India to send back Sri Lankan Air Force trainees, China Sri Lanka bhai bhai

maomao

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Where did I deny genocide? Please quote me.

Also, you said you have read that thread. Do read it again. My position is very clear. I have also seen the entire video that was screened in front of the international audience.

It doesn't change my stance that LTTE's existence would have resulted in a lot more deaths of SL Tamils. Of course, you may differ.
Ohh apologies, so you do believe in Tamil Genocide and slaughtering of Tamils by SL! I took your below mentioned statement otherwise!

I have no idea why people are crying genocide. Can you please tell us?
Great you saw the video and enlightened yourself!

As suggested by you, I have read the thread again and still I don't find anything to be proud of!

Sinhalese are like snakes; historically they have played the cat and mouse game to harm India in a sadistic manner even before the civil war started! Do some research!
 
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amitkriit

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Fire in the neighbourhood has dangers of spreading unto one's own house or the least one has face the heat. Is not that common sense. What is required now is to pressurise the Sinhala govt to accommodate the genuine rights and aspirations of the Tamil people rather than creating monsters like LTTE who had become ISI conduits for drug trafficking.
The current Sinhaese government is the biggest terrorist. Sri Lanka was never friendly towards India, it supported USA during cold war, supported Pakistan in every war against India. Committed genocide against it's own citizens. Like Pakistan Sri Lanka teaches a corrupted history to it's students. They deny the existence of Tamil Kingdoms. They deny the fact that Tamils lived there since the time immemorial. You cannot expect anything better from this regime.
 

amitkriit

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@pmaitra people weren't crying "genocide" back then because Tamils were not being killed so much impunity, like it is happening now. There is no counterweight to stop the Sinhalese from doing so. Sinhalese are filled with venom against Tamils since the day they are born. Another LTTE will rise if it continues.
 

pmaitra

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Ohh apologies, so you do believe in Tamil Genocide and slaughtering of Tamils by SL! I took your below mentioned statement otherwise!
  • Do I believe in slaughter of Tamils by SL? No.
  • Do I believe in slaughter of Tamils by SL, AND, slaughter of Tamils and Sinhalese by LTTE, AND, slaughter of Indian soldiers by both SL and LTTE, AND assasination of Rajiv Gandhi by LTTE? Yes.
The two points above are different. One is biased and emotional drivel, and the other one is neutral and objective.


Great you saw the video and enlightened yourself!
You would have realized that had you read that thread.

As suggested by you, I have read the thread again and still I don't find anything to be proud of!
I don't think you have read that thread, but anyway, it matters not.

Sinhalese are like snakes; historically they have played the cat and mouse game to harm India in a sadistic manner even before the civil war started! Do some research!
There are some nice posts on how the SL Army and LTTE collaborated and plotted to kill Indian soldiers. I suggest you read that thread again, instead of claiming you have read it, when you really haven't.
 

pmaitra

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@pmaitra people weren't crying "genocide" back then because Tamils were not being killed so much impunity, like it is happening now. There is no counterweight to stop the Sinhalese from doing so. Sinhalese are filled with venom against Tamils since the day they are born. Another LTTE will rise if it continues.
So you think a prolonged conflict would have been a great boon to the Tamils of Sri Lanka? Perhaps you are right, but I think otherwise.

Can you tell me why and how LTTE became the one and only front of the SL Tamils against the SL government?
 

hit&run

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Rajiv Gandhi died because of his own stupidity and back-stabbing actions! Dumb Rajiv Gandhi (including IG) and Congress are responsible for first creating LTTE, and then sending IPKF to get butchered by Sri Lankan deceit! Need to open your eyes wider!

Nobody here wants to change your pathology or anatomy, it was a reply to your denial of GENOCIDE!
Exactly, its the duplicity and over playing diplomacy of Congress lead swing state India that we are always in decision making dilemma ( in congress mouth piece media praising words for their idiocies oh ! they are walking on the tight rope, why the ---- you created that situation that you are now walking on tight rope, one must ask them) and not coming out clear on any thing especially on foreign policy issues.

Look at Govt. of India's bankruptcy that they are the same people who voted for UN resolution against them for the genocide of Tamils and at the same time providing training to their Air force. Either they are making ''-------s'' fools of us (the public), Western world/USA or Sri Lanka. They think no one will see their duplicity and won't tag them as a weak swing state worth of their support when they will need at time.
 
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pmaitra

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Rajiv Gandhi died because of his own stupidity and back-stabbing actions! Dumb Rajiv Gandhi (including IG) and Congress are responsible for first creating LTTE, and then sending IPKF to get butchered by Sri Lankan deceit! Need to open your eyes wider!

Nobody here wants to change your pathology or anatomy, it was a reply to your denial of GENOCIDE!
Exactly, its the duplicity and over playing diplomacy of Congress lead swing state India that we are always in decision making dilemma ( in congress mouth piece media praising words for their idiocies oh ! they are walking on the tight rope, why the ---- you created that situation that you are now walking on tight rope, one must ask them) and not coming out clear on any thing especially on foreign policy issues.

Look at Govt. of India's bankruptcy that they are the same people who voted for UN resolution against them for the genocide against Tamils and at the same time providing training to their Air force. Either they are making ''-------s'' fools of us (the public), Western world/USA or Sri Lanka. They think no one will see their duplicity and won't tag them as a weak swing state worth of their support when they will need at time.Exactly, its the duplicity and over playing diplomacy of Congress lead swing state India that we are always in decision making dilemma ( in congress mouth piece media praising words for their idiocies oh ! they are walking on the tight rope, why the ---- you created that situation that you are now walking on tight rope, one must ask them) and not coming out clear on any thing especially on foreign policy issues.

Look at Govt. of India's bankruptcy that they are the same people who voted for UN resolution against them for the genocide against Tamils and at the same time providing training to their Air force. Either they are making ''-------s'' fools of us (the public), Western world/USA or Sri Lanka. They think no one will see their duplicity and won't tag them as a weak swing state worth of their support when they will need at time.
Back-stabbing was done by SL Army and LTTE.

Rajiv Gandhi was not stupid. By sending IPKF, he prevented SL from establishing a permanent US military base in SL. It was a necessity. In fact, not sending the IPKF would have been utterly idiotic.

Regarding swinging actions, every country does that. Even the US has done that many times. I call that balancing act.

What do you guys recommend? Invading Sri Lanka? Fine, go ahead. I would support threatening an aerial bombing raid over SL if they decide to let PRC setup a base. However, any suggestion to recreate LTTE, is absurd and illogical. When you create a proxy, they always come back to bite you.

Never create a Frankenstein. Either fight your own war, or leave it.
 

maomao

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  • Do I believe in slaughter of Tamils by SL? No.
  • Do I believe in slaughter of Tamils by SL, AND, slaughter of Tamils and Sinhalese by LTTE, AND, slaughter of Indian soldiers by both SL and LTTE, AND assasination of Rajiv Gandhi by LTTE? Yes.
The two points above are different. One is biased and emotional drivel, and the other one is neutral and objective.
Awesome to find that you have such clarity over this issue!



You would have realized that had you read that thread.

I have told you that I have read the thread! However, you wanna repeat it again and again, be my guest!

I don't think you have read that thread, but anyway, it matters not.
Yeah..........go on!

There are some nice posts on how the SL Army and LTTE collaborated and plotted to kill Indian soldiers. I suggest you read that thread again, instead of claiming you have read it, when you really haven't.
Strawman argument!

IPKF was sent to assist SLA and to eliminate LTTE! What happened? SL connived with desperate LTTE to teach India a lesson! So who in regards to SL psyche was the bigger enemy India or LTTE (even during the Civil war where they were losing their land to LTTE and knowing fully well the consequences of IPKF loss and withdrawal)? And how did SL deal with it! Killing Indians who went there to help (of course with the help of LTTE)! The Rajiv Gandhi led GOI was so lame to play both sides openly and Rajiv brought his fate upon himself. No Love Lost there!
 
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amitkriit

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  • Do I believe in slaughter of Tamils by SL? No.
  • Do I believe in slaughter of Tamils by SL, AND, slaughter of Tamils and Sinhalese by LTTE, AND, slaughter of Indian soldiers by both SL and LTTE, AND assasination of Rajiv Gandhi by LTTE? Yes.
The two points above are different. One is biased and emotional drivel, and the other one is neutral and objective.



You would have realized that had you read that thread.


I don't think you have read that thread, but anyway, it matters not.


There are some nice posts on how the SL Army and LTTE collaborated and plotted to kill Indian soldiers. I suggest you read that thread again, instead of claiming you have read it, when you really haven't.
1. Slaughter of Tamils is real. There is no bias, and whole world has taken a note of it. This is not an emotional issue, this is a political issue as well. Sri Lanka is not willing to fulfil any of the promises it made. If situation doesn't change there will be more insurgencies, and going by the stand India took the new guys with the guns will not see a friend in India, neither will the Sri Lankan government.

2. India herself is responsible for sending the Indian Soldiers without proper support, plan and ammunition. Don't blame your enemies for killing your soldiers. Blame your leadership. Did you expect LTTE or the Sri Lankan government to lick Indian ass? They found a common enemy and acted according to the new situation. It is you who is getting emotional here.

3. Only the might is right and we have lost all the leverage we had on Sri Lanka. India might have exploited the situation iin a better way which we did not, because Gandhis are calling the shot.
 

hit&run

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Back-stabbing was done by SL Army and LTTE.

Rajiv Gandhi was not stupid. By sending IPKF, he prevented SL from establishing a permanent US military base in SL. It was a necessity. In fact, not sending the IPKF would have been utterly idiotic.

Regarding swinging actions, every country does that. Even the US has done that many times.

What do you guys recommend? Invading Sri Lanka? Fine, go ahead. I would support threatening an aerial bombing raid over SL if they decide to let PRC setup a base. However, any suggestion to recreate LTTE, is absurd and illogical. When you create a proxy, they always come back to bite you.

Never create a Frankenstein. Either fight your own war, or leave it.
So you are saying Sri Lanka out played us. It proved my point that they can blackmail us when ever they want. Its foolish to say that India stopped USA making base in Sri Lanka. If USA wanted they could have made a base in any case, they can make one now as well.

Rest of your assertion you are saying is to just add something for sake of adding. I am confused on what you trying to establish or say or which is not been known or said already.
 
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pmaitra

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1. Slaughter of Tamils is real. There is no bias, and whole world has taken a note of it. This is not an emotional issue, this is a political issue as well. Sri Lanka is not willing to fulfil any of the promises it made. If situation doesn't change there will be more insurgencies, and going by the stand India took the new guys with the guns will not see a friend in India, neither will the Sri Lankan government.
Slaughter of Tamils by whom? My question is by whom? Or do you want to keep that in the gray area?

2. India herself is responsible for sending the Indian Soldiers without proper support, plan and ammunition. Don't blame your enemies for killing your soldiers. Blame your leadership. Did you expect LTTE or the Sri Lankan government to lick Indian ass? They found a common enemy and acted according to the new situation. It is you who is getting emotional here.
None of them were enemies, de jure. It was a peace keeping force. Do you know what is a peace keepng force? That SL Army and LTTE proved to be treacherous is Indian Army's fault? That India prevented a US Army base in Sri Lanka is Indian government's fault? Utter drivel.

3. Only the might is right and we have lost all the leverage we had on Sri Lanka. India might have exploited the situation iin a better way which we did not, because Gandhis are calling the shot.
What do you mean by 'exploiting' the situation? Create another Frankenstein? You are using vague phrases. Be specific.

I would not go an inch beyond naval blockade or aerial raid. No boots on the ground like IPKF, no proxies like LTTE.
 

pmaitra

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So you are saying Sri Lanka out played us. It proved my point that they can blackmail us when ever they want. Its foolish to say that India stopped USA making base in Sri Lanka. If USA wanted they could have made a base in any case, they can make one now as well.
Of course they outplayed us and backstabbed us the moment they started shipping stashed of small arms to LTTE cadres.

They actively supported the LTTE to eliminate the rival Tamil groups in Sri Lanka. Their objective was, reduce the number of opponents. It was easy from Sri Lanka to fight one opponent, LTTE, than fight many opponents, i.e. LTTE + other Tamil groups.

Moreover, SL was never comfortable with Indian soldiers, and they wanted LTTE and IPKF to get into fights, so as to force IPKF to leave, while also weakening LTTE, so that they could eliminate LTTE, once the IPKF left.

Rest of your assertion you are saying to just add something for sake of adding. I am confused on what you trying to establish or say or which is not been known or said already.
No, I am disagreeing with everyone who says that sending IPKF was stupid. I am also saying a prolonged conflict between SL Army and LTTE would have cost a lot more lives, than the total death toll of this genocide. Look at the Soviet-Mujahideen War, Vietnam War, Korean War. See the death toll there. Look at the conflicts in Africa.

To think survival of the LTTE would have been nice is naïve.
 

KS

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Are you going to repeat 'any ideas' again and again, or justify your point?

I think a lot more people would have died in a prolonged conflict. If you think otherwise, then you are living in la-la land.

I am glad the LTTE has been destroyed. Good riddance. The LTTE eliminated many Tamil moderates in Sri Lanka, and pushed many children into a bloody civil war, not to mention selective killing of Muslims in Sri Lanka.

If your heart is overflowing with sympathy for LTTE, don't let me stop you, but let me tell you, you have a very distorted idea about this issue.
Actually it is not he who has a distorted idea of the topic--

For the Lankan tamils the choice was very simple..the LTTE were indeed evil, but the Sinhalese the devil incarnate.

The LTTE were lesser of the two evils for them.
 

pmaitra

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Actually it is not he who has a distorted idea of the topic--

For the Lankan tamils the choice was very simple..the LTTE were indeed evil, but the Sinhalese the devil incarnate.

The LTTE were lesser of the two evils for them.
Nobody denies the treachery of SL. I was countering Amit's point, highlighted below:

From the POV of Humanitarianism demise of LTTE spelt a disaster for the Tamil Population. Why are people crying genocide any ideas?
Apparently, he has zero sympathies for those rival Tamil groups that were massacred by the LTTE, including those that were not even militant groups. He is also assuming not more Tamils would have died if this conflict dragged on. I think he is completely wrong, but then, that's what I think. I would change my assumption if he comes out in the clean and clarifies his stance.
 

KS

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  • The two points above are different. One is biased and emotional drivel, and the other one is neutral and objective.


  • Correct. The second point is 'neutral' and 'objective' as seen by a Bengali sitting in North Carolina...not by a Tamil sitting in Vavuniya or Kilinochi.

    As I said previously, LTTE was the lesser of the two evils. Atleast they [the Tamils] had the dignity of life back then and not treated as second class citizens as under the current regime.
 

ajtr

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If Sri Lankan Air Force officers are expelled, we will train them.
July 7, 2012 at 9:18 am | Lanka C News

Pakistan says that, if India will expel the Sri Lankan Air Force officers who are receiving a training in Tamilnadu Army Training Center, Pakistan is ready to train them.
Pakistan, which has many high graded training centers, has expressed it's willingness to train the Sri Lankan Ari force officials soon after the media reports were published regarding the relevant incident.
Even though, India hasn't taken a decision to send back these Sri Lankan Air Force officers , their training secessions in Tamilnadu were cancelled.
The Indian government hasn't officially informed the Sri Lanakn government yet,in this regards.
 

pmaitra

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Correct. The second point is 'neutral' and 'objective' as seen by a Bengali sitting in North Carolina...not by a Tamil sitting in Vavuniya or Kilinochi.
Of course, that is my, and my very own opinion.

As I said to them, LTTE was the lesser of the two evils. Atleast they had the dignity of life back then and not treated as second class citizens as under the current regime.
Agree that SL is worse than LTTE, from the Indian point of view, and again, from an Indian point of view.
 

KS

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Slaughter of Tamils by whom? My question is by whom? Or do you want to keep that in the gray area?
By the Sinhala Army.

The 'massacre' of the Tamils by the LTTE is as much the CRPF 'massacres' in the red belt or the Indian Army did in NE or in the height of militancy in Kashmir.

None of them were enemies, de jure. It was a peace keeping force. Do you know what is a peace keepng force? That SL Army and LTTE proved to be treacherous is Indian Army's fault? That India prevented a US Army base in Sri Lanka is Indian government's fault?
That the IPKF went there without contingency plans for the obvious scenario points to shoddy planning on Indian Army's part.

And it was not a peacekeeping force perse. It was a force that assumed the mandate to disarm the LTTE according to the Rajiv-jayawardene accords and that it expected the world's most dangerous militant group to just lay down arms without a fight is a gross stupidity on IA's part.

Not sure who is engaging in a 'drivel' here witout knowing the facts and going on superficial assumptions.
 

maomao

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If Sri Lankan Air Force officers are expelled, we will train them.
July 7, 2012 at 9:18 am | Lanka C News

Pakistan says that, if India will expel the Sri Lankan Air Force officers who are receiving a training in Tamilnadu Army Training Center, Pakistan is ready to train them.
Pakistan, which has many high graded training centers, has expressed it's willingness to train the Sri Lankan Ari force officials soon after the media reports were published regarding the relevant incident.
Even though, India hasn't taken a decision to send back these Sri Lankan Air Force officers , their training secessions in Tamilnadu were cancelled.
The Indian government hasn't officially informed the Sri Lanakn government yet,in this regards.
pakis will train SLAF on Junk Fighters -17s?
 

KS

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They actively supported the LTTE to eliminate the rival Tamil groups in Sri Lanka. Their objective was, reduce the number of opponents. It was easy from Sri Lanka to fight one opponent, LTTE, than fight many opponents, i.e. LTTE + other Tamil groups..
Wrong on this count.

Actually the different Tamil rebel groups liike LTTE, PLOTE, ERPLF never worked in synergy and spent more time at each other's throats than on the sinhala throats.

It is known locally that it was Dr.MGR who first tried to mediate between the groups in the camps in Theni district and when that failed he asked his favorite guerilla "Prabha" to eliminate the others and make LTTE to assume the mantle of fighting the sinhalese.
 

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