 

[rockey 71]

Re: Recruitment and Minority representation in RAW ( Research and Anal



The 1857 mutiny had maximum participation from "Awadh" and Mostly "Pandits/Upper Caste" and the same was in Bengal They were the people in the Native Infantry who revolted.It was due to Land Reforms like "Ryotwari System" that indebted the farmers and peasants/labors to stupendous amounts. Every rural family had some relative in Infantry,so EIC received a lots of petitions from sepoys to waiver the "debts" or to consider the "debts" afresh.
It was a mix of these practices and some "immediate" cause that broke into "mutiny". As most of these sepoys were relatives of the indebted farmers they had sided with mutineers. EIC thus increased the ratio of British viz-a-viz Native in Native Infantry ( means reducing the ratio of Natives). The problem was compounded by the fact that natives had the "stake" in the "mutiny".

As am NOT generalizing or Insulting anyone on "communal" agenda.

The Problem is many people still don't have the "sense of ownership of India" as a "National-Stake".

India is still immature when it comes to striking of a balance b/w "communal-stake" vs "national-stakes". It is about making [National-stake==Communal-stake]
Sociological research is lacking in India.there is no original thinking of how to integrate "communal-stake" as "national-stake".Indeed only shared-communal identity of India is the solution.But that does not necessarily means of reducing "Hindu Ethos". ( have many thoughts in head.).




agree!




I don't see congress as a Secular Party anymore. India has NO Secular party.Indians seems to live in convoluted self-constructed world. ( am not commenting on you but generally I find this is the only case)




How can one be Secular w/o being Anti-Communal. Being Anti-communal will never lead to Indian integration.For Sustainable Identity, National Identity and Personal-Identity must co-exist. "Communal Stake" is about personal identity and National Identity is about "Shared-Identity".


+1 that is another way of putting it.

Can you be candid? Identify these races/classes. And why do you think these people are seemingly disloyal to the Indian Republic?

 

[Screambowl]

there is no such quota in raw. as this is anti moral boosting and anti unity of the nation. more over enemy can play caste card to penetrate

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

Citing one or two examples and broadbrushing everything is exactly what you commies have made an industry out of. I said, generally. I also wrote why excluding Sikhs is illogical. Don't argue for the sake of argument, if you can put something new on the table, do so.

There need not be anything new, if muslims as a whole can be generalised as untrustworthy then tamils, assamese,tripura, sikhs, etc too are untrustworthy according to same logic.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

Citing one or two examples and broadbrushing everything is exactly what you commies have made an industry out of. I said, generally. I also wrote why excluding Sikhs is illogical. Don't argue for the sake of argument, if you can put something new on the table, do so.

There need not be anything new, if muslims as a whole can be generalised as untrustworthy then tamils, assamese,tripura, sikhs, etc too are untrustworthy according to same logic.

 

[Kshatriya87]

most of our agents in pakistan are pure muslims and few are sikhs in punjab/lahore area.

pakistanis can easily identify you if you are not muslim just by looking at your penis. (i m serious). that's why most of our spies and agents are muslims in pakistan.. it is very common sense

Don't need to look at your penis, just your ears. Like Ajit Doval said, a hindu in Peshawar identified his religious affinity by looking at his pierced ears.

 

[Mad Indian]

Citing one or two examples and broadbrushing everything is exactly what you commies have made an industry out of. I said, generally. I also wrote why excluding Sikhs is illogical. Don't argue for the sake of argument, if you can put something new on the table, do so.

Probably you dint know- but Muslims in the soviet Union deserted it during the afghan soviet war.

The soviet high command thought that Muslims in their ranks would help consolidate the coordination between their forces and afghan forces and so deployed a lot of Muslim recruits. But what actually happenened was- as the war started dragging on, more and more Soviet soldiers left it and joined the mujahedeen...

This is something which happened to a country which actually moderated Islam and made sure that Muslims were raised with pro soviet loyalty. Even that dint stop them from leaving the army ranks.

Decide for yourself if we can trust them or not.

Hell, as recently as 1990s, Muslims in LTTE betrayed ltte to SL govt, because they claimed Muslim identity is more important than their Tamil freedom. That's how deep their disloyalty runs! Of course ltte being ltte slaughtered every one of themnin their ranks, but still you get the idea...

 

[spikey360]

Probably you dint know- but Muslims in the soviet Union deserted it during the afghan soviet war.

The soviet high command thought that Muslims in their ranks would help consolidate the coordination between their forces and afghan forces and so deployed a lot of Muslim recruits. But what actually happenened was- as the war started dragging on, more and more Soviet soldiers left it and joined the mujahedeen...

This is something which happened to a country which actually moderated Islam and made sure that Muslims were raised with pro soviet loyalty. Even that dint stop them from leaving the army ranks.

Decide for yourself if we can trust them or not.

Hell, as recently as 1990s, Muslims in LTTE betrayed ltte to SL govt, because they claimed Muslim identity is more important than their Tamil freedom. That's how deep their disloyalty runs! Of course ltte being ltte slaughtered every one of themnin their ranks, but still you get the idea...

Quoting the wrong person. I don't support Muzzies at all, see Agnostic's posts.

 

[Mad Indian]

Quoting the wrong person. I don't support Muzzies at all, see Agnostic's posts.

I am not disagreeing with your points. I am just bolstering your points with what I know.

I know secular snakes would downplay statistics, there is no use debating them. You can only expose them

 

[Mad Indian]

I heard from one IA veteran,in 1965 war many Muslims were betrayed IA.After war Secular Khangress deliberately awarded "abdul hamid" parem vir chakra.

This is also why army recruits hardly any Muslims less than 3%

 

[spikey360]

This is also why army recruits hardly any Muslims less than 3%

I didn't know that.. Good info. Good thing that the Army does only what it thinks is good for it and no one has any control over this. Also, off topic, but lately it can be observed that the Supreme Court is trying to influence and is overbearing upon the Armed Forces. (Girls in combat duty et. al)

 

[Mad Indian]

I didn't know that.. Good info. Good thing that the Army does only what it thinks is good for it and no one has any control over this. Also, off topic, but lately it can be observed that the Supreme Court is trying to influence and is overbearing upon the Armed Forces. (Girls in combat duty et. al)

Yes, that's what happens when pseudo intellectuals get to decide what is good for everyone.

 

[Mad Indian]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desertion

Read about the soviet union and afghan civil war and the desertion that followed there. No wonder the snakes now want to remove battle cries and want to secularise them.