India's first line of defence - RAW

Bosch

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The Current National Security The current National Security Advisor (NSA), Ajit Doval, spent around seven years as an Indian spy in Pakistan. During a function at Vidarbha, he related how he would attend a dargah regularly to keep his cover as a Muslim. One day, he was spotted by a bearded old man who called him a Hindu. Though he denied it, the man pointed out a hole in Doval’s ear for an earring. The present NSA replied that he was born a Hindu who had later converted to Islam. The old man took him home and showed idols of Durga and Shiva hidden in a cupboard.

He was a Hindu, living in disguise in Pakistan. Doval does not reveal anything further, though the old man would have made an excellent intelligence asset for RAW. Veterans also say Pakistan gets away with espionage transgressions more than India, simply because India is an accountable democracy while the military controls Islamabad and funds terror activity worldwide.

http://www.newindianexpress.com/magazine/2018/jun/10/the-secret-battlefield-1825074.html
 

B0seRaoMenonModi

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Most common way through which ISI gets Indians to do their work is through honey traps. Lowest level of sophistication needed. But still some Indians fall for it. :frown:
It's so sad that Indians would betray their nation for dirty inbred Muslim cooch
 

samsaptaka

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This is a fascinating thread. Please keep posting. The post on how we helped Northern Alliance in AFG in 90s is very interesting !
 

indiatester

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Goli kahin se bhi aa sakti hai aur overconfident log toh bulletproof jacket bhi nahi pehente. Goli sirf paid actor ko lage ye jaruri nahi. Kabhi sutradhaar ko bhi lag sakti hai.
Who is the sutradhaar?
Internal to India or external?
Some names that I doubt are :
Ahmed Patel
Digvijay Singh
Sharad Pawar
 

Bosch

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Gist

India's statecraft has been in a morality straitjacket. He calls it bovine pacifism.

The tag of responsible state is burdening us. Other countries are very happy.

1st instance of psyops - by Persians against Egyptians in 1523 BC. Used white cats which are considered holy by Egyptians.
In modern age, Chengiz Khan disarmed his opponents psychologically by allowing a small number of survivors to carry forward the tales of destruction.
some more examples of psyops.

India's record: Based on what vedas talk about covert wars, India should have been a master at it. But it is not. Chinese use it all the time. Porkis obtained nukes beautifully which contained India. Chinese have got us to reduce ourselves to Pakistan's size and made us see it as a difficult enemy. Says it is painful for him to see India in this dimunitive state.
country is known by the enemy it keeps.

Due to similar culture, it is easy for India and Porkistan to infiltrate each other.

An Indian cabinet decision is known to Rawalpindi GHQ within 1 hour. The advantage we have is A Rawalpindi GHQ decision is known to India within 30 minutes.(Joke)

Karnad met ISI's Hamid Gul in Islamabad. Gul said they cannot compete with India in total war. But believed it has the edge in covert warfare, able to keep its nerve in a crisis(implying India cannot). Karnad here talks about 1999 hijack where the flight was allowed to leave Amritsar which could have been easily prevented. They have 600 sleeper cells in India.(karnad said this was an exaggeration on Gul's part).

While Pakistan has every reason to be paranoid about India, India does not have a reason to be paranoid about Pakistan.

Chinese language is very complex. 3600 pictograms. One of our former ambassadors CV Ranganathan spoke excellent chinese, even better than the chinese themselves. In 1.5 track meet, he unnerved the Chinese with his command over the language. Karnad says this is the essence of covert warfare - unnerving the opponent using any means. India's pool of Chinese language experts very small and hence cannot read nor understand chinese policy documents very well. Western sinologists employed for this task who interpret the doc to their own ends. Chinese know of Indian shortfalls in mandarin and use it to their advantage in negotiations. Indian elite are anglicized.

Chinese always work on a very long plan. Indian policymakers seem to not see beyond their noses. He says he is not berating India and this happens due to the constraints of democracy, even US has these constraints.

Indian psyops in 1965 war - After discovering that Paki soldiers did not want to burn to death for religious reasons Indian comms were talking about burning them to death in their tanks. Some Paki soldiers ran away deserting their tanks at the first Indian shot. A total of 75 Patton tanks captured, some of them without any damage. Gen Harbaksh Singh was disappointed for figuring out this late.

Feels India has given up against China. China builds for day after tomorrow, India builds for yesterday.

What India should have done from the beginning:
1. Cultivate Taiwan. They have been imploring us to recognise them. China makes visiting leaders from India to recognise One China. Why did not India ask the same from the Chinese?
2. When Karnad was in National Security Advisory Board(NSAB), he asked Indian foreign secy about INdian response to China giving nukes to Pakistan? He had no answer. He also asked if giving nukes to Chinese neighbors was considered. Again, the answer was no.
3. Why did we not do tit for tat which is a language understood by the Chinese?
4. Foreign Secy response: It is not practicable. Karnad again stresses that nothing should be proper or improper when it comes to the affairs of the state.
5. Taiwan invests 80 Billion USD every year into China. They are ready to relocate all their investments only if we can upgrade their establishment here to an embassy and allow them to fly their flag which we are not willing to do.
6. Taiwanese are also prime mappers of the Chinese cyber grid and are willing to give it to us. Karnad here takes a dim view of National Technical Research Organisation(NTRO). Says India's cyber warfare capabilities are less than 0.
7. Draws analogy between Israel and Taiwan. Giving diplomatic recognition will strengthen ties.
8. India has no idea of how to deal with China but Taiwan does. They are like India and Pakistan.
9. American influence on India, the attraction of green card
10. Praises Vietnam. Mentions sadly that India is a beaten down country. Mentions how Vietnamese talk about their 1000 year war with China.
 

Aaj ka hero

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But DCNS implied that the leak might have occurred at India’s end, rather than from France
This when I told to our French guys here were making fun of me along with the adhwaidya tiwari guy.
They were asking for proof I said them look in DFI for yourselves but no I SAY AGAIN THE ONLY COUNTRY THAT INDIA CAN BELIEVE IS HERSELF in quest for military modernisation if no new technology is given in further rafale orders don't buy it.
 

Aaj ka hero

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India has no idea of how to deal with China but Taiwan does. They are like India and Pakistan.
This type of words hurt though they are true.
The Chinese have crossed line way before, maybe we are waiting for our submarine numbers to grow then something can move on this front.
Bharat karnad ji talks like a hawk and is a front action believer (I like that) and has a big soft spot for russia.
The real problem is I think Pradhanmantri MODI HAS SOFT SPOT FOR CHINESE, maybe he saw something in them during his Gujarat years.(and it's not good DON'T LOVE OR LIKE YOUR ENEMY WHO WANT TO MAKE YOU A DOG NEEDLING THE DOG TAIL ON IT'S MASTER)
I think one can defeat Chinese utterly only by upmasking them in their own covert warfare (let them believe in their covert warfare and then trick them by making use of today geopolitics) or by making them feel inferior by launching full buddhist leadership on them.
It's complex and I know it.
 
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