India faces Afghan test, as ally calls for military aid

arya

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best time vor us , but i am sure our leader fn force don' hav balls .

A full gen in force didn't saw blood in officer they retired without war .

We have to use timing best way , i wish maximum we can do . We have to safe our asset there .
 

JBH22

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Key equipment sought by the Afghan National Security Forces (ANSF), the sources said, include medium trucks that can carry 2.5-7 tonne cargos, bridge-laying equipment and engineering facilities. India was also asked to consider the possibility of supplying light mountain artillery, along with ordnance, and to help Afghanistan build close air-support capabilities for its troops in preparation of drastic scaling-down of western forces in 2014.
What a joke?
We are facing shortage in artillery so how the hell can you increase others fighting capabilities:)
 

datguy79

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Not fully developed and in production. India itself awaits a 155mm howitzer
India needs howitzers period. I am looking more at a 7-10 year timeline. However any type of artillery would be welcome given our annual artillery dances with Pakistan.

@Libertarian I seriously doubt that. The Paki-Chini Al-Khalid is based on the Ukranian T80-UD design, which is itself a very capable tank. I'm not an expert, but from what I've read in posts made by @Damian @militarysta @Akim and others, the Arjun is not quite battle ready.

I wonder though even if it is not good enough for IA needs, it is still better than anything the Afghan forces have (do they have any tanks at all?), so selling them truckloads of Arjuns at discounted prices might move the defence relationship forward while at the same time earning forex for India to develop Arjun Mark II and III.
Afghanistan is not conducive to tank warfare. The Soviets learned that the hard way.
 
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Libertarian

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@Known_Unknown
I do not know if the Al-Khalid is superior, but last I heard, the Arjun was considered to be a step above the T-90. And if its indeed "not battle ready" then there's not point in supplying the Afghan forces with an unfinished tank.

Also, I don't think the Afghans are in any position to purchase weapons systems from us. We'll have to donate to them and I think India should provide them with T-90's. It's a great tank that the Indian army itself, is very fond of it.
 
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Yusuf

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India needs howitzers period. I am looking more at a 7-10 year timeline. However any type of artillery would be welcome given our annual artillery dances with Pakistan.



Afghanistan is not conducive to tank warfare. The Soviets learned that the hard way.
7-10 years? Thecrequirement is goingbto be more immediate or else you guys will be swamped by talibunnies and their masters the Pakis.
 

datguy79

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Afghans need aid. They are not going to buy. India can at best recover by getting some mines in Astan.
India already has a multi-billion dollar mine in Bamiyan.

I don't agree with the "they are not going to buy" statement. I guess we won't really have the full means till the mines start churning out money, but just as an example, the US could have easily bought higher quality Indian armaments instead of the $1 billion plus they spent on Mi-17s, Super Tucanos and Humvees. What needs to happen is for the procurement process to be in the hands of Afghans.
 

Known_Unknown

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India needs howitzers period. I am looking more at a 7-10 year timeline. However any type of artillery would be welcome given our annual artillery dances with Pakistan.



Afghanistan is not conducive to tank warfare. The Soviets learned that the hard way.
The Pakis and US were supporting Afghans with arms and funding against the Soviets. In a Paki tank invasion of Afghanistan, where are Afghans going to get RPG's and anti-tank missiles? Afghans will not be able to counter a Paki invasion with mere AK-47's.
 

Known_Unknown

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@Libertarian T-90 cannot be exported, it is license manufactured in India under a contract with Russia. Re-export is not part of the license.
 
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Yusuf

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India already has a multi-billion dollar mine in Bamiyan.

I don't agree with the "they are not going to buy" statement. I guess we won't really have the full means till the mines start churning out money, but just as an example, the US could have easily bought higher quality Indian armaments instead of the $1 billion plus they spent on Mi-17s, Super Tucanos and Humvees. What needs to happen is for the procurement process to be in the hands of Afghans.
What high quality indian arms are you talking about?
 

datguy79

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7-10 years? Thecrequirement is goingbto be more immediate or else you guys will be swamped by talibunnies and their masters the Pakis.
Last year 1050 Afghan soldiers were killed. Guess how many deaths occurred due to to firefights? About 150.

The number decreases drastically when you factor in the upper layers of ANA, specifically the Commandos, Special Forces, and Quick Reaction Forces.

These will be the forces the Taliban will be facing in any major push; and they won't stand a chance against them.

Pakistanis are a more-long term problem but as long as the American jets are in Bagram, let them try.

The reason for the worsening security is a lack of political will at the top. The military arrests the Taliban, Karzai shifts into bipolar mode and releases them. Rinse and repeat. It is a circle of insanity.
 

drkrn

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What the heck?. When are we going to stop pandering to Pakistani fears?. We need to supply all offensive weapons that we can. But main focus should be to make ANSF to self-sustain and be a credible force against Taliban.
yes we should think about pakistans fear about india in afghanistan and make them become true
as on now our economy can support afghan national army with training ,may be with some weapons.but for a lost lasting stable relation we should start working with them inevery field concerned

remember russia helped india very early from our independence and now its a relation very tough not decided by economics.i wish same kind of relations with afghan and keep pakistan at bay
 

arya

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well we have to help afghan , first fight with thought ,

first afghan force has to fight with hard core .
 

pmaitra

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Iran route is not closed as far as I remember. We still have good relations and Iran has a vested interest to see the Talibs out of Astan
This is my source:

It makes sense for India to put pressure on Iran

1. They screwed up our investments, after we discovered oil and gas, they kicked us out.
2. They didn't allow us to use Chahbahar and Zelranj Highway to access Astan, we could've played a major role in this.
3. They are playing hardball on Iran India pipeline, by not alleviating our concerns.
4. They have never given us sweet heart deals like the GCC
5. They are a sinking ship. Their economy is down, they don't have any influence, and we can get better and more secure sources than Iran.

Iran thinks its speaking from a position of strength, lets bring them to their knees.
 

datguy79

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The Pakis and US were supporting Afghans with arms and funding against the Soviets. In a Paki tank invasion of Afghanistan, where are Afghans going to get RPG's and anti-tank missiles? Afghans will not be able to counter a Paki invasion with mere AK-47's.
We have M-16s now.

Look at the map. There are only a few mountainous passes which connect the entire country. It would be suicide for a tank column:

 

hit&run

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On the contrary, Afghanistan provides a golden opportunity to make our own borders safe. 350,000 troops on Pakistsns western borders presents a major threat. India should use its good offi we to secure mines with resources and in return offer to support the $4billion a year cost to maintain these troops. Inda should provide artillery like our own Pinaka, prodlvide tanks like Arjun to support the Afghan people. Pakistan has attacked India when it wanted to. It never waited for any invitation. India really does not have to bother about te sensitivities of Pakistan. We have our own nation to secure. India will have to walk the talk in Astan. Arm them for our own good.
And you guys were opposing doubling the numbers of InA. I took that into my consideration when I read Rajnath's comment as he was stating the obvious.
 

Yusuf

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And you guys were opposing doubling the numbers of InA. I took that into my consideration when I read Rajnath's comment as he was stating the obvious.
His is it relevant? India is no sending boots for he ground. The ANA needs equipment. No where does this reflect on any size increase of IA. And surely Rajnath was not thinking that far anyway.
 

hit&run

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His is it relevant? India is no sending boots for he ground. The ANA needs equipment. No where does this reflect on any size increase of IA. And surely Rajnath was not thinking that far anyway.
Forget about anything from Afghanistan if you do not have resolve to pledge man power and equipment both. This war has to be fought from many front. If people like us at defense forums can comment on military policies then Rajnath Singh I know has good insights on how things work in this regard.

BTW you were not clear about 350,000 of whom.
 

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