Pakistan hikes Defence Budget

[thethinker]

Clandestine operations are.never published by any government or.her intelligence aganecies. Be it CIA, ISI or RAW.

Correct.

So you can see why Hafeez Saeed was a point of discussion in this thread. I am still surprised that you considered it a "rant", a "trolling attempt" and baseless non-related topic initially when Mr.Saeed's involvement was brought up in this thread.

Policy of denials and some more denials as always, yes?

 

[ladder]

Clandestine operations and.their budgets are.never published by any government or.her intelligence aganecies. Be it CIA, ISI or RAW.

RAW+ IB + MI + MIC = ISI. Among them only RAW has un-audited budget. And it is under civilian control. But, your ISI is not.

 

[thethinker]

Budget increase for : Pak armed forces and it's many supported "non-state actor" clandestine outfits
Budget decrease for : Education

It is a no-brainer to see where this all will lead to.

 

[Neo]

Correct.

So you can see why Hafeez Saeed was a point of discussion in this thread. I am still surprised that you considered it a "rant", a "trolling attempt" and baseless non-related topic initially when Mr.Saeed's involvement was brought up in this thread.

Policy of denials and some more denials as always, yes?

Even if I tried to give you the benefit of doubt your choice.of words emphisised 'the likes of Hafiz Saeed' or a defence.professional. I fail to see that you tried to refer to clandestine operations but bashed the miliyary as a whole for eating up our budget for personal gains.

 

[Neo]

RAW+ IB + MI + MIC = ISI. Among them only RAW has un-audited budget. And it is under civilian control. But, your ISI is not.

And thank God its not under civilian control or the corrupt leaders would have had sold it to the highest bidder and it would have been detroyed.

 

[ladder]

And thank God its not under civilian control or the corrupt leaders would have had sold it to the highest bidder and it would have been detroyed.

As if it is any better now. Ur ISI and Mulla-Military brigade is up against a private channel, with it's full might. Still it escapes with a 15 day ban.

Also, it drags ISI to court with 50 billion defamation suit. This humiliation is just short of getting disbanded.

 

[thethinker]

Even if I tried to give you the benefit of doubt your choice.of words emphisised 'the likes of Hafiz Saeed' or a defence.professional. I fail to see that you tried to refer to clandestine operations but bashed the miliyary as a whole for eating up our budget for personal gains.

I do not need or require your benefit of doubt at all.

What is blatantly obvious is being conveniently ignored while what is needed is swept under the rug.

The below is an older article from 2010, same story (increase in Pak defence budget and neglect everywhere) but as viewed from the perspective of a regular Pakistani citizen :

Defence Budget: On Fire!

Isn't it shameful that a country which is shrouded in abject poverty still finds it in it to increase the defence spending so massively? Isn't it ironic that while the people who are sucked dry to pay for the military's extravagance go to sleep hungry at night, while the fat generals who do nothing except play golf in leisure time, sit in their air conditioned offices and decide which bullet-proof cars should they order next? Isn't it shameful that a country in which the condition for a literate person is to be able to sign his or her name should slash education spending simply because the administrative costs are so high? What kind of a government is this? More importantly, what is the purpose of such a government?

We have been hijacked by our own military and we have been forced to accept their agenda. We have let them dictate to us who our enemy is and who our enemy isn't. We have trusted them with our lives because we had no other option. But it has gone on for too long. We have asked for reform and all we have gotten in return is sweetened bullshit. The poor people still pay the bulk of the taxes because the rich find it beneath their dignity to care for the country that made them rich in the first place. We dare not put up farm taxes because that would mean an end to the party culture which is so famously associated with farm houses. We cannot mine our own coal because the petroleum lobby would lose its job if the coal came onto the market for power generation. We are ruled by indecisive selfish turds who would make a run for it at the slightest hint of trouble.

Such are our woes; ruled by incompetent zealots who have sworn allegiance to their political party's flags rather than Pakistan's flag. Such is the might of the army that it can get away with such a huge amount of money all for itself without ever caring about anyone else. I guess that's why they invented the term "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em."

Can't say this inspires any sort of confidence at all in Pakistani governance. 4 years gone and still the same old, same old.

 

[Neo]

As if it is any better now. Ur ISI and Mulla-Military brigade is up against a private channel, with it's full might. Still it escapes with a 15 day ban.

Also, it drags ISI to court with 50 billion defamation suit. This humiliation is just short of getting disbanded.

Would you allow ISI, GoP or any other anti-India group to own your.prime.channel?
What if you found proof that your prime channel and some noisy anchors were taking diktat from Pakistani.tabloids? What woild.you.do?

What's with all the censorship with Facebook in India?

 

[abhi_the _gr8_maratha]

According to
a study carried out by Human Rights
Watch there is a rape once every two
hours[5] and a gang rape every eight
.
Rape in Pakistan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
.
In a study of child sexual abuse in
Rawalpindi and Islamabad, out of a
sample of 300 children 17% claimed to
have been abused and in 1997 one
child a day was reported as raped, gang
raped or kidnapped for sexual
gratification.[11]
.
Asma
Jahangir, a lawyer and co-founder of
the women's rights group Women's
Action Forum, reported in a 1988 study
of female detainees in Punjab that
around 72 percent of them stated they
had been sexually abused while in
custody.[10]
.
.
you must first see the rapes in pakistan, the capital of rape and beggars @Neo

 

[abhi_the _gr8_maratha]

According to
a study carried out by Human Rights
Watch there is a rape once every two
hours[5] and a gang rape every eight
.
Rape in Pakistan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
.
In a study of child sexual abuse in
Rawalpindi and Islamabad, out of a
sample of 300 children 17% claimed to
have been abused and in 1997 one
child a day was reported as raped, gang
raped or kidnapped for sexual
gratification.[11]
.
Asma
Jahangir, a lawyer and co-founder of
the women's rights group Women's
Action Forum, reported in a 1988 study
of female detainees in Punjab that
around 72 percent of them stated they
had been sexually abused while in
custody.[10]
.
.
you must first see the rapes in pakistan, the capital of rape and beggars

 

[ladder]

Would you allow ISI, GoP or any other anti-India group to own your.prime.channel?
What if you found proof that your prime channel and some noisy anchors were taking diktat from Pakistani.tabloids? What woild.you.do?

What's with all the censorship with Facebook in India?

We have a channel which has partnered with CNN ie CNN-IBN

listed channels attracts investments from all over the world.

Visit 'Indian media watch' section here at DFI for details.

We too were disgusted by the reporting on DK episode. But, hardly any comment to regulator and if any all were rejected.

A certain journalist, gets access and exclusive interview to Pakistani PM, we don't pump bullets into her.

Nor, for stating ( I don't vouch for correctness) that Indian soldiers be-headed Pakistani soldier and pinned the head to a tree.

People need to know where to draw the line. Leave it to their judgement.

The other day, you posted here a report HRW about Indian Army in Kashmir.

But, you didn't appreciate that such critical report is freely available in the web domain, and sponsored by Indian group and compiled by a foreign author.author.

We, aren't perturbed about it are we? Did we block it, no.

But, we banned Henderson report on 1962. Because it had sensitive info. (and politics associated)

So, a blanket ban is detrimental and that's what your ISI is trying to achieve.

===============

I don't know if there is censorship of Facebook in India. Pls. provide link.

 

[Neo]

All good and well but not the answer to my question. Can ISI own or co-own a channel in India? It's not the same thing as CNN.

Facebook censorship:
India Leads the World in Facebook Censorship - Businessweek

 

[ladder]

All good and well but not the answer to my question. Can ISI own or co-own a channel in India? It's not the same thing as CNN.

Facebook censorship:
India Leads the World in Facebook Censorship - Businessweek

Before you ask me the question, where is the proof that Geo is owned by RAW. In which court of justice were the evidence presented? None. So, unless you can prove that your statement, it carries no value.

ISI cannot own any channel in India. Not possible. We have strong mechanism.

ISI sends money through Hawala. Which can only be used to pay individual journalists.

So, can we talk about something that is not possible?

=========================

Facebook says it's not permitted to reveal how often the requests are granted and notes that it doesn't automatically accede to government requests for local censorship.

I think you missed out on this part.

What does it say India is censoring?

Facebook accedes 'only if it finds merit'.

And the figures of 4700 odd are requests and not request granted.

So, can you blame GoI to actively monitor face-book? It is not forcing Facebook to censor. It's pointing out and leaving it to their jurisdiction.

Nor India created a different platform 'weibou' like China to force it's will.

So, don't go by the heading, read the whole article.

 

[thethinker]

All good and well but not the answer to my question. Can ISI own or co-own a channel in India? It's not the same thing as CNN.

Facebook censorship:
India Leads the World in Facebook Censorship - Businessweek

From the same article :
"India's approach to Internet speech has been a flash point for years, with the government saying it wants to regulate content that is offensive to religious or ethnic groups"

This even reinforces the fact that India is truly secular because it removes material offensive to various religious groups unlike in Pakistan where Twitter was banned just because of "blasphemy" about the prophet.

Do you guys there block Twitter or censor Facebook if someone posts something offensive about minorities there?

 

[abhi_the _gr8_maratha]

From the same article :
"India's approach to Internet speech has been a flash point for years, with the government saying it wants to regulate content that is offensive to religious or ethnic groups"

This even reinforces the fact that India is truly secular because it removes material offensive to various religious groups unlike in Pakistan where Twitter was banned just because of "blasphemy" about the prophet.

Do you guys there block Twitter or censor Facebook if someone posts something offensive about minorities there?

do you except this from pakis where minorities are converted and raped

 

[thethinker]

do you except this from pakis where minorities are converted and raped

Not at all and nor do we expect them to own up or take responsibility about anything.

But since the topic so quickly shifted from TV channels to social media censorship by gleefuly pointing to the fact about India leading in censorship requests, all it did was shed light in their own backyard and how well the light shows everything.:thumb:

 

[Neo]

We have a channel which has partnered with CNN ie CNN-IBN

listed channels attracts investments from all over the world.

Visit 'Indian media watch' section here at DFI for details.

We too were disgusted by the reporting on DK episode. But, hardly any comment to regulator and if any all were rejected.

A certain journalist, gets access and exclusive interview to Pakistani PM, we don't pump bullets into her.

Nor, for stating ( I don't vouch for correctness) that Indian soldiers be-headed Pakistani soldier and pinned the head to a tree.

People need to know where to draw the line. Leave it to their judgement.

The other day, you posted here a report HRW about Indian Army in Kashmir.

But, you didn't appreciate that such critical report is freely available in the web domain, and sponsored by Indian group and compiled by a foreign author.author.

We, aren't perturbed about it are we? Did we block it, no.

But, we banned Henderson report on 1962. Because it had sensitive info. (and politics associated)

So, a blanket ban is detrimental and that's what your ISI is trying to achieve.

===============

I don't know if there is censorship of Facebook in India. Pls. provide link.

We can move arround in circles and continue this derailed debate but it is still off topic.

We have a democratic elected government which has the passed the defence budget and I certainly am pleased with it.
You may question who's talking the shots, the military or the elected (though heavy rigging) governemt but that is a seperate issue. We are being forced to expand our defence budget by hostile neighbors and this may very well be a manoeuvre to squeeze and.exhaust our economy.

 

[ladder]

We can move arround in circles and continue this derailed debate but it is still off topic.

We have a democratic elected government which has the passed the defence budget and I certainly am pleased with it.
You may question who's talking the shots, the military or the elected (though heavy rigging) governemt but that is a seperate issue. We are being forced to expand our defence budget by hostile neighbors and this may very well be a manoeuvre to squeeze and.exhaust our economy.

Ok we must take Geo discussion, to it's relevant thread. But, the question still stands. Wherever you want to am is your choice.

====================

Coming to topic. We hardly are worried. You always had spent more than what you had declared. Only now, such things are being covered in mainstream media. It may be a 'pleasing' moment for you as due to your ignorance, you might have thought it were to be 6 billion $. and 11.3 Billion$ seems to be a large jump to you.

Now, think, even with having such budget for years JF-17 production suffered due to fund crunch. Point to ponder?

But, be it 5 or 11.3 bullion $, that never came in the way of Musharraf building a palatial farm house, large enough to cast a doubt whether only salary can be able to buy it.

 

[bennedose]

Budget increase for : Pak armed forces and it's many supported "non-state actor" clandestine outfits
Budget decrease for : Education

It is a no-brainer to see where this all will lead to.

More jihadis. More young men killed. More teenage widows for Hafiz Saeed and other Pakis to marry out of compassion. Pakistaniyat.

 

[bennedose]

A BJP minister calling "rapes" in India right in todays newspapers!

And you are worried about education in my country and dare to question 'Pakistaniyat'?

Educate your own jahils in you government before pointing fingers to others.



Cookies must be enabled. | The Australian

Advice from a Pakistani? That is funny. Pakistaniyat is the biggest joke since since the last victory won by the Pakistani army. Pakistaniyat depends on India. No India, no Pakistaniyat. It will take years - but Pakistanis have to see reality one by one by one. Luckily Pakistan and Pakistaniyat are both shrinking - so the task should be easy. But in Pakistan even easy things don't get done - so it should be fun to watch your compatriots thrash about in anger and frustration about what Indians do, say or think about them.