India to select one or more fighter aircraft to be built by private sector

[smestarz]

circus ???
its already a f***ing circus,

make india f16, then f18 ,then rafale , then gripen or buy mig 35 or sukhoi 35,

no jhanjhat would be buy more sukhoi 30 mki until they built lca mk.2 and most importantly amca and fgfa,

but then built lca mk.2 and most importantly amca and fgfa like the iaf's a$$ bet on it,

and if israelis or japanese or any others wants to be partners at it then the more the merrier,

if sukhoi would be over kill for pakis then so be it,it half the price of rafale,

but when war with china hmmmm....,

but then again rafale is too expensive.

Su-30 MKI out classes Rafale, and then we are looking at similar Su-30 MKK from China and also Su-35
What chances does Rafale have against these?

 

[smestarz]

How do you think we perform from noth eastrern french air base a deep strike in Lybia or Mali with 6 laser guided bomb or 2 x cruise missile ? Rafale has 11 store points. 5 are fuel ready.

You want to be appreciated for "performing" against a country that does not have credible air defence and air force? Really? Rafale has the store points but does not have the range on internal fuel
Weapons + range == Su 30 MKI out classes Rafale.

 

[Superdefender]

China bought 24 Su-35s. Total cost slightly above $2 billion. We will have 36 Rafales. Total cost is $7-8 billion. Funny thing is Dassault is still demanding $12 billion!

 

[salute]

what is entire dassault companys worth ???

 

[Superdefender]

what is entire dassault companys worth ???

Who knows? Some days earlier, Boeing was saying they were $97 billion company where as SAABis $5 billion.

 

[smestarz]

Who knows? Some days earlier, Boeing was saying they were $97 billion company where as SAABis $5 billion.

Let us buy SAAB and then we make it in OUR OWN COMPANY

 

[Harinath]

Well IAF has a good plane but I think that Su 30 force in IAF is way to much overused ,everything in IAF is Su 30 .Rafale are needed,it too expence so take about 60 of them and then make 200 Mig 35 and for good sake retire Mig 27,Mirage 2000 and Mig 29 .They are end of their life.

Mate, Mirage 2000 got upgrade very recently for jaw dropping money, i even heard that upgrade per plane was more than single unit of Su-30. MOD and IAF will cry if they are asked to retire Mirage
I think same with MIG 29s....
And I also saw some IAF official saying on the news that plane has half of the life to it and moreover they cant loose skill of the pilot by just decommissioning them, so it is better to upgrade them and keep using those planes.

Now what I do not understand is cant we train the pilots to fly other plane for the fraction of the cost? and buy other equipment or plane? Can that upgrade be justified?

 

[Harinath]

China bought 24 Su-35s. Total cost slightly above $2 billion. We will have 36 Rafales. Total cost is $7-8 billion. Funny thing is Dassault is still demanding $12 billion!

At least by knowing this IAF should back off Rafale, some say IAF inventory is Circus, for me its like Zoo, with such variety of planes.:biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2:
There is no TOT, no Make in India, very costly, better options available for lower prices, then why the hell Rafale only?

 

[Superdefender]

@smestarz, is that even possible in defence industry? Like TATA bought Jaguar and LR.

 

[garg_bharat]

There is no final decision yet. Factors are:

What is on offer and at what price
Iaf accepts the offer

I think a foreign company will set up shop only if the initial order is minimum 100 units.

Government and iaf may have already talked about what is acceptable to iaf. So I guess the offers may already have that element.

 

[garg_bharat]

It is clear that rafale is stuck at 36 and rest will come from other plane under make in india.

 

[Superdefender]

It is clear that rafale is stuck at 36 and rest will come from other plane under make in india.

But IAF will then become circus!

 

[garg_bharat]

Buying Dassault is out of question. Defense industry is heavily regulated. One cannot take out technology out of France even if are a majority shareholder.

There no option but to develop technology.

 

[garg_bharat]

But IAF will then become circus!

It is a circus now. So what changes.

The aircraft types will actually go down in future.

 

[garg_bharat]

Mig27 and mig21 are up for retirement. What is left: su30, mig29, mirage2000, jaguar, LCA tejas.

Future inductions could be fgfa and rafale. If we add one more type, that makes 8. If rafale is deleted, that makes seven types. Is it too much?

 

[garg_bharat]

I believe jaguar is also candidate for retirement if an alternative is there.

 

[Tactical Frog]

Who knows? Some days earlier, Boeing was saying they were $97 billion company where as SAABis $5 billion.

But Dassault group is more than @Dassault_OnAir. There is also @Dassault3ds, $ 3 billion sales in 2015. Dassault Systems sure has some Indian programmers working with them . More , Rafale team is Dassault + Thales + Safran. A much more powerful combo than Saab.

 

[Superdefender]

I believe jaguar is also candidate for retirement if an alternative is there.

Mirage 2000 & Sepecate Jaguar will definitely retire post 2030. I was talking about the addition of F-15, F-16, Gripen, F-18. Then it will be circus in the name of Aerospace industry.

 

[Bahamut]

Mate, Mirage 2000 got upgrade very recently for jaw dropping money, i even heard that upgrade per plane was more than single unit of Su-30. MOD and IAF will cry if they are asked to retire Mirage
I think same with MIG 29s....
And I also saw some IAF official saying on the news that plane has half of the life to it and moreover they cant loose skill of the pilot by just decommissioning them, so it is better to upgrade them and keep using those planes.

Now what I do not understand is cant we train the pilots to fly other plane for the fraction of the cost? and buy other equipment or plane? Can that upgrade be justified?

By new plane then if upgrade is so expense .The reason upgrade is preferred over new plane is because it is less expensive.If we can by brand new jet in that cost like Gripen or Mig 35 or F 16 or F 18SH which are ahead of the upgrade then why upgrade .

 

[smestarz]

At least by knowing this IAF should back off Rafale, some say IAF inventory is Circus, for me its like Zoo, with such variety of planes.:biggrin2::biggrin2::biggrin2:
There is no TOT, no Make in India, very costly, better options available for lower prices, then why the hell Rafale only?

Funnily HAL did take the ToT for the outdated Mirage 2000 as part of the deal