Japanese may sell sea rescue aircraft US-2 to India

asianobserve

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While the ShinMayawa US-2 is only being exported now, starting with us Indians we could order a dozen of them for our Navy and create an effective supply chain with Japanese.
Baby steps hopefully with promising strategic considerations. These Japanese are starting to come out from their Imperial guilt, thanks to China...

Maybe you Malaysians and other southeast countries such as your neighbors can also acquire these for your navies. This would ensure that the unit cost of the product comes down, there's a wide distribution of suppliers of parts so that there's no political domination on customer countries.
We bought 2 Bombardier CL-415 for the MMEA for territorial waters patrol. The RMN has no plans for amphibian maritime patrol or S&R aircraft at the moment as it is focusing on acquiring long range land based maritime surveillance capabilities (right now it is reliant on the Army for maritime patrol). Hopefully, like India we can have some ShinMayawa US-2s in Malaysian colors (fantasy), money is an issue.

 
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Sancho

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We bought 2 Bombardier CL-415 for the MMEA for territorial waters patrol.
The interesting point in these Indian competitons is, that the 3 contenders are pretty different in layout and performance:



Amphibians around the World | ShinMaywa Industries, Ltd.


The fact that one has twin turbo props, the other 4 and the last 2 jet engines might give pretty different operating costs, which will be a point as well. Not to forget the differences in range, MTOW..., I think for Indian requirements the US 2 and the Be 200 should be the best choices.
 

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The Defense Ministry is considering the export of the Maritime Self-Defense Force's US-2 sea rescue aircraft to India for civilian use, it was learned Sunday.

In view of India's long history of border disputes with China, the Japanese initiative may be aimed in part at China's aggressive maritime activity.

The US-2 is an amphibious plane internationally acclaimed for its ability to land in water in bad weather.

The ministry believes that shipping the aircraft to India would not violate Japan's ban on arms exports. The US-2 is not a weapon, a senior ministry official said.




Defense Ministry may sell sea rescue aircraft to India : National : DAILY YOMIURI ONLINE (The Daily Yomiuri)
 

Neil

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Japan, India to discuss military plane sale during PM's visit to Tokyo



Japan is close to signing an agreement to supply amphibious planes to India, a report said Monday, in what would be the first sale of hardware used by the military since a weapons export ban was imposed.
During a four-day visit to Tokyo by Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, starting later Monday, the two sides are set firm up plans for Delhi to purchase the US-2, a domestically-developed aircraft used by Japan's armed forces.

The sale, reported by the Nikkei business daily, would be the first of a finished product made by Japan's homegrown defence industry since rules were imposed restricting the export of weapons systems and other equipment.

It would also mark a strengthening of the alliance between Japan and India, which both see rising China as a threat to regional stability.

Experts say the aircraft must be classed as for civilian use if it is to comply with Japan's 1967 self-imposed ban on arms exports, part of the post-World War II anti-militarist drive.

The US-2, which was developed by ShinMaywa Industries and has been sold to the Japanese navy at a price tag of roughly 10 billion yen ($99 million), has a range of 4,700 kilometres (2,900 miles) and can land in seas with waves of up to three metres (nine feet).

"If the US-2 is exported to India for civilian use, that would be the first case of exports of Japanese-developed weaponry used by the defence ministry for civilian use," a trade ministry official in charge of arms sales told AFP.

ShinMaywa opened a sales office in New Delhi last year and has been promoting the plane there, a spokesman for the company said.

"We hear there is some demand from the Indian government but decline to comment further as we have yet to reach a contract," he added. The Nikkei said India is looking to acquire at least 15 of the aircraft.

Japan has sought to expand the market for its defence industry. It has previously exported technology or parts of military hardware, but has not sold any finished products.

The plane could be deemed to have a non-military — for example, search and rescue — purpose if "friend-or-foe" identification systems were disabled, officials said, making it eligible for export.

In 2011 Tokyo eased the decades-old ban on arms exports, paving the way for Japanese firms to take part in multinational weapons projects.

The reported talks on sales "are based on policy decisions made a few years ago that Japan has to support its defence industry by diverting military technology to civilian use for export", said Takehiko Yamamoto, professor of international relations at Waseda University.

Otherwise, major Japanese firms such as Mitsubishi Heavy Industries and Kawasaki Heavy Industries "will not able to maintain their pool of engineers to develop military technology that is essential for the defence of Japan", he said.

Boosting exports from Japan's manufacturing behemoths is a key part of Prime Minister Shinzo Abe's plan to revive the economy.

Abe and Singh are scheduled to meet on Wednesday for a summit expected to concentrate on trade and investment.

Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Singh’s visit to Tokyo | idrw.org

:thumb:
 

t_co

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

:lol:

yet another nation joins the already-convoluted IAS supply chain
 

SajeevJino

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

Everyone Comes to India and Sell their Products Even the Indian PM goes abroad he buys Something


Where all Indigenous Projects and RD lacks of Knowledge and Money


:hmm:
 

Yusuf

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

What sense does it make to open up defence exports and say they can be used only for civilian purpose. Japan needs to drop its pacifism.
 

t_co

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

What sense does it make to open up defence exports and say they can be used only for civilian purpose. Japan needs to drop its pacifism.
The day it does that will be the day South Korea leaves the US/Japan alliance.
 

mattster

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

Japan along with South Korea, Vietnam are all natural allies with India.

Japan needs to start sharing defense technology with India since they are both on the receiving end of an aggressive China.
But the puny Japanese cant seem to make up their mind on what to do.

They are so slow when it comes to decision making that you would think they are Indians. Between their own pacifist constitution and weak Prime Ministers.....they cant make any decisions.
 

SamwiseTheBrave

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

Japan along with South Korea, Vietnam are all natural allies with India.

Japan needs to start sharing defense technology with India since they are both on the receiving end of an aggressive China.
But the puny Japanese cant seem to make up their mind on what to do.

They are so slow when it comes to decision making that you would think they are Indians. Between their own pacifist constitution and weak Prime Ministers.....they cant make any decisions.
recognize that a country and a culture which defines a concept like bushido and a warrior class of the samurai will not remain pacifist forever. the current dispensation and pacifism will be proven as a historical aberration in due time. count on it.
 

RoYaL~GuJJaR

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

What sense does it make to open up defence exports and say they can be used only for civilian purpose. Japan needs to drop its pacifism.
This plane will be good addition to our cost guards for search and rescue operations.
 

aerokan

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

What sense does it make to open up defence exports and say they can be used only for civilian purpose. Japan needs to drop its pacifism.
Atleast they are being pacifistic while claiming as one. On the other hand, we claim not to be pacifistic and we do even worse !! :tsk:
 

no smoking

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

Japan along with South Korea, Vietnam are all natural allies with India.
Oh, boy, here we go: Japan along with South Korea? and being natural allies with India? Ok, what can india do for them?

Japan needs to start sharing defense technology with India since they are both on the receiving end of an aggressive China.
But the puny Japanese cant seem to make up their mind on what to do.
Well, Japan has a pure mind what they need to do--relying on the support of USA. What does india provide for these technology? Defending Japan from thousands miles away? Or start a land war when Japan confrant China in the sea?

The fact is there is nothing India can do for Japan while USA is incapable of. So, why Japan need to buy itself 2 insurances.

They are so slow when it comes to decision making that you would think they are Indians. Between their own pacifist constitution and weak Prime Ministers.....they cant make any decisions.
They are not making decision slowly, they just don't have enough resouces to support any significant decision. With a debt of 200% total GDP and declining economy, Japanese really don't have much spare money.
 

drkrn

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

Oh, boy, here we go: Japan along with South Korea? and being natural allies with India? Ok, what can india do for them?



Well, Japan has a pure mind what they need to do--relying on the support of USA. What does india provide for these technology? Defending Japan from thousands miles away? Or start a land war when Japan confrant China in the sea?

The fact is there is nothing India can do for Japan while USA is incapable of. So, why Japan need to buy itself 2 insurances.



They are not making decision slowly, they just don't have enough resouces to support any significant decision. With a debt of 200% total GDP and declining economy, Japanese really don't have much spare money.
what did we do till now for russia.what did pakistan do to china till now??
 

ladder

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

and can land in seas with waves of up to three metres (nine feet).
WMO Sea State Code Wave Height (meters) Characteristics
0 0 Calm (glassy)
1 0 to 0.1 Calm (rippled)
2 0.1 to 0.5 Smooth (wavelets)
3 0.5 to 1.25 Slight
4 1.25 to 2.5 Moderate
5 2.5 to 4 Rough
6 4 to 6 Very rough
7 6 to 9 High
8 9 to 14 Very high
9 Over 14 Phenomenal

Sea state - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So, the amphibious planes can land in sea state moderate to slightly rough.
 

t_co

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

WMO Sea State Code Wave Height (meters) Characteristics
0 0 Calm (glassy)
1 0 to 0.1 Calm (rippled)
2 0.1 to 0.5 Smooth (wavelets)
3 0.5 to 1.25 Slight
4 1.25 to 2.5 Moderate
5 2.5 to 4 Rough
6 4 to 6 Very rough
7 6 to 9 High
8 9 to 14 Very high
9 Over 14 Phenomenal

Sea state - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So, the amphibious planes can land in sea state moderate to slightly rough.
If the sea state is higher than rough, it won't be just the waves that are an issue; there will probably be 40-50 km/h winds in the air. No sane pilot wants to try and land a plane in those types of winds, especially on a slippery surface like, say, the surface of the ocean.
 

Kunal Biswas

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

How a thread about sea planes takes off to indo-china-pak foreign affairs, Will post some tech specs shortly from def-expo..
 

Kunal Biswas

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

Hires for better readings :



The aircraft can operate in rough sea under 3m high waves and under heavy winds, Rough sea consist of many elements one is wind..

The aircraft is not for military purpose but civil and recuse ops, Most probably will be under coast guards..
 

binayak95

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

@Kunal Biswas the plane strangely reminds of PBY Catalinas!!


I am wondering if the IN will upgrade these with HUMSA and ASW equipment because thats what the PBY was used for in WW II and used very well too.
 
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Kunal Biswas

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Re: Japan, India to discuss military plane sales during PM Manmohan Si

@binayak95, I dont think we have them anymore and the need is very little for these aircraft at the moment, So a import is best suited for now..
 
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