Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russian

[abhi_the _gr8_maratha]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/indian-air-force/43829-sukhoi-su-30mki-24.html
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reply no. #347 of mine will answer your reply about how important is technology absorption as it will also help in fastline production of tejas mk2 as hal seriously lags awareness in technology. @pmaitra
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as sensors, ew suits are good in rafale. I hope the deal covers domestic production of meteor, if yes then its biggest plus point.

 

[pmaitra]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

http://defenceforumindia.com/forum/indian-air-force/43829-sukhoi-su-30mki-24.html
.
reply no. #347 of mine will answer your reply about how important is technology absorption as it will also help in fastline production of tejas mk2 as hal seriously lags awareness in technology. @pmaitra

Page not Found, but I believe it was there when you posted it. Thanks for taking the effort to fish that post out.

Edit:

Sorry, Page not Found was for 346. Read 347.

 

[abhi_the _gr8_maratha]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

Page not Found, but I believe it was there when you posted it. Thanks for taking the effort to fish that post out.

Edit:

Sorry, Page not Found was for 346. Read 347.

that's problem of idrw. I can't do much about it, it was there when I posted.

 

[ninja85]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

Propably we will not need it, you are right. Of course we are smaller than India population wise, but that is not the only indicator.

no doubt population wise,but also 'air force' wise too.

 

[jouni]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

no doubt population wise,but also 'air force' wise too.

How about "modern fighter per population adjusted"-wise?

 

[pmaitra]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

How about "modern fighter per population adjusted"-wise?

Finland wins. I hope that makes you happy now.

 

[prohumanity]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

If Indian scientists can send mission to moon and mission to mars...they certainly have talent to build a great fighter jet engine. I think the political will and funding is there now under the new Indian leadership.

 

[pmaitra]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

If Indian scientists can send mission to moon and mission to mars...they certainly have talent to build a great fighter jet engine. I think the political will and funding is there now under the new Indian leadership.

Not all countries excel in everything. The Germans, Italians make some of the best cars; the French, Spaniards, Japanese make some of the best trains; the Russians (Byelo/Malo included) the best trucks, and also some of the best helicopters. The US makes the best Aircraft Carriers, but also some of the best submarines. Bigger countries need to excel in multiple things. India needs to be one of the best in multiple areas. I also think the same thing as you do, that there is political will now, and funding under the new leadership.

 

[ninja85]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

How about "modern fighter per population adjusted"-wise?

what do you mean by 'modern fighters per population-wise' not all people are pilots. @pmaitra

 

[s002wjh]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

Not arguing with "pmaitra" at all.

If he is right then there is a huge waste of money about to occur with the purchase of Rafale.

I can understand why Russian ambassdor is sore about Rafale purchase. But not cannot understand pmaitra's argument that Su-27 is far more capable and can front and win in the air against Rafale.

I have no confidence in stolen and copied technology. That is what Chinese are doing. A danger in copied and stolen technology is that expertise, metallurgy, manufacturing does not come with it. That is a crucial disadvantage.

I believe more experts are needed to throw in their opinions.

lol do you have any understand of PRC military/tech etc or here to troll.

 

[pmaitra]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

what do you mean by 'modern fighters per population-wise' not all people are pilots. @pmaitra

Everyone wants to come out on the top.

For example, the fastest train is the Shanghai MagLev. However, France has tested their TGV at a higher speed and holds the world record for non-MagLev (and Japan for MagLev, but only tested), so PRC might as well add the condition of commercial run to come out on the top.

When some European organization wants to draw up a rank of countries by corruption, they will certainly not include the fact that bribery is not only legal in Germany, but it is tax exempt.

So, I think we should let him put in conditions (per population) so that he can make his point.

 

[Hari Sud]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

lol do you have any understand of PRC military/tech etc or here to troll.

Argue with the points I made in my post. Show us your understanding of PRC military /tech.

Chinese are well known copy masters. Their military technology reflects that.

 

[s002wjh]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

Argue with the points I made in my post. Show us your understanding of PRC military /tech.

Chinese are well known copy masters. Their military technology reflects that.

you really think china is able to copy western tech, when security at lockheed, US DoD is one of the best in the world. or are you one of those think because it look similar therefore its copied

china can copy some commerical stuff, but not military equipment, at best some/parts or outlook of hull design were reverse engineered(got from 3rd country or parts of design via spied but its very limited). Military tech has much higher security to prevent others from stealing it.

 

[pmaitra]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

Whether copied or otherwise (not going into that detail), can Rafale match whatever PLAAF has at its disposal? What do members think?

 

[s002wjh]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

Whether copied or otherwise (not going into that detail), can Rafale match whatever PLAAF has at its disposal? What do members think?

in a nutshell yes. its good 4gen+ fighter, it can match whatever PLAAF can throw at it currently in its inventory, but it does not significantly exceed PLAAF. Also su30/27 does has some advantage in term of range, and little bit payload. in term of electronic i think rafle is better(su30+, j10 etc also has decent radar). how many rafale will be deployed against plaaf? too few wont do the job.

also plane vs plane is moot since india has to consider logistic, ground support, command&control etc. and i do think PLA has better logistic, ground/radar and other support(AWAC etc) overall in tibet. also whats the training level between india vs PLAAF pilot?

expensive/gadget is moot when other side has better supports and training.

 

[sgarg]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

Not all countries excel in everything. The Germans, Italians make some of the best cars; the French, Spaniards, Japanese make some of the best trains; the Russians (Byelo/Malo included) the best trucks, and also some of the best helicopters. The US makes the best Aircraft Carriers, but also some of the best submarines. Bigger countries need to excel in multiple things. India needs to be one of the best in multiple areas. I also think the same thing as you do, that there is political will now, and funding under the new leadership.

HAL is unsuitable for building a modern jet engine. HAL just does not have the discipline and the work culture.

If India has ANY hope of building engines for fighter jets, the only solution is companies like Tata, Mahindra or L&T.

 

[sgarg]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

Whether copied or otherwise (not going into that detail), can Rafale match whatever PLAAF has at its disposal? What do members think?

Even if Rafale can match in features, the Chinese will drown India by sheer numbers if there is a big war. And I agree everything will count - weapons, ground support, etc.

Rafale is a problem as it does not give the "bang for the buck". As I said earlier, 500-600 LCA are preferable to 126 Rafales. It is very unlikely that India is going deep into China, ever. India basically needs air defence fighters, which can also drop bombs within 200 kms of border.

 

[sgarg]

Re: Rafale Fighters India is Buying Can't Match Chinese Fighters: Russ

The concept that India must have one Russian origin fighter and another Western origin fighter is basically irrelevant now.
India will be wiser to build a large LCA Tejas factory, and build separate facilities for air to air and air to ground weapons for LCA Tejas. We think couple of billion dollars are still needed to convert Kavery engine dream into reality. Kavery is critical not only for LCA but also for any other local fighter program including UCAV.