Indian Special Forces (archived)

[Unknowncommando 2]

SIG SG 551 SB with mounted Trijicon ACOG Sight & attached SIG GL5040 Under Barrel Grenade Launcher

 

[Jay99]

Mossad, MI6 smuggled Iranian nuclear scientist to the UK - report

https://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/M...ian-nuclear-scientist-to-the-UK-Report-580237

 

[armyofhind]

Where the intention is weak everything is hard.

Look at Spetsnaz from early 2004 and now in 2018..there is a huge difference.

If Russians can do it why cant we?

Reason is not giving enough importance to Special Forces.

Most Indian Generals,Admirals and Marshals have no idea what special operations are.

Gen Hasnain had recently said that Indian sniping is of a very high level...either he doesnt know about how high level of sniping is or he is just doing propoganda on national tv.

It would not even cost 100 million dollar to equip all Para SF units with a decent quality of gear.

But we keep adding T90s and sukhois.

The problem for our special forces is exacerbated by the lack of a dedicated command structure as well as the lack of a dedicated unit.

Even in staff colleges like Wellington, there is a serious lack of syllabus regarding special operations.

Add to that the rot which has developed at the core by the political party with vested foreign interests being in power for so long.

 

[Subham Show]

In Corporates big companies hire experts to evaluate their loopholes.

Same happens with cyber security.

But here ....its called negativity.

Maybe some will think that we are congress supporters also.

Actually its its not your fault....we live in such a time where you have become defensive even about your existence.

Someone from India wrote this...having a vision for India.We are far from it.

You have no reason to be defensive about SF..maybe you dont even have 1 serving member in SF and some of us critising have many.

Who are you to take away our right my dear friend?

The poem is written by none other than Rabindranath Tagore

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

The problem for our special forces is exacerbated by the lack of a dedicated command structure as well as the lack of a dedicated unit.

Even in staff colleges like Wellington, there is a serious lack of syllabus regarding special operations.

Add to that the rot which has developed at the core by the political party with vested foreign interests being in power for so long.

The syllabus and Generals are stuck in world war era of Fighter jets and tanks.

In todays era of Fifth Gen warfare these things dont even matter.

Operators or Agents single handedly do the work that T90s cannot.

But no...Arty and Armour is their concern.

The biggest problem is that Generals from Arty and Armour carry out their agenda when they become chief..whereas Infantry general cannot even get boots helmets and rifles.

How much to blame the last govt...If V K Singh had taken a stand to equip foot soldiers do u think the Congress govt would have denied him that.

I dont think thats possible.And VK singh was a Ranger.

Thatswhy i have no hope from SOD too.

Indian war with China will have limited armour and more SF action..they would know this in the war games.But nothing is done.

 

[Darth Malgus]

Unlike others...i have no hope from SOD.

Geez, have a little faith. We are talking about people who have spent decades out there in the field and in the war rooms. I think its a little to convenient to judge them from behind a keyboard.

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

Geez, have a little faith. We are talking about people who have spent decades out there in the field and in the war rooms. I think its a little to convenient to judge them from behind a keyboard.

Time will tell who is right.

............................................

 

[Jackd]

The reason for better equipment and facilities of NSG is because these IPS officers know what they want and get what they want unlike the SFs where there is endless red tapism as well bureaucratic hurdles due to military civilian clash which is almost negligible in MHA. I have seen the Delhi base of NSG and it's decked out.

 

[Jackd]

And in NSG there is a simple rule/fact that no one interferes in the decision making of squad commander i.e. the mission plan finalised by him is sacrosanct as he is thet expert, this includes the DGO and the DG.

 

[binayak95]

The syllabus and Generals are stuck in world war era of Fighter jets and tanks.

In todays era of Fifth Gen warfare these things dont even matter.

Operators or Agents single handedly do the work that T90s cannot.

But no...Arty and Armour is their concern.

The biggest problem is that Generals from Arty and Armour carry out their agenda when they become chief..whereas Infantry general cannot even get boots helmets and rifles.

How much to blame the last govt...If V K Singh had taken a stand to equip foot soldiers do u think the Congress govt would have denied him that.

I dont think thats possible.And VK singh was a Ranger.

Thatswhy i have no hope from SOD too.

Indian war with China will have limited armour and more SF action..they would know this in the war games.But nothing is done.

SF have their role, arty and armor have their own. No amount of SF and clandestine ops helped Israel when shit bubbled over in 73. But, without the their clandestine ops, Israel wouldnt have had the Mirage V plans either.

We wouldnt have won Kargil without arty support either - and frankly every army fights the next war like its previous war - has always been and will always be - and our overwhelming conventional warfare ability is what has ensured victory thus far.

 

[Jackd]

Army's Technical Support Division not a new unit
Senior army sources would not comment on reports that the TSD was being disbanded.

Surya Gangadharan |

Updated: August 24, 2012, 5:07 PM IST



New Delhi: Colonel Hunny Bakshi, head of the Technical Support Division (TSD) accused of off air monitoring, is reported to have submitted a 250-page report to the chief on the work done by the division so far. Sources told CNN-IBN the report is detailed, includes photographs and a record of how funds were spent. Col Bakshi is presently in the psychiatric ward of Army Hospital in Delhi. Senior army sources would not comment on reports that the TSD was being disbanded. But they clarified that only the name TSD is new.

It has existed for quite some years under the benign eye of previous chiefs. The aim was to augment the flow of intelligence from human sources in J&K and the North-east, two of the most problematic areas from the point of view of insurgency and intelligence. It was felt that Army HQs in Delhi needed input separate from that flowing into regional commands (with each command having a counter intelligence group) and corps headquarters (each of which had surveillance units). It was therefore decided to post an officer of the rank of colonel (with a small supporting staff) in Delhi reporting directly to the DG Military Intelligence. Senior officers say there was little in the way of technical support it could give. The argument being that the allegation of "off air monitoring" therefore held no substance. Sources also telling CNN-IBN that off air monitoring equipment installed on India’s borders has proved to be of limited success. The equipment procured from Israel, locks onto a cell phone tower and picks up mobile phone conversations at random. It cannot zero in on a particular mobile phone and when a recording is happening, the cell phone network in the vicinity gets jammed which can alert the enemy.

 

[Jackd]

Apparently TSD is not new as suggested by the previous report posted on this forum.

 

[abingdonboy]

Unlike others...i have no hope from SOD.

If it was any other govt I might agree with you but this govt means business and the reforms that are going on on the security front are no
Joke.

I think it will be a long time before we can know
If the SOD has been successful (they willl certainly
Not be doing any PR stuff ever) but I am pretty optimistic.

A new lean command structure straight to
Central decision makers? That is quite the change in how SFs in India have ever been treated and the way this govt has given special attention to using SFs should highlight their importance to the apex leadership.

The reason for better equipment and facilities of NSG is because these IPS officers know what they want and get what they want unlike the SFs where there is endless red tapism as well bureaucratic hurdles due to military civilian clash which is almost negligible in MHA. I have seen the Delhi base of NSG and it's decked out.

Aside from losing their way (thanks to fking netas of course) with the SRG experience, organisationally NSG (SAG anyway) are a very efficient and honed force. They have a very specific mission profile and thus are structered entirely around that, in the military the SFs may have a core mission profile but because they are under the command of senior mil leadership that is clueless about their capabilities they end up
Being given Absurd missions or unfitting roles.

Inside MHA NSG is given importance, inside MOD the special forces had almost no
Voice. SOD may change this.

 

[IndiaRising]

To elaborate more on importance of Para SF, just look at how many para sf officers make it past colonel rank. The only serving Lt General I know from a Para SF background is Lt. general Paramjit Singh.

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

SF have their role, arty and armor have their own. No amount of SF and clandestine ops helped Israel when shit bubbled over in 73. But, without the their clandestine ops, Israel wouldnt have had the Mirage V plans either.

We wouldnt have won Kargil without arty support either - and frankly every army fights the next war like its previous war - has always been and will always be - and our overwhelming conventional warfare ability is what has ensured victory thus far.

So lets put T 90s in Kashmir then.

The difference between 270 sukhois and 278 doesnt even matter so does the T 90 difference.

At the cost price of those extras many SF units can be upgraded..Soldiers wont have to die...What are your T90s doing...parked in some base..operated once a month for half an hour?

Which was the last war where armour was used?And which is the last war where SF was used?

Arty won us the war in kargil...great...and Maybe Armour won us 71..right? But without Infantry and SF this country wont even survive a day forget about war.

So the thing is to respect that and make their gear modern rather than treating them like gun fodder.

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

If it was any other govt I might agree with you but this govt means business and the reforms that are going on on the security front are no
Joke.

I think it will be a long time before we can know
If the SOD has been successful (they willl certainly
Not be doing any PR stuff ever) but I am pretty optimistic.

A new lean command structure straight to
Central decision makers? That is quite the change in how SFs in India have ever been treated and the way this govt has given special attention to using SFs should highlight their importance to the apex leadership.




Aside from losing their way (thanks to fking netas of course) with the SRG experience, organisationally NSG (SAG anyway) are a very efficient and honed force. They have a very specific mission profile and thus are structered entirely around that, in the military the SFs may have a core mission profile but because they are under the command of senior mil leadership that is clueless about their capabilities they end up
Being given Absurd missions or unfitting roles.

Inside MHA NSG is given importance, inside MOD the special forces had almost no
Voice. SOD may change this.

Yes..like ordering rifles and no accesories?

Snipers and no ballistic computers?

Helmets with no mounts?


Like i said...time will tell.

 

[IndiaRising]

So lets put T 90s in Kashmir then.

The difference between 270 sukhois and 278 doesnt even matter so does the T 90 difference.

At the cost price of those extras many SF units can be upgraded..Soldiers wont have to die...What are your T90s doing...parked in some base..operated once a month for half an hour?

Which was the last war where armour was used?And which is the last war where SF was used?

Arty won us the war in kargil...great...and Maybe Armour won us 71..right? But without Infantry and SF this country wont even survive a day forget about war.

So the thing is to respect that and make their gear modern rather than treating them like gun fodder.

Which war have SF soldiers won on their own? Their mandate is not to fight conventionally but to go behind enemy lines and create asymmetric threat for the enemy on their own turf. They are a tool, just like all different aspects of the military which are meant to operate in cohesion with other service branches. Yes, they have been ignored in India, but to downplay the importance of other services conveys ignorance on your part. In modern times, the most important service arm is not even SF, but MI. I would like to see how much Indian army spends on this particular branch. If the intelligence is good, any well-trained group of soldiers will be able to accomplish the task without trouble.

 

[binayak95]

So lets put T 90s in Kashmir then.

The difference between 270 sukhois and 278 doesnt even matter so does the T 90 difference.

At the cost price of those extras many SF units can be upgraded..Soldiers wont have to die...What are your T90s doing...parked in some base..operated once a month for half an hour?

Which was the last war where armour was used?And which is the last war where SF was used?

Arty won us the war in kargil...great...and Maybe Armour won us 71..right? But without Infantry and SF this country wont even survive a day forget about war.

So the thing is to respect that and make their gear modern rather than treating them like gun fodder.

You read half the post, misinterpret it and go off on a tangent - that's your problem, not mine. Go mouth off to someone who doesn't know the importance of SOF capable units.

My point is it's not an either or situation. You need both.

 

[mayfair]

My point is it's not an either or situation. You need both.

And that's the bottomline. We need both and we need them capable.

Tall ask, given the neta-babu shahi in this country.

 

[Unknowncommando 2]

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