JF-17 Thunder / FC-1 Xiaolong

[Bleh]

And when project was sanctioned and budget was released.

I bet Monsieur just wanted to show off this part;

Project definition commenced in October 1987 with France's Dassault-Breguet Aviation as consultants. Dassault-Breguet were to assist in the design and systems integration...

But why did Tejas project get into a limbo during the '90s? Unavailability of sub-systems tech?

 

[Rahul Singh]

...
In 1983, IAF realised the need for an Indian combat aircraft for two primary purposes. The principal and most obvious goal was to replace India's ageing MiG-21 fighters, which had been the mainstay of the IAF since the 1970s.
...
In 1984, the Indian government chose to establish the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) to manage the LCA programme. While the Tejas is often described as a product of Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL), responsibility for its development belongs to ADA, a national consortium of over 100 defence laboratories, industrial organisations, and academic institutions with HAL being the principal contractor.[19] The government's "self-reliance" goals for the LCA included the three most sophisticated and challenging systems: the fly-by-wire (FBW) flight control system (FCS), multi-mode pulse-doppler radar, and afterburning turbofan engine.[20]

The IAF's Air Staff Requirement for the LCA were not finalised until October 1985. This delay rendered moot the original schedule which called for first flight in April 1990 and service entry in 1995; however, it also gave the ADA time to better marshal national R&D and industrial resources, recruit personnel, create infrastructure, and to gain a clearer perspective of which advanced technologies could be developed locally and which would need to be imported.[15][21]

Project definition commenced in October 1987 with France's Dassault-Breguet Aviation as consultants. Dassault-Breguet were to assist in the design and systems integration of the aircraft, with 30 top-flight engineers reported to have flown to India to act as technical advisers to IADA, in exchange for $100m / ₹560 crore(equivalent to ₹52 billion or US$730 million in 2018), this phase was completed in September 1988.[21][22]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_Tejas

Where in it, date of full sanctioning of LCA project is mentioned?

Regardless, selection Wikipedia as a source??????? Well nothing more to say.

 

[BON PLAN]

Where in it, date of full sanctioning of LCA project is mentioned?

Regardless, selection Wikipedia as a source??????? Well nothing more to say.

It's not the sole source. It's just the easier to find where you are not in India and don't read your own langage.
Even among serious indian people (ie : you are not the sole to be "serious" ...) it is well known that LCA is nearly a failure. Failure of the Kaveri Engine, developpment phase far too long, failure in the HAL production rythme.

 

[Rahul Singh]

It's not the sole source. It's just the easier to find where you are not in India and don't read your own langage.
Even among serious indian people (ie : you are not the sole to be "serious" ...) it is well known that LCA is nearly a failure. Failure of the Kaveri Engine, developpment phase far too long, failure in the HAL production rythme.

Then i must say you know nothing about Tejas............End of the story.

 

[Bleh]

...it is well known that LCA is nearly a failure.

Yeah mate, i know you come here just to shit on non-French tech, but that's just crazy!
Since the project took off in 2001 & IOC inducted in 2015, everything have been better than satisfactory.

It's been clearing one hurdle after another, never crashed in 4000+ sorties, has several features that no other aircraft in Indian Air Force has, official RCS of 0.5m² with almost 45% composite content etc. etc.
From nearly zero to this in 2 decades, so you better stress extra-hard on the "nearly"...

 

[Rahul Singh]

"Easily the best aircraft I’ve flown,’ says pilot on Tejas"

The Commanding Officer of the India Air Force squadron ‘Flying Daggers 45’, Madhav Rangachari

https://indianexpress.com/article/i...lown-group-captain-madhav-rangachari-2887419/

----------------------------------------

People who actually know Tejas because they have flown it have only praises. Rest are who to comment?

 

[BON PLAN]

Then i must say you know nothing about Tejas............End of the story.

LOL.
according to you the LCA is a full success?
The engine is a world class product.
The frame is perfectly clean and with no issue about air intakes.
The production ran at an incredible rate, without quality problem.
The export back log is so impressive than HAL open a third line
The whole product is so effective than a new model is not on study.
etc....

 

[BON PLAN]

"Easily the best aircraft I’ve flown,’ says pilot on Tejas"

The Commanding Officer of the India Air Force squadron ‘Flying Daggers 45’, Madhav Rangachari

https://indianexpress.com/article/i...lown-group-captain-madhav-rangachari-2887419/

----------------------------------------

People who actually know Tejas because they have flown it have only praises. Rest are who to comment?

The F35 test pilot said exactly the same..... about F35.
So was the Gripen E pilot.
so was the Eurofighter pilot.
....

 

[BON PLAN]

Yeah mate, i know you come here just to shit on non-French tech, but that's just crazy!
Since the project took off in 2001 & IOC inducted in 2015, everything have been better than satisfactory.

It's been clearing one hurdle after another, never crashed in 4000+ sorties, has several features that no other aircraft in Indian Air Force has, official RCS of 0.5m² with almost 45% composite content etc. etc.
From nearly zero to this in 2 decades, so you better stress extra-hard on the "nearly"...

Absolutely not.
Just to say that india made a big mistake developping simultaneously a new frane AND a new engine.
Just to say that the LCA program was never short and full of success as some said and wrote it.
Just to say that it takes time but you will success developping an aero industry.

 

[rone]

LOL.
according to you the LCA is a full success?
The engine is a world class product.
The frame is perfectly clean and with no issue about air intakes.
The production ran at an incredible rate, without quality problem.
The export back log is so impressive than HAL open a third line
The whole product is so effective than a new model is not on study.
etc....

Lets talk abt engine first'yep we are struggling in jet engine tech becoz we don't have full blown technical capabilities to make a 100% in house and research data, the French frim we consulted still hanging us in Threads,

Lets talk abt airframe and building row material quality, yes we achieved success there we developed carbon fibre body for our machine where the LCA other equllent still using aluminium and other row materials in high percentage,

Now talk abt production rate after freezing FOC now we picking up speed , indian aviation industry Just streching its leg for its long run, rather than assembly production this is the first time we trying to develope a world class fighter ( pls don't come with maruth story we know how it goes)

After US sanctions and all other technological barrier we made LCA and still in ioc2 config it is effective intercepter and decent multi role aircraft,when LCA desgined it ment to be mig21 replacement not m2k so it planed to have mig21 paylaod or similar Operational charterstics, if u so concerned abt payload and range my question is what the f..k we have su30 for for a areal display?, So IAF always have mixed combo operational doctrain never depend on one platform for all jobs, so stop di..k measuring try to understand why LCA program there in first place

 

[asianobserve]

The F35 test pilot said exactly the same..... about F35.
So was the Gripen E pilot.
so was the Eurofighter pilot.
....

And so was Rafale test pilot and our resident rah rah boy....

 

[Steven Rogers]

Yeah mate, i know you come here just to shit on non-French tech, but that's just crazy!
Since the project took off in 2001 & IOC inducted in 2015, everything have been better than satisfactory.

It's been clearing one hurdle after another, never crashed in 4000+ sorties, has several features that no other aircraft in Indian Air Force has, official RCS of 0.5m² with almost 45% composite content etc. etc.
From nearly zero to this in 2 decades, so you better stress extra-hard on the "nearly"...

45 percent by weight, we should talk the facts with area in our mind which is 90 percent and above. eft claims to use highest but thats 82 percent by area not by weight.

 

[Rahul Singh]

LOL.
according to you the LCA is a full success?
The engine is a world class product.
The frame is perfectly clean and with no issue about air intakes.
The production ran at an incredible rate, without quality problem.
The export back log is so impressive than HAL open a third line
The whole product is so effective than a new model is not on study.
etc....

Point to point rebuttal would be such a waste of time. I have seen many like you in my 15 years of tracking Tejas. The Pot-Shot takers.

Like i said before you know nothing about LCA Program and Tejas. Especially about the composite reason why it was launched in the first place and how it has succeeded in it.

I would just assist you with the keyword which is Creation of an Ecosystem for the development of future platforms along with a light and cost-effective fighter meeting the bulk requirement of IAF. It succeeded in both.

 

[Rahul Singh]

The F35 test pilot said exactly the same..... about F35.
So was the Gripen E pilot.
so was the Eurofighter pilot.
....

Yeah just like Tejas, above said products are doing what they are meant to do.

 

[BON PLAN]

Point to point rebuttal would be such a waste of time. I have seen many like you in my 15 years of tracking Tejas. The Pot-Shot takers.

Like i said before you know nothing about LCA Program and Tejas. Especially about the composite reason why it was launched in the first place and how it has succeeded in it.

I would just assist you with the keyword which is Creation of an Ecosystem for the development of future platforms along with a light and cost-effective fighter meeting the bulk requirement of IAF. It succeeded in both.

OK.
You are patriotic, and it's a quality.
So I will follow the great history of the smaller fighter of the world, F22 like potent.

 

[no smoking]

It's been clearing one hurdle after another, never crashed in 4000+ sorties, has several features that no other aircraft in Indian Air Force has, official RCS of 0.5m² with almost 45% composite content etc. etc.

That is interesting, 0.5m² RCS? Can you please provide the official source claiming that?

 

[Rahul Singh]

OK.
You are patriotic, and it's a quality.
So I will follow the great history of the smaller fighter of the world, F22 like potent.

Like i care if you or won't you.

 

[Indx TechStyle]

OK.
You are patriotic, and it's a quality.
So I will follow the great history of the smaller fighter of the world, F22 like potent.

It doesn't need to be highly potent like F22. It's potent what it was made for. Tejas developed today is far more advanced than Tejas envisaged in past. And no project is 100% at all. Adding that, it was our first attempt.
Once it's productiom rate increases & induction at larger scale begins, better first class versions with lower costs will be there. Everything is forgiven if it finally saves IAF fleet.

 

[Bleh]

That is interesting, 0.5m² RCS? Can you please provide the official source claiming that?

I saw the link to an official stating it on this forum, years ago...Go through older posts.

Other than that, a value of 0.3-0.5 (clean) is available over the internet;
https://books.google.co.in/books?id=QoxmDwAAQBAJ&pg=PT461&lpg=PT461&dq=extremely+low+radar+cross-section+of+0.3+to+0.5+square+metres&source=bl&ots=jijVDhipk7&sig=ACfU3U3ci44i3woM5dX9whDlytGbzFDYdw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiaiIPh96PhAhWHr48KHWefD_IQ6AEwAXoECAoQAQ#v=onepage&q=extremely low radar cross-section of 0.3 to 0.5 square metres&f=false

https://bharatkarnad.com/2013/11/10...nt-value-add-to-stop-wasteful-military-deals/

http://defensenews-alert.blogspot.com/2017/06/hal-lca-tejas-indias-lethal-compact.html
https://defenceupdate.in/analysis-does-lca-tejas-posses-stealth/
http://fullafterburner.weebly.com/next-gen-weapons/lca-tejas-lethal-compact-agile-part-1

As i was corrected before, Tejas has 45% composite content by weight & 90% of the surface area.

 

[Rahul Singh]

It doesn't need to be highly potent like F22. It's potent what it was made for. Tejas developed today is far more advanced than Tejas envisaged in past. And no project is 100% at all. Adding that, it was our first attempt.
Once it's productiom rate increases & induction at larger scale begins, better first class versions with lower costs will be there. Everything is forgiven if it finally saves IAF fleet.

He 'The French' is a cheap shot taker. So I did not reply to him in point to point manner.

The LCA program was conceived with only two things in mind.

a) Creation of an ecosystem for the development of military aircraft in particular and rest of the aircrafts in general in India.

b) Mig-21 the workhorse of air interception was to be replaced with equally light Fighter but with the addition of features like shallow strikes capability and ground support.

Today we know where we stand in terms of ecosystem. Tejas 16th production example has flown with wings made by L&T. This is just one example from the host of it about the ecosystem that has been realized so far. The family of R&D facilities which has developed MMR and host of other systems for combat aircraft, in general, is still an ever-expanding list.

When ADA embarked on Tejas MK-2 we realized our aim of the creation of an ecosystem for the development of future combat aircraft. And MK-2 will be followed by AMCA.

Coming to the tactical capability of Tejas. When Ex- Mirage 2000 Pilots praises Tejas over their past platform it means something. When Tejas outscores every other IAF platform in A2G domain (which was always considered the secondary role for it) it indicates where Tejas stands tactically.

Tejas might easily be the best fighter in its weight category due to constant refinements a capability we now own because of the ecosystem that has been created in the process of the development of LCA. The fact remains that Tejas is an evolving platform which is already much more than what it was originally conceived to become.