Korean Defense Minister Says China's J-10 Rivals F-16

[LETHALFORCE]

Arirang | Korea for the World, The World for Korea - Arirang.co.kr

Korean Defense Minister, Kim Kwan-jin, visited an air force training base in Changzhou, China on Saturday and observed the J-10 fighter jet model, which was disclosed for the first time.

After the tour of the base, Minister Kim told reporters that China's J-10 rivals US's F-16 fighter jet with an excellent ceiling capacity per second and short take-off and landing distance.

As China's own fighter jet was disclosed for the first time, Korean defense authorities say it signals Beijing's wishes to strengthen its military ties with Seoul.

 

[asianobserve]

A simple lookdown.

 

[asianobserve]

Reads like: "Your youngest athlete looks very impressive he could be a match with my 80-yr old grandfather." LOL

 

[badguy2000]

Reads like: "Your youngest athlete looks very impressive he could be a match with my 80-yr old grandfather." LOL

question is that :"How many countries on earth can produce a plane as good as F16 now?""

 

[ace009]

question is that :"How many countries on earth can produce a plane as good as F16 now?""

which block? I doubt you are talking about Block 60 - which SK does not have. Block 30 or Block 52 maybe.
Hmmm - let's see - Something that matches F-16 Block 52 ...

I would say 8 countries ...
1. Russia (Mig-35)
2. EU (EF 2000)
3. France (Rafale)
4. Sweden (JAS Gripen)
5. Japan (Mitsubishi F-2)
6. India (Tejas)
7. Israel (Lavi)

Obviously there is China too. However, the J-10 being a copy-paste of the Lavi, I am not sure if I should call it separately!

Oh - by the way, if you go to Pak forums, they would claim Pakistan being up there too - with "their" JF-17.

And edit - The F-16 by the way was a 1970/ 1980s era fighter from USA. If any country has just NOW started matching it, guess how many years behind that makes them ... 40?

 

[guoyinag]

which block? I doubt you are talking about Block 60 - which SK does not have. Block 30 or Block 52 maybe.
Hmmm - let's see - Something that matches F-16 Block 52 ...

I would say 8 countries ...
1. Russia (Mig-35)
2. EU (EF 2000)
3. France (Rafale)
4. Sweden (JAS Gripen)
5. Japan (Mitsubishi F-2)
6. India (Tejas)
7. Israel (Lavi)

Obviously there is China too. However, the J-10 being a copy-paste of the Lavi, I am not sure if I should call it separately!

Oh - by the way, if you go to Pak forums, they would claim Pakistan being up there too - with "their" JF-17.

And edit - The F-16 by the way was a 1970/ 1980s era fighter from USA. If any country has just NOW started matching it, guess how many years behind that makes them ... 40?

I agree that Russia, EU, France can make the planes better than f16. however i do not think Sweden and Japan will make their aircraft superior than f16block50, not even to say India(Tejas).

Only in DFI, we can say the claim that Tejas are comparable with f16.

further, you can not mark Lavi as a aircraft equivalent to f16 until Israel put it into service, and there is nosolid evidence that j10 is a paste of Lavi, you can correct me if i was wrong.

you have the right to look down Chinese achievement in various ways, but i have a word for you: only people who can admit and respect others strong point will make their own progress and win respect.

 

[Tshering22]

I agree that Russia, EU, France can make the planes better than f16. however i do not think Sweden and Japan will make their aircraft superior than f16block50, not even to say India(Tejas).

Only in DFI, we can say the claim that Tejas are comparable with f16.

What makes you think Gripen is any less than F-16? Only the fact that it is untested in a war due to Sweden's peaceful policy. Same goes for Japan. And how many times has J-10 been tested in war, defeating hoards of enemy air forces? How many times has J-10 challenged and defeated a standard NATO jet or even Russian jet for that matter?

Answer: ZERO.

So don't start counting your chickens and claiming the higher ground until you have concrete proof of saying that J-10 is any superior to either Gripen, F-2 or Tejas (Mk-2 standard).

First test your aircraft in actual combat then talk. Until then, J-10 is as much a paper duck as Tejas is. Only difference is they both are in different weight and class categories. Tejas is light combat jet while J-10 is medium combat jet.

further, you can not mark Lavi as a aircraft equivalent to f16 until Israel put it into service, and there is nosolid evidence that j10 is a paste of Lavi, you can correct me if i was wrong.

Design my friend, design. Or are you telling me that your engineers came up with a design in a third the time that US, EU, France, Russia etc take with half the infrastructure (at that time) compared to any one of these countries? Puh-leese. We're not saying that it is wrong to copy and modify the design slightly. It is a clever trick. But not much of an R&D feat that's all.

I particularly like the way you combined the Su-27's spine and back design with Lavi's overall wing and canard combination.

you have the right to look down Chinese achievement in various ways, but i have a word for you: only people who can admit and respect others strong point will make their own progress and win respect.

I respect J-10. In fact, I really like its design and wish that had GOI shown more common sense then, we'd have used this as a design concept and Tejas would have looked much like this today. J-10 is a strong contender. Only thing is, it has to be if not battle proven, at least used in something like serious aerial patrols, like maybe peace patrolling in the rife-torn central Asian countries you got in SCO.

Combat proven is a Western standard that I don't think (me and you) we both need. Because we are not war economies. Am I right?

 

[Rahul Singh]

F-16 and J-10 are in same weight class and carry equivalent weapon load so they are comparable. But comparison stops here. J-10 is equipped with Russian engine which is a 'performance low' than any western design, which naturally means smaller radius and less availability. On avionics weapons and electronics. Wont say much but only fact that USA is far ahead than anyone in technology and for that reason alone J-10 can't be anywhere close to F-16 in that regard until and unless it gets western avionics etc.

So J-10 is comparable to F-16 just like white chicken is to free range Turkey.

 

[tony4562]

These days among white folks, its really only americans who still have an electronics industry to speak of, all the rest is dominated by east asians, japanse, koreans, taiwanses but lately also mainland chinese. Therefore the myth about superior western electronics needs to be debunked. J-10 may still fall short of the latest editions of F16 in terms of electronics, but compared to the Mirage 2000Cs and Mig29s fielded by IAF, J10's electronics is a whole generation ahead. The latest news about Vienamese Air force Su30 being chanceless against PLAAF J10 also once again proves that these days China has quietly moved ahead of Russians in military lectronics.

 

[indian_sukhoi]

You guys forgot to add another aircraft FCK-1 Ching-kuo which is comparable to a F-16s block52s

FC-1 Ching-kuo is based upon a F-16s with two Butt holes engines

 

[Rahul Singh]

These days among white folks, its really only americans who still have an electronics industry to speak of, all the rest is dominated by east asians, japanse, koreans, taiwanses but lately also mainland chinese. Therefore the myth about superior western electronics needs to be debunked. J-10 may still fall short of the latest editions of F16 in terms of electronics, but compared to the Mirage 2000Cs and Mig29s fielded by IAF, J10's electronics is a whole generation ahead. The latest news about Vienamese Air force Su30 being chanceless against PLAAF J10 also once again proves that these days China has quietly moved ahead of Russians in military lectronics.

There is difference between making common use electronics and one that is mil standard. Military avionics are build upon experience and real one. The US with all these experience and NATO countries with association had build a electronics industry which is far mature and reliable than any asian. Also one should not forget that the much of the asian technology has been passed on to by west but that not to say there has not been any advancement and achievements. Though Asia can beat west in the duel use computer systems and similar the fact remains that US and Europe still leads in mil electronics like AESA radars, data links, seekers, jammers etc. And for this very reason it would be very hard for J-10 beat F-16 conventionally.

Mig-29s and Mirage-2000Hs are of old generation than J-10. Point here is, you can not compare them, if at all interested interested then compare J-10Bs/latest model to Mig-29SMTs and Mirage 2000-9s which IAF is upgrading its existing fleet into.

 

[tony4562]

There is difference between making common use electronics and one that is mil standard. Military avionics are build upon experience and real one. The US with all these experience and NATO countries with association had build a electronics industry which is far mature and reliable than any asian. Also one should not forget that the much of the asian technology has been passed on to by west but that not to say there has not been any advancement and achievements. Though Asia can beat west in the duel use computer systems and similar the fact remains that US and Europe still leads in mil electronics like AESA radars, data links, seekers, jammers etc. And for this very reason it would be very hard for J-10 beat F-16 conventionally.

Mig-29s and Mirage-2000Hs are of old generation than J-10. Point here is, you can not compare them, if at all interested interested then compare J-10Bs/latest model to Mig-29SMTs and Mirage 2000-9s which IAF is upgrading its existing fleet into.

Europe is left behind in dust as far as electronics is concerned. European universities are increasingly a farce, the folks are lazy, and the politics is getting dominated by a mixture of naivity and stupidity, and in a generation of time the whole western europe will become mullah country.

If you ask me, i will tell you that europe is done, maybe not now, but in 20-30 years for sure.

 

[ace009]

These days among white folks, its really only americans who still have an electronics industry to speak of, all the rest is dominated by east asians, japanse, koreans, taiwanses but lately also mainland chinese. Therefore the myth about superior western electronics needs to be debunked. J-10 may still fall short of the latest editions of F16 in terms of electronics, but compared to the Mirage 2000Cs and Mig29s fielded by IAF, J10's electronics is a whole generation ahead. The latest news about Vienamese Air force Su30 being chanceless against PLAAF J10 also once again proves that these days China has quietly moved ahead of Russians in military lectronics.

Dude - before you puh puh "lack of electronics" in other "white people" countries (which is racist), think about this. ALL that the Chinese have learnt is basic consumer electronics. S Korea has made some designs, but is still not there yet. The only Asian country which actually can make advanced designs in electronics is Japan.
If you have ever been to Europe you will know that they are miles ahead in electronic design and mechanical design. Their R&D is way more sophisticated and advanced than what most other Asian countries can throw up. Result, advanced Radars, avionics, mission computers, EW warfare systems from European countries.
As for USA, it is SO FAR AHEAD compared to the rest, you will need 50 years of extreme growth to reach them economically and technologically. You have had a good start, but I wonder how long the Chinese can keep it up.
Russia is not bad either. They have had some bad times from 1990 till 2005, but now their economy is getting better (oil and natural gas) and in another 20 years they would be up and running too. They already have an established industry and technology base, so they might not be so easy to leap-frog over too.
Long story short, China has made some great advances in production. But till you design and build something BY themselves, without copy-pasting others designs, you cannot claim to be at par with the western countries (or even Russia).
India has made that connection and has been designing quality systems for some time. What India needs is the ability to develop a high throughput manufacturing.

 

[ace009]

Europe is left behind in dust as far as electronics is concerned. European universities are increasingly a farce, the folks are lazy, and the politics is getting dominated by a mixture of naivity and stupidity, and in a generation of time the whole western europe will become mullah country.

If you ask me, i will tell you that europe is done, maybe not now, but in 20-30 years for sure.

Writing off a whole continent to help soothe your ego? OK - we will see. Europe has recovered from WW-1 and WW-2. Whatever social and economic ills it faces I am convinced it will tide over. "Mullah-isation" is not going to happen because Europe has already woken up to the islamic fundamentalism problems. Just because Europeans have given up world dominance does not mean they are "in decline".
Anyway - soothe your ego with China being the "new superpower" - We will see what happens in another 30 years. CCP or bust.

 

[tony4562]

To be objective, I think J10 in its current configuration is roughly comparable to F16 Block 30/40. J10, due to its carnard+delta wing confuguration, is probably superior to F16 in angle of attack, instant turn rate, and high-attitude performance, taking-off/landing distances. But F16 is probably better at low attitutes performances, and in particular its sustained turn rate/roll performance is probably superior. F16 likely also has higher weapon load due to better materials, but J10 I think has longer legs. F16 most probably also beats J10 in ground attack abilities as well as durability due to american engine.

Overall, there are not many fighters, currently in service in asia (besides those deployed by americans), that can claim to be vastly superior to J10.

 

[tony4562]

I never said China will become another superpower. The term superpower is outdated, and the title 'superpower' has become a burden rather than asset (ask US or the Soviets). But unquestionably, europe has ceased to be a driving force in world economy. As a person living in europe I have witnessed first hand how inefficient things are being run here.

Also Islam will take over europe, its is written on the wall. Short of another 3rd reich, nothing can stop this from happening. Amand's home country for example is already home to 8 million muslims, and they double their ranks every 20 years (fertility rate among muslim women is like 6 or 7 whereas its counterpart among natives is like 1.2).

East asians will be the domianant force in science and engineering, china will be just part of it.

 

[nimo_cn]

We Chinese for a long time have been forbidden to say J10 rivals F16 in this forum, now so are the Koreans. I wonder how you guys are gonna respond if Koreans claim LCA rivals F16.

 

[asianobserve]

You guys forgot to add another aircraft FCK-1 Ching-kuo which is comparable to a F-16s block52s

FC-1 Ching-kuo is based upon a F-16s with two Butt holes engines

The child of US' effort to circumvent China's objection to any supply of weapons to Taiwan. This AC is an F16 all throughout.

 

[Virendra]

But unquestionably, europe has ceased to be a driving force in world economy. As a person living in europe I have witnessed first hand how inefficient things are being run here.
Also Islam will take over europe, its is written on the wall. Short of another 3rd reich, nothing can stop this from happening. Amand's home country for example is already home to 8 million muslims, and they double their ranks every 20 years (fertility rate among muslim women is like 6 or 7 whereas its counterpart among natives is like 1.2).

1. Are you saying that Islam is dragging Europe down?
2. By connecting Islamic migration with Europe's doom are you saying that Europe will for long be in ruins due to that or any other area will be, where such a thing happens?
3. If the two above are right, why is China so eager to irrationally breast feed the monsters in neighborhood? For the plague to spread everywhere else but not China .. am I right ?
Of all muslims in europe (including turkey's), these monsters reputation is unspeakably the worst.

I'm not disputing or agreeing to your position, just curious

Regards,
Virendra

 

[Rahul Singh]

Europe is left behind in dust as far as electronics is concerned. European universities are increasingly a farce, the folks are lazy, and the politics is getting dominated by a mixture of naivity and stupidity, and in a generation of time the whole western europe will become mullah country.

If you ask me, i will tell you that europe is done, maybe not now, but in 20-30 years for sure.

This is ignorance. Europe is not done and wont be as long as USA keeps spending fortunes on its military.

As for the mullah problem. Well, it's not Europe alone, as toady whole world is facing same problem and China is not left alone. Wost is that unlike Europe China is feeding the epicenter.