Maharashtra: 4 dead, 50 injured after clashes between two communities

Rage

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Re: Maharashtra: 4 dead, 50 injured after clashes between two communit

Actually it had something with the cricket match...both DNA and two other tweeple from Dhule have said that the altercation started with the cricket match and then spread to the other areas in town. My gut instinct is that the media has been instructed to water down the issue so as to reduce tensions.
That seems highly implausible.

Edit: I just checked Daily News & Analysis, and here's what it says:

It all started around 3pm following a verbal altercation between two groups of people over a cricket match in the Madhavpura area .
http://www.dnaindia.com/mumbai/report_1-killed-200-injured-in-dhule-riots_1786323

So, D&A reports that the altercation was because of a local cricket game and not because of the India-Pak match. Given that it is the only one reporting it, and no other newspapers- including the Hindu- have reported it, even that seems highly suspect. Very likely there was a minor scuffle next door over a local cricket game earlier, and DNA read too much into it, so much so that they connected it to an incident of arson and violence afterwards- which, my local sources claim- started over a tiff over hotel bill payments.
 
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KS

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Re: Maharashtra: 4 dead, 50 injured after clashes between two communit

That seems highly implausible.

Edit: I just checked Daily News & Analysis, and here's what it says:


1 killed, 200 injured in Dhule riots - Mumbai - DNA

So, D&A reports that the altercation was because of a local cricket game and not because of the India-Pak match. Given that it is the only one reporting it, and no other newspapers- including the Hindu- have reported it, even that seems highly suspect. Very likely there was a minor scuffle next door over a local cricket game earlier, and DNA read too much into it, so much so, that they connected it to an incident of arson and violence afterwards- which, my local sources claim, started because of a tiff over hotel bill payments.
Thats why I said the twitterati from Dhule itself saying the cricket match was infact the India-Pak match....
 

Rage

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Re: Maharashtra: 4 dead, 50 injured after clashes between two communit

Thats why I said the twitterati from Dhule itself saying the cricket match was infact the India-Pak match....
I'm sure the twitterati themselves got their news from the DNA and/or, very likely, put a spin on the lead.

They could be considered independent and reliable- if at least two other newspapers, of some repute, corroborated their accounts- but none do: including the Hindu- whose reporting I consider most reliable and which has only verified what I've said.

Notwithstanding, my sources are people on the ground- businessmen and other service professionals- who walk on the streets, not sit behind their computers.
 

aerokan

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Re: Maharashtra: 4 dead, 50 injured after clashes between two communit

I'm sure the twitterati themselves got their news from the DNA and/or, very likely, put a spin on the lead.

They could be considered independent and reliable- if at least two other newspapers, of some repute, corroborated their accounts- but none do: including the Hindu- whose reporting I consider most reliable and which has only verified what I've said.

Notwithstanding, my sources are people on the ground- businessmen and other service professionals- who walk on the streets, not sit behind their computers.
How probable is it for a Indo-pak discussion to occur in a local cricket match win-loss discussion when both communities are playing together (against each other) ? I would say it is very highly probable.

Once the conflict started, it would be really hard to know the original story even for those who roam around the city unless they are part of it.

Why is there a large mob just for a cricket fight? How large is the mob when it is being reported that 100 policemen got injured with around 50 of them injured severely? How large should be the mob when they have to injure the opposing community and a 100 of the policemen? How large should be the mob that necessitated 100 policemen to get there? I would say the mob should be pretty high in number. Or maybe the mob comprises of just 25 people according to the 'Akbaruddin Owaisi postulates', cause 25 muslims can take care of opposing team, and 100 'namard' policemen in a ratio of 1:4 and still emerge victorious unscathed. :rolleyes: :thumb:
 

Rage

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Re: Maharashtra: 4 dead, 50 injured after clashes between two communit

How probable is it for a Indo-pak discussion to occur in a local cricket match win-loss discussion when both communities are playing together (against each other) ? I would say it is very highly probable.
1. It's an assumption that the arson started because of a local cricket match, based on a singular report from the DNA, with no other investigating reporters, including those from some the most newspapers in the country, reporting it.
2. It is an assumption, that if the first assumption is held to be true, the two communities were playing against each other. How many times do you see a friendly local between communally homogenous teams in India?
3. It is an assumption, that if the first two assumptions are held true, the team comprising Muslims unequivocally supported or took objection to something said against Pakistan.

How likely do you think it is that all three assumptions came true, especially since no one else, except the DNA, is reporting it?

Once the conflict started, it would be really hard to know the original story even for those who roam around the city unless they are part of it.
Do you think a cricket match, involving two communities entirely pitted against each other, starting a riot and arson that involved 4 casualties and supposedly over 100 injuries, would have escaped the attention of all the locals in a small-town community like Dhule? How likely do you think it is, that even if one member of the community got a whiff of the reason, the entire community would not inevitably know?

Why is there a large mob just for a cricket fight? How large is the mob when it is being reported that 100 policemen got injured with around 50 of them injured severely? How large should be the mob when they have to injure the opposing community and a 100 of the policemen? How large should be the mob that necessitated 100 policemen to get there? I would say the mob should be pretty high in number. Or maybe the mob comprises of just 25 people according to the 'Akbaruddin Owaisi postulates', cause 25 muslims can take care of opposing team, and 100 'namard' policemen in a ratio of 1:4 and still emerge victorious unscathed. :rolleyes: :thumb:
Why are we presuming that the cricket match was in any way connected to the fight, when only one news paper has prematurely reported it? Why are we assuming that, even if the match, with its broader connotations of India-Pak cricket, was the real reason for the violence, the violence was purely communal (as is being made out to be) and not neighborhood-neighborhood, as usually is the case in such incidents? How are we presuming that if the match was the real cause of the violence, it got taken from a ground or open space in the Madhavpura area to a busy section of Machibazar, where there is barely place for the two communities, in the purported numbers, to gather? How are we rationalizing the theory: that the match started the tiff, with the fact that the violence started specifically outside the hotel, which separate eyewitnesses claim was the scene of a brawl between hotel managers and patrons over a bill just moments earlier?
 
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afako

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Re: Maharashtra: 4 dead, 50 injured after clashes between two communit

Repeat of Mumbai. Slaves of Allah attack and injure 100 Policeman. Thankfully, No Woman were there. They would have been molested.

Dhule riots: Police probe speeches by politicians - Indian Express

Speeches made by a few Muslim politicians in October 2012, ahead of the municipal elections, are believed to be at the bottom of the riots in Dhule on Sunday that saw four killed and over 200 injured, more than half of them policemen.

The police are probing the "context" and "words" of the speeches and investigating if these could have led to the riots. "We have inputs of a few Muslim politicians inciting a crowd in Dhule and allegedly telling them to attack policemen and officers at the next opportunity. We do not know the reason behind this, but this will be probed," Director General of Police Sanjeev Dayal said.

According to sources, the politicians were led by Abu Azmi, Mumbai unit president of the Samajwadi Party. Azmi told The Indian Express: "I don't remember the context of the speech made. I would not use words like these. I said the police are being unfair to Muslims. Innocent men are being put behind bars. The government should do something. Police should get punished. This is what I say everywhere and I am sure I said the same in Dhule in October 2012."

When asked if the police had called him for questioning, he said, "Nobody has called me yet."According to Dayal, Sunday's violence was intense and spread very fast.

Responding to allegations by the Muslim community that the police could have avoided firing, Dayal said his men resorted to it after they were attacked. "Over 113 policemen were attacked, with 48 seriously injured and admitted. The superintendent has incurred four stitches on his cheek. ASP and deputy SP were attacked by a mob in a narrow alley with stones and all sorts of things," said Dayal.

He added that all the allegations will be probed. An additional district magistrate has been asked to look into the police firing. The police are also probing reports of "private firing".
 
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aerokan

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Re: Maharashtra: 4 dead, 50 injured after clashes between two communit

1. It's an assumption that the arson started because of a local cricket match, based on a singular report from the DNA, with no other investigating reporters, including those from some the most newspapers in the country, reporting it.
2. It is an assumption, that if the first assumption is held to be true, the two communities were playing against each other. How many times do you see a friendly local between communally homogenous teams in India?
3. It is an assumption, that if the first two assumptions are held true, the team comprising Muslims unequivocally supported or took objection to something said against Pakistan.

How likely do you think it is that all three assumptions came true, especially since no one else, except the DNA, is reporting it?



Do you think a cricket match, involving two communities entirely pitted against each other, starting a riot and arson that involved 4 casualties and supposedly over 100 injuries, would have escaped the attention of all the locals in a small-town community like Dhule? How likely do you think it is, that even if one member of the community got a whiff of the reason, the entire community would not inevitably know?



Why are we presuming that the cricket match was in any way connected to the fight, when only one news paper has prematurely reported it? Why are we assuming that, even if the match, with its broader connotations of India-Pak cricket, was the real reason for the violence, the violence was purely communal (as is being made out to be) and not neighborhood-neighborhood, as usually is the case in such incidents? How are we presuming that if the match was the real cause of the violence, it got taken from a ground or open space in the Madhavpura area to a busy section of Machibazar, where there is barely place for the two communities, in the purported numbers, to gather? How are we rationalizing the theory: that the match started the tiff, with the fact that the violence started specifically outside the hotel, which separate eyewitnesses claim was the scene of a brawl between hotel managers and patrons over a bill just moments earlier?
Dude!!! Nowhere i made a statement which says i am supporting that particular theory. I am only questioning your outright denial that it is even remotely possible. Read it again. I know how communication happens and the stories change from person to person. Even when the fight starts, nobody is gonna say "I started the fight.. it's my fault.. But let's go and kill some people of the other community". They almost always says it's all the other parties fault. And even if you heresay.. u may not necessarily get the real story. And you my friend, are too confident of your sources when you made any statements before.

And the most important thing is you left out the crux of my message. Whether it's a cricket match or an issue with the hotel bill, what necessitated the arrival of huge number of people from just 'one community' to come and beat up the 'other community' and injured a lot of policemen? I am just asking questions to know more. If possible, please give us the needed info.. not repudiation of the imaginary or real 'thoeries'.
 
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