Discussion in 'Indian Army' started by Antimony, Aug 29, 2009.
Why not Strykers ??.........
How about Tata Kestrel for army.
We need to adjust our priorities. Such basics shouldn't be imported.
IMO Indian gov should adopt 3 stage import controls in defense.
1) Low tech category: complete ban on imports. forces must develop strategies based on domestic option.
2) Advance tech category: Partial ban, only parts and subsystems may be imported.
3) High tech category: The rule in this category should be to peg amount of import to the amount received from defense exports.
want to buy that shiny new toy for $2 billion? sure but first export defense items worth $2 billion.
Another major step from MoD should be to ask forces to draw war strategies based on domestic option. Right now our forces are copying foreign strategies and then putting up narrow requirements that can only be fulfilled by weapon of that country who made that strategy in the first place. This is not the way to do it.
First develop a weapon and figure out a strategy to effectively use that weapon. This is the way it works in the world and not the other way around.
Such drastic measures are needed from MoD to weed out corruption in military leadership.
Remember this: "We can win battles, but we cannot win wars with imported weapons."
That's all I have to say. Jai Hind
You are absolutely right. On low tech items there should be complete ban on imports.
People don't realise this but we lose far more money on smaller not so grand weapons.
Ficv is 10-12 billion $ project easily. Combined with artillery and tanks and rifles we loose 30-40 Billion USD on relatively low tech items.
If we could use indegenios solutions that Forex could have bought us 200 rafale an area where we are actually significantly behind west in technology.
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#IndianArmy recent CT Ops & CASO pictures from #Kashmir
Its time to cancel the Arjun project. My father was part of the initial team to go to Germany and seek help making a tank that could counter the M1 Abrams Pakistan was possibly buying. Pakistan never bought the M1. The Arjun is still a majority german tank, is overpriced, and it still has low serviceability rates. Focus on the T72/T90 upgrades, and develop a 50 ton FMBT. The Arjun is an overpriced, overweight, foreign-made dead-end project.
Its like a big slap on many peoples face, But I agree it
we have to move on FMBT rather than browling with Arjun
A large order (500+ units) would’ve addressed every single one of these issues.
IA killed off the Arjun in favour of foreign imports. [email protected]
Recently we put some billions of money into Russians mouth to buy around 464 T90's . maybe months ago, stupidity level of IA
Same shit again and again.
And it’s not stupidity. It’s sheer corruption.
Are we competing in the Tank Biathlon 2019.
Which tank ?
I cant see any link about our plan
No its not.There are solid deficiencies in arjun.
60 tonne plus weight means only useful in deserts,cant be used anywhere like t series.IA main tank needs to be 55 tonne max.
Lacks logistics commonality with t72 fleet,unlike t90.
2 and a half times more costlier than a T90 wuth large number of imported parts, especially highly costly german engine.
Outdated rifled gun,needs smoothbore cannon.
Still cant fire cannon launched atgm reliably.
No reliable 120 mm apfsds drdo round available that can give better penetration performance than mango,and certainly nowhere close to 750 mm penetration of svinets that we would get with new 464 ms model.
None of these issues can be wished away as corruption.T90 is an affordable,logistics easy solid tank with stellar performance in syria and ukraine where it withstood direct TOW hits.
That said arjun project has built an ecosystem that will be utilized in fmbt .The kanchan armour,digital add ons will be useful.Kanchan is already used in t90 and mk2 era used in t72s.
Not true at all!!
I don't believe that's a very realistic demand, keeping the weight restricted at 55 ton.I mean, when the weight of MBTs with autoloaders (hence smaller turrets) such as ZTZ 99A2 and K2 Black Panther et al. can't be kept limited to 55 tonne, then how do you propose we keep the weight of Arjun, wich is a 4 man crewed MBT down without seriously compromising its armor protection characteristics??!!
I think it's about time our generals (and we) bite the bullet and accept the fact that MBTs are only going to gain more and more weight with all the upgrades that's getting incorporated as well as to maintain their crew survivability against ever increasing dangers of various anti tank weapons that are surely to infest any future battlefield.
Just take a look at the upgrade packages that have been formulated by the western countries.For example, the next version of the M1 Abrams, the A3, is going to weigh over 70 tonne and that's if everything goes according to plans!!Same thing for Leopards, Challenger 2, Leclerc you just name it!!Heck, even the T 14 Armata is said to weigh aproximately 55 tonne with basically zero turret armor - yes, ZERO turret armor as far as MBTs are concerned!!
Now, if all these countries, with more than half a century of experience in developing and manufacturing tanks, and with all the advancements in material sciences can not keep the weight of their future MBT variants bound at below 60 tonne, then how do you expect us to do the same without indulging into yet another wasteful and even disastrous shit show of a tank project??!!
Well, the army generals should have though about that before forming up their GSQR then, don't ya think??
Certainly; and the army is to be blamed just as much, if not more than DRDO for this guacamole.
Absolutely and in this case, the blame lies solely on the Army, cause they are the ones who specified it in their GSQR!!Seems like the top brass was not only unimaginative and devoid of any common sense and basic human intelligence but they were ignorants of the highest order as well!!Bloody mongs couldn't even get off their sorry @rses and just see what was happening in the rest of the world.
Not true.The Arjun never had trouble firing gun launched ATGMs as long as they were not full calibre rounds.
Not true anymore since the MkII 120 mm APFSDS did achive penetration in excess of circa 280 mm at 60 degree impact angle, which would translate roughly to about 520 mm at 0 degrees.But yeah, this is no where near decent enough by today's standards.
That is pure bollocks if you ask me.
Nothing to disagree here to be honest. Arjun, in both of its present variants, suffers from a magnitude of very serious design issues which shows how clueless our designers are at the CVRDE.
Only because of their heavy ERA and also, the TOW is not really what one would consider a state-of-the-art ATGm, not in this age at least.So surviving a few such hits doesn't really count for much to be honest.
That's true but don't expect the weight of the FMBT to be lower than 60 tonne, even if they decide to go for a 3 man crew.
Indian armour Systems offer light weight armored vehicles for military & personal protection individually designed to meet clients' required threat levels.
#WorldPhotographyDay War Memorial Indian Army Southern Command, Pune
Vickers P Vijayanta.
One of the best tanks of the Cold War.
True but I would say the Centurions were better, especially the later marks.
#Russia to put $4.5B T-14 Armata tank deal on the table during upcoming Modi visit
Momentum towards the sale of the T-14 Armata next generation Main Battle Tank to India is high on the Russian agenda during the upcoming visit of Prime Minister Narendra Modi to Vladivostok for the 5th Eastern Economic Forum and the 20th Jubilee Bilateral Summit, sources privy to advance discussions indicated to SP’s.
An estimated $ 4.5 Billion Armata deal is being pitched both as a replacement for the Indian Army’s ageing T-72 Main Battle Tank (MBT) and also a universal chassis system which serves as a platform for a variety of armoured tracked vehicles. India is one of the largest operators of Russian tanks and armoured vehicles. Its sizeable fleet of Soviet-era BMP Infantry Combat Vehicles (ICVs) is also due for gradual replacement. The Armata deal is being offered as a multi-purpose replacement for both the T-72 tanks and ICVs.
By issuing an RFI in November 2017, the Indian Army has indicated an intention to run a global competition to procure 1,770 Future Ready Combat Vehicles (FRCV) built in India with foreign collaboration under the ‘Make’ category through the Strategic Partnership model. But Russia is pitching for a government-to-government deal
The recent visit of an Indian Army delegation – reportedly also including officers of the Mechanised Infantry – to evaluate the Armata in Russia is an indication that India is considering the offer seriously.
By issuing an RFI in November 2017, the Indian Army has indicated an intention to run a global competition to procure 1,770 Future Ready Combat Vehicles (FRCV) built in India with foreign collaboration under the ‘Make’ category through the Strategic Partnership model. But Russia is pitching for a government-to-government deal.
The ‘test batch’ of the first 100 serial produced T-14 Armata tanks are scheduled to be delivered to the Russian Army in 2020. The next generation features on these tanks include an unmanned turret, better armour, mobility, weaponry, fire control system and crew facilities like a toilet.
Hi there the India army is doing a great job protecting the country
Why hasn't India participated in this year's ongoing Tank Biathlon 2019?
Too embarrassed after both our Tincan-90s showed their worth last year?
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