JF-17 Thunder / FC-1 Xiaolong

Quickgun Murugan

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This is the First which is been assembled in Pakistan & 80% of the airframe and HUD system is built in Pakistan

Most of the Details will be out Tomorrow

I remember reading the following article long time back.

Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC) chairman Air Marshal Khalid Chaudhry HI (M) T Bt re: the JF-17 project, and PAC’s work more generally. The report was triggered by briefings associated with a visit from Sheikh Aftab Ahmad, head of the Standing Committee of the National Assembly on Defence Production. Air Marshal Chadhry reportedly said that PAC has the capability to manufacture 75% of the JF-17’s avionics, and 58% of its air frame.

Stuck in Sichuan: Pakistani JF-17 Program Grounded? No.
The actual percentage and the contributions will be revealed tomorrow is it? Also another question, hasn't Pakistan been assembling F-7's or A-5's all this time or is it the first time it is ever assembling a fighter?
 

Quickgun Murugan

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So, it is clear. It is assembled aircraft rather than totally manufactured in Pakistan.
It was always clear that Pakistan can never achieve total manufacture capability for JF 17 simply because it is decades away from producing any fighter engine. However, achieving independence in producing air-frames will be the only aim for PAC as of now.

Also, PAF might have plans to integrate JF-17's avionics with AESA upgrade which obviously will belong to french.
 

Rage

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the Number will be increased, there will be 40 operational fighters by end of 2010...
Whoa! whoa! Hold on there.

The contract, with China-owned CATIC, is for a total of 42 JF-17's for the air force. The project, signed in March 2009, calls for co-production of the aircraft, with the expectation that 15 would be manufactured in the first year of the project by the state-owned Pakistan Aeronautical Complex.

Pakistan marketing its new JF-17 fighter jet, developed with China
 

bhramos

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Also another question, hasn't Pakistan been assembling F-7's or A-5's all this time or is it the first time it is ever assembling a fighter?
the answer is no.
they never assemebled fully knocked down kits, may be this would be the first one.
 

RPK

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fullstory

Pak, China joint venture JF-17 jets roll out

Islamabad, Nov 23 (PTI) Pakistan today rolled out its first indigenously assembled version of the JF-17 combat jet developed jointly with China as Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani said the air force would be equipped with the latest technology to tackle militancy.

The JF-17 Thunder jet was rolled out at the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex in Kamra, the country?s main facility for building and maintaining combat aircraft. According to Janes the Pakistani air force plans to make the first JF-17 squadron officially operational between 2010-12.

The jet, which was completed after being in development for almost a decade, is a lightweight, all weather, day-night multi-role fighter.

"We are living in challenging times. The fast changing technology-intensive battle arena requires intense involvement of airpower which has emerged as a major player in conflict scenarios," Gilani said in his address.
 

Atul

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What i fail to understand is that why the Chinese the actual Mind behind the Thunder are still evaluating it.

The answer lies in china's Quality evaluation policy, they have finally known that its Quality that matters & not Numbers.

As for pakistan, i still dont understand as to what majorly did they contribute to the JF-17 / FC-1 project.
 

venkat

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the First 50 will be using the Variant of Griffo S-7 instead of KLJ-7, thats the only difference as far as i know


as i said most of the details will be out Tomorrow & i'll be the first one to post it here :)
The scanner reminds me of BLUE VIXEN antenna scanner of BAe systems,UK fillited in Sea Harrier FRS2(UK) . That means KLJ-7 could be a derivative of BLUE VIXEN. chinese could have taken the consultancy of BAe in building this fire control radar. The swedish gripens PS-05 also i believe has its roots in BLUE VIXEN! nicely painted mock up!!!!
 

Vladimir79

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First made in Pakistan fighter to roll out tomorrow
Made in Pakistan? They must mean assembled. :sarcastic:

Both China and PAF attach a lot of importance to this project, which is materializing after hectic and laborious efforts spread over almost a decade, sources said.
China attached a lot of importance to the project? Is that why China refuses to induct it and made Pakistan pay for development? :sarcastic:

The PAC has generated all the capability to produce the aircraft locally for its onward delivery to PAF besides materializing purchase orders from abroad.
PAC has generated all the capability to put a knock-down kit together. Russian engines, Italian avionics, Chinese frame.

The JF-17 Thunder a new generation, light-weight, all weather, day/night multi-role fighter aircraft with glass cockpit, hands-on-throttle-and-stick (HOTAS) controls and efficient man-machine interface will ensure a minimal pilot workload.
I doubt they will be saying that as they fight the stick on obsolete mechanical lateral flight controls. :sarcastic:

The maximum speed of Mach 1.6 and a high thrust-to-weight ratio will enable it to perform well in an air defence role.
M 1.6 is top speed at high altitude and the T2W ratio with a 8,300kg engine is pathetic, this plane will be mince-meat in an air defence role.

An ability to carry short- as well as long-range air-to-air missiles lends the aircraft a first shot capability.
It is only as good as the radar and Grifo S7 sucks ballz compared to Indian supplied radars. It will be dead before it even knows what hit it.

In the surface attack role, a variety of weapons - conventional as well as precision-guided, a sophisticated avionics suite along with accurate weapon delivery system, ensure higher mission success rate.
Sure, 3700kg carries a lot of weight these days. About all this tin can will be carrying is dumb-bombs and rocket pods. Adding a targetting pod will almost double the cost of a base aerocraft. :sarcastic:

An effective ECM suite will greatly enhance survivability of the platform.
It doesn't even come with a quality jammer, buying a foreign pod doesn't make it domestic.

Its anticipated air-to-air refuelling capability will provide the JF-17 with more loiter time to safeguard the frontiers and the ability to deliver the required punch at distance.
PAF doesn't even have tankers. :sarcastic:

It will replace the ageing fleets of A-5s, F-7Ps and the Mirages in the PAF inventory thus fulfilling a multi-role task.
Just because you replace several fleets with one type doesn't mean it fullfils a multi-role task. It is a poor fighter and an even poorer bomber, I suppose it fills the task, poorly.
 

enlightened1

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Any thoughts on why the Chinese are not inducting the "Joint-Failure 17 Blunder"?? They set out on a supposedly joint venture & then don't induct it? Ironic?!! Why the hell did they make it then?
 

Vladimir79

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Why the hell did they make it then?
Because Pakistan paid them to do it. They didn't want to piss off their "ally." It also gave them a good reason to approach Russia for RD-93 orders. I am sure they are trying to dissect it as we speak. Too bad we sold them the old RD-33 core. :sarcastic:
 

fulcrum

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I just heard Pakistan will have around 50 JF-17 fighters in the next 2 years. That is woefully inadequate!!! In any case, it seems finally we have some competition for our Bisons.

I'm still struggling to believe Pakistan has gone through with this JunkFighter-17 when they can get the J-10. Either they are mad or poor or both.
 

bhramos

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@ Fulcrum

this gives them Satisfaction that they too are assembling an aircraft what ever blender is it.

yeah you are correct, Bison is much more better in capable of Air Defence then in Multirole capability. Bison is upgraded with Israeli Avionics and Radar to make it best of 3rd gen and some what to the best 4th Gen Aircraft.
 

SATISH

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I thought the Bison uses the Kopyo Radar.....
 

Singh

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1. JF17 will most likely field Vixen 1000 AESA radar.
2. Acquisition of JF17 and FC20 is a clear move by Pak to establish itself under China's tutelage and away from the fickle US influence. Grave implication for US.
3. Doesn't matter if whether Pak has manufactured them or assembled them. If it can fly and carry BVRAAMs it has the potential to be a potent deterrent.
 

SATISH

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1. JF17 will field Vixen 1000 AESA radar.
2. Acquisition of JF17 and FC20 is a clear move by Pak to establish itself under China's tutelage and away from the fickle US influence.
Singhji,
Has the Vixen been offered and is any kind of deal signed for it? Yes the Pakistanis are moving further from US and towards China. But their top brass still suggests American and Western weapons when compared to Chinese weapons as they are more advanced and reliable compared to the Chinese. And is Selex ready to integrate the Chinese missiles to their Radar? Will the UK and EU governments allow it?
 

musalman

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Made in Pakistan? They must mean assembled. :sarcastic:
True it is assembled and only 20% made in Pakistan. However as per plan 40th aircraft will be 58% Pakistani made



China attached a lot of importance to the project? Is that why China refuses to induct it and made Pakistan pay for development? :sarcastic:


PAC has generated all the capability to put a knock-down kit together. Russian engines, Italian avionics, Chinese frame.

I doubt they will be saying that as they fight the stick on obsolete mechanical lateral flight controls. :sarcastic:


M 1.6 is top speed at high altitude and the T2W ratio with a 8,300kg engine is pathetic, this plane will be mince-meat in an air defence role.
May be but 250 or more will be a good force.


It is only as good as the radar and Grifo S7 sucks ballz compared to Indian supplied radars. It will be dead before it even knows what hit it.
True but 250 plane will do some damage



Sure, 3700kg carries a lot of weight these days. About all this tin can will be carrying is dumb-bombs and rocket pods. Adding a targetting pod will almost double the cost of a base aerocraft. :sarcastic:
I doubt that



It doesn't even come with a quality jammer, buying a foreign pod doesn't make it domestic.

PAF doesn't even have tankers. :sarcastic:
Not true coz refueler tankers from Ukraine have been inducted



Just because you replace several fleets with one type doesn't mean it fullfils a multi-role task. It is a poor fighter and an even poorer bomber, I suppose it fills the task, poorly.
No matter how poor u say it is, but it will be replacing Mirage A5 and F7, i think this fighter is better that those
 

musalman

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1. JF17 will most likely field Vixen 1000 AESA radar.
2. Acquisition of JF17 and FC20 is a clear move by Pak to establish itself under China's tutelage and away from the fickle US influence. Grave implication for US.
3. Doesn't matter if whether Pak has manufactured them or assembled them. If it can fly and carry BVRAAMs it has the potential to be a potent deterrent.
No actually as compare to US China is more willing regarding tech transfer. No matter how good US fighters are USA is not reliable, Chinese are reliable in times of war etc. We can have fancy airforce with US help but we can grow with Chinese.
JF17 can be termed as F16 A/B block 25/30 compatible just like IBM compatible which can upgraded. However branded F16 is good for nothing just like branded IBM PC.

For 3rd world JF17 will start an era of unbranded up gradable IBM compatiable aircraft. IBM sold its business but compatible did wonders Dell / Acer etc etc
 

musalman

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I just heard Pakistan will have around 50 JF-17 fighters in the next 2 years. That is woefully inadequate!!! In any case, it seems finally we have some competition for our Bisons.

I'm still struggling to believe Pakistan has gone through with this JunkFighter-17 when they can get the J-10. Either they are mad or poor or both.
True true true but Pakistan can sell its Junk fighter to any country coz it has the OEM license unlike Bison :)

I don't see any war between India Pakistan in near future but i see wars in Africa Middle east and other other countries.
 

fulcrum

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^ I doubt they would integrate Aesa now. Most probably it'll be for their block-3s.

this gives them Satisfaction that they too are assembling an aircraft what ever blender is it.

yeah you are correct, Bison is much more better in capable of Air Defence then in Multirole capability. Bison is upgraded with Israeli Avionics and Radar to make it best of 3rd gen and some what to the best 4th Gen Aircraft.
They could have upgraded their F-7s like our bisons and could have gone for J-10s with ToT. It would be the most financially and technologically wise decision. There is little rationale behind their JF-17 actions. All the money for JF-17s could have been well spent on upgrading F-7s and J-10 if you ask me. Strange pakistani logic!. Also the same can be said for their AEW procurement. 2 different and incompatible systems is never heard of. When you can't share information via datalinks, what good is an awacs. Even their Air chief said the same and added that "we could have been better off with either a chinese or swedish dea but not both".


Doesn't matter if whether Pak has manufactured them or assembled them. If it can fly and carry BVRAAMs it has the potential to be a potent deterrent.
Same can be said for the F-7s if they had upgraded it like our Bisons. It would have had the same(or only slightly lower) threat potential.
 

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