INS Chakra/Akula II

natarajan

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
2,592
Likes
762
i dont have source about this issue but am sure it happened
a man with charlie nuke submarine (1990's)was arrested in mumbai ,who was going to usa so usa will try this techniques with akula-II so russia will surely change the signature and some other features to prevent us getting crucial information
 

nitesh

Mob Control Manager
Senior Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2009
Messages
7,550
Likes
1,307
i dont have source about this issue but am sure it happened
a man with charlie nuke submarine (1990's)was arrested in mumbai ,who was going to usa so usa will try this techniques with akula-II so russia will surely change the signature and some other features to prevent us getting crucial information
well here is your source:
http://www.jimmycarterlibrary.org/library/oralhistory/clohproject/India.pdf

In 1987. the Indian Navy had leased a Soviet nuclear submarine. The purpose of the lease was to train the Indian navy in the use of such a technically advanced naval vessel. The reactor unit was sealed and the spent fuel was to be returned to the Soviet Union. Mr. Gandhi had assured President Reagan that "this specific submarine on lease from the Soviet Union would not be used in any manner in the event of any hostilities." Prime Minister Gandhi had assured President Reagan in writing that there was "no ground for any apprehension". Naturally, our navy wanted to know more about the submarine leased from the Soviet Union to India, and this led to a covert operation to obtain detailed plans and drawings of this vessel.
The incident occurred when an Indian Navy Captain was arrested at Bombay International Airport before boarding a flight for the United States in possession of detailed technical data on the Soviet nuclear submarine. Apparently, Indian Intelligence had tracked the Indian naval officer - or was he a double agent - and, in any case, I was asked to meet with the Prime Minister who confronted me with the facts. I did my best to smooth ruffled feathers, and fortunately Mr. Gandhi was sufficiently experienced in international relations to know that information on the Soviet vessel was a legitimate target for our Intelligence agencies.
I urged that the apprehension of the Indian officer before leaving India with the drawings should not adversely impact on over-all U.S.-Indian relations. At the same time, I protected vis-a-vis Washington the American official who had been in charge of this case at the Embassy. He left the post quite rapidly, but has enjoyed an interesting career after his service in India.
changing the signature will be of no great use because USN can always trails the russian vessels and get there signatures. The point is knowledge about internal design feature which needs to be guarded hope both navies have taken the precautionary steps.
 

natarajan

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
2,592
Likes
762
so our whole surface ship fleet signature will be with chinese,pakistan ,usa etc
 

venom

DFI Technocrat
Regular Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2009
Messages
601
Likes
11
Returning To North America

August 7, 2009: Two Russian SSNs (attack subs) were detected off the east coast of the United States recently, in international waters. Russia admitted two of its Akula class boats were out there. This was the first time Russian subs have been off the North American coast in over a decade. This spotlights something the Russian admirals would rather not dwell on. The Russian Navy has not only shrunk since the end of the Cold War in 1991, but it has also become much less active. In the last three years, only ten of their nuclear subs went to sea, on a combat patrol, each year. Most of the boats going to sea were SSNs, the minority were SSBNs (ballistic missile boats). There were often short range training missions, which often lasted a few days, or just a few hours.

The true measure of a fleet's combat ability is the number of "combat patrols" or "deployments" in makes in a year and how long they are. In the U.S. Navy, most of these last from 2-6 months. In the last three years, U.S. nuclear subs have carried out ten times as many patrols as their Russian counterparts. Russia is trying to catch up, but has a long way to go.

Currently, Russia only has 14 SSBN (nuclear ballistic missile sub) boats in service, and not all of them have a full load of missiles. Some lack full crews, or have key systems in need of repair. Only about eight of them are fit to leave port.

Russia has only 14 modern, 7,000 ton, Akula SSNs (nuclear attack subs) in service. These began building in the late 1980s and are roughly comparable to the American Los Angeles class. All of the earlier Russian SSNs are trash, and most have been decommissioned. There are also eight SSGN (nuclear subs carrying cruise missiles) and 20 diesel electric boats. There is a new class of SSGNs under construction, but progress, and promised funding increases, have been slow.

Currently, the U.S. has six of the new, 7,700 ton, Virginia class SSNs in service, four under construction and nine on order. The mainstay of the American submarine force is still the 6,100 ton Los Angeles-class SSN. Sixty-two of these submarines were built, 45 of which remain in front-line service, making it probably the largest class of nuclear submarines that will ever be built. The Seawolf-class of nuclear attack submarines stopped at three from a planned class of twenty-nine. The 8,600 ton Seawolf was designed as a super-submarine, designed to fight the Soviet Navy at its height. Reportedly, it is quieter going 40 kilometers an hour, than the Los Angeles-class submarines are at pier side.

The peak year for Russian nuclear sub patrols was 1984, when there were 230. That number rapidly declined until, in 2002, there were none. Since the late 1990s, the Russian navy has been hustling to try and reverse this decline. But the navy budget, despite recent increases, is not large enough to build new ships to replace the current Cold War era fleet that is falling apart. The rapid decline of Russia's nuclear submarine fleet needed international help to safely decommission over a hundred obsolete, worn out, defective or broken down nuclear subs. This effort has been going on for nearly a decade, and was driven by the Russian threat to just sink their older nuclear subs in the Arctic ocean. That might work with conventional ships, but there was an international uproar over what would happen with all those nuclear reactors sitting on the ocean floor forever. Russia generously offered to accept donations to fund a dismantling program that included safe disposal (of the nuclear reactors).

Since the end of the Cold War in 1991, most of the ship building money has gone into new nuclear subs. Six Akulas have been completed in that time, but the first of a new generation of SSBNs, the Borei class was delayed by technical problems, a new ballistic missile that wouldn't work, and lack of money. The first Borei class boat, after many delays, is finally ready for service, and ended up costing over two billion dollars.

The Russian admirals made their big mistake in the early 1990s, when the dismantling of the Soviet Union left the second largest fleet in the world with only a fraction of its Cold War budget. Rather than immediately retire ninety percent of those ships, Russia tried to keep many of them operational. This consumed most of the navy budget, and didn't work. There were too many ships, not enough sailors and not enough money for maintenance or training at sea. The mighty Soviet fleet is mostly scrap now, or rusting hulks tied up at crumbling, out-of-the way naval bases.

While Western nuclear subs can last for about thirty years, Russian models rarely get past twenty. That means two new SSN or SSGN has to be put into service each year to maintain a force of forty boats. Unless the sub construction budget get billions more dollars a year, that is not going to happen. Right now, the priority is on producing a new class of SSBNs (11 more Boreis are planned or under construction). These Boreis are critical, because they carry SLBM (Sea Launched Ballistic Missiles) that provide a critical (they are much harder to destroy in a first strike than land based missiles) portion of the nuclear deterrent. The rest of the Russian armed forces, like most of the navy, is in sad shape, and unable to resist a major invasion. Only the ICBMs and SLBMs guarantee the safety of the state. So the way things are going now, in a decade or two, Russia will end up with a force consisting of a dozen SSNs and a dozen SSBNs.

The current Russian fleet of nuclear subs is tiny, and the Russians would rather keep them tied up at dock most of the time. The crews can do a lot of training at dockside, and only go to sea a few times a year, to check on their state of training. Given the number of accidents their subs have had in the past decade, the training the crews are getting now is not sufficient. Sending two Akulas to the western Atlantic is a way to give the crews some badly needed experience at longer deployments and operating on the high seas.


Submarines: Returning To North America
 

natarajan

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
2,592
Likes
762
we should give money and get atleast 5 akula and also some oscar class submarine
 

nitesh

Mob Control Manager
Senior Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2009
Messages
7,550
Likes
1,307
Oscar class submarines! That's too big for India as of now (my personal opinion)
 

natarajan

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
2,592
Likes
762
chinese are interested in them (heard through some source dont ask) so we can buy and make their interest a day dream
 

nitesh

Mob Control Manager
Senior Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2009
Messages
7,550
Likes
1,307
and what you will do after buying them?
 

natarajan

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
2,592
Likes
762
reducing enemy weapon is also one strategy so chinese cant use it if a conflict arises and will think twice before attempting any mischief like 1962,as we can use it against them in case of war
 

nitesh

Mob Control Manager
Senior Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2009
Messages
7,550
Likes
1,307
oh so are you saying that by buying oscar there is a guarentee that China will not think about a war.
 

AJSINGH

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2009
Messages
1,237
Likes
77
What a surprise. Many killed in a sea trials disaster before it is even commissioned.
Who the hell would want to sail in that? You call this good news?
More junk. Get you wallet out India and buy Western.
can australia offer us a neuclear sub ......also better than akula 2
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2009
Messages
29,799
Likes
48,281
Country flag
Originally Posted by badguy2000
Russia is crazy! how can Russia lease stratgecal weapons like nuke subs to others?

Isn't this hypocrisy after Chinese record of nuclear proliferation??
 

ppgj

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2009
Messages
2,029
Likes
168
Well, we don't have to lose our sleep over these nuclear subs. These are good enough only when inducted in numbers not in 1 or 2.
Maybe we only need to lease one submarine??
remember 1971 war pak sub PNS Hangoor sank our frigate INS Khukri.
subs are real killers.'cos they can't be located easily even one is deadly.
 

RPK

Indyakudimahan
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 29, 2009
Messages
4,970
Likes
229
Country flag
Indian Navy crew to join Russian sub sea trials in Far East | Top Russian news and analysis online | 'RIA Novosti' newswire



VLADIVOSTOK, September 4 (RIA Novosti) - A crew of Indian submariners will take part in sea trials of a Russian nuclear submarine in mid-September, a source involved in the trials said on Friday.

Russia's Nerpa nuclear attack submarine, damaged in a fatal accident during tests last November, resumed sea trials on July 10 in the Sea of Japan after extensive repairs that cost an estimated 1.9 billion rubles ($60 million).

The submarine is to be leased to the Indian Navy by the end of 2009 under the name INS Chakra.

The source said the Indian submariners would need to undergo a course of training together with Russian specialists and servicemen.

They will subsequently operate on their own under the supervision of Russian instructors.

On November 8, 2008, while the Nerpa was undergoing sea trials in the Sea of Japan, its on-board fire suppression system activated, releasing a deadly gas into the sleeping quarters. Three crewmembers and 17 shipyard workers were killed. There were 208 people, 81 of them submariners, on board the vessel at the time.

India reportedly paid $650 million for a 10-year lease of the 12,000-ton K-152 Nerpa, an Akula II class nuclear-powered attack submarine.

Akula II class vessels are considered the quietest and deadliest of all Russian nuclear-powered attack submarines.
 

natarajan

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2009
Messages
2,592
Likes
762
Indian Navy crew to take part in Russian N-sub sea trials new


For the first time, Indian Navy submarine crew will take part in the ongoing sea trials of the Russian Schuka-B class (NATO: Akula-II) nuclear attack submarine, Nerpa. The next round of sea trials are scheduled to commence in mid-September, according to Russian media sources.
The current round of sea trials of the Nerpa commenced on 10 July this year after repairing damage to the Nerpa resulting from a fatal accident suffered during tests last November in the Sea of Japan. The accident resulted in the death of three crew members and 17 shipyard workers.
Repairs have cost an estimated 1.9 billion rubles ($60 million), according to Russian sources.

Indian submariners will undergo a training course conducted by Russian specialists and servicemen in order to familiarise themselves with the operation of the submarine.


India has reportedly paid $650 million for a 10-year lease of the 12,000-ton K-152 Nerpa, an Akula II class nuclear-powered attack submarine, which is considered to be one of the quietest and deadliest of all nuclear-powered attack submarines.

The submarine is to be leased to the Indian Navy by the end of 2009 under the name INS Chakra.

source
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2009
Messages
29,799
Likes
48,281
Country flag
remember 1971 war pak sub PNS Hangoor sank our frigate INS Khukri.
subs are real killers.'cos they can't be located easily even one is deadly.
do not misunderstand me, i agree with you we need a LARGE number of subs but for now may just need one AKULA.
 

ppgj

Senior Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2009
Messages
2,029
Likes
168
do not misunderstand me, i agree with you we need a LARGE number of subs but for now may just need one AKULA.
no LF,it was the otherway round.there was an impression in the previous posts of the thread wondering about only one sub.my point was even 1 can do a lot particularly a sub.
 

Latest Replies

Global Defence

New threads

Articles

Top