India concerned over burgeoning Russia-Pak friendship

SHASH2K2

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Pakistan has always survived thru diplomacy, but this time ther diplomacy is creating a foreign policy mess for India unlike the past.
Its not created by Pakistan. Its Russians trying to use Pakistan against America and India. Russia is feeling insecure about major Defence deals going to America and looks like America is in no hurry to Afganistan as well . These two Issues are making them nervous.
 

ajtr

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Yes that is without a doubt...India has always been a novice in diplomacy tactics.Pakistan on the otherhand have always been able to convince the world that they are innocent.
not always....checkout indira gandhi and PVNR's period.
 
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Its not created by Pakistan. Its Russians trying to use Pakistan against America and India. Russia is feeling insecure about major Defence deals going to America and looks like America is in no hurry to Afganistan as well . These two Issues are making them nervous.
This can backfire for Russia in the worst way they are in danger of losing their biggest arms buyer.
 

Logan

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Truly India needs to review it's diplomatic policy on the eve of may be losing out long standing allies like Russia.
 

ajtr

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India need a shrewed and experienced politicians like chidambram and pranab mukherji in EAM.MMS and his present team must limit themselves to economy and finance.Diplomacy is not MMs' cup of tea.
 

Logan

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Really may be he is to good a person to handle such affairs
 

thakur_ritesh

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oh please! we are painting the figure as if russia offered some fighter jet or a tank or a missile or some other defence deal to pakistan.

header says, russia hopes and there is a big difference between something happening and something being hoped for, and these are economic ties being discussed and not some strategic or defence deals.

and what did pakistan get at the end:

a trade delegation from pakistan which had no proper program charted out, where people were more interested in trying to figure out who will officially represent pakistan. the whole fiasco was taken as a rude gesture by the russians.
a president who was supposed to stay in moscow for two days, but who touched down in the morning and the moment the discussions between him and medvedev were over he left with out even a lunch, which the poor fellow had on flight back home.
what did russia have to offer pakistan on the floods, some sympathy and beyond that?
was there any discussion on afghanistan, and of what use could pakistan be to russia?
fighting terrorism, drug trafficking and international crimes are the three issues they discussed and the end result? any MoU signed?

last time musharraf went, he returned empty handed, this time zardari went and yet again returned empty handed. we are trying to make heads and tails of a meet which was nothing but a failure. big deal!

india still has a significat trade with russia something we plan to double over the next few years which means that many more jobs for the russians, over 200 JVs/defence deals at various stages of execution, 16 nuke plants and all this will get them 10s of billions of dollars. all this assures them a lasting partnership for times to come with an economy which is growing at a rate of average 8% (+) for the past 5 years, and which is expected to hit a double digit figure this fiscal or next.

will the russians endanger all that for a country which is best known for its terror export, for a country which goes through a turmoil every now and then, a country which is a bankrupt state sustained by the USA? and the country which sustains pakistan, the USA, will they allow that entry to the russians, let alone the russians, even the chinese are not happy with them who till date have offered a partly 1.5 m usd aid which is much less to what india has offered.

on one hand there are 10s of billions today which will translate to 100s of billions tomorrow and on the other hand there is a parasite state, and i am pretty sure russians are much more wiser than what we are giving them credit for, and they pretty well know who is where amongst priority list and where their interests lie. there is only that much pakistan can offer, beyond that they are a burden, a burden only americans are ready entertaining.
 

ajtr

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Really may be he is to good a person to handle such affairs
Natwar singh was another good External affairs minister.whoes career was cut short by MMS just coz he was opposed to india voting against iran in IAEA under usa pressure.he was much experienced too right from indira gandhi's days.
 

Logan

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oh please! we are painting the figure as if russia offered some fighter jet or a tank or a missile or some other defence deal to pakistan.

header says, russia hopes and there is a big difference between something happening and something being hoped for, and these are economic ties being discussed and not some strategic or defence deals.

and what did pakistan get at the end:

a trade delegation from pakistan which had no proper program charted out, where people were more interested in trying to figure out who will officially represent pakistan. the whole fiasco was taken as a rude gesture by the russians.
a president who was supposed to stay in moscow for two days, but who touched down in the morning and the moment the discussions between him and medvedev were over he left with out even a lunch, which the poor fellow had on flight back home.
what did russia have to offer pakistan on the floods, some sympathy and beyond that?
was there any discussion on afghanistan, and of what use could pakistan be to russia?
fighting terrorism, drug trafficking and international crimes are the three issues they discussed and the end result? any MoU signed?

last time musharraf went, he returned empty handed, this time zardari went and yet again returned empty handed. we are trying to make heads and tails of a meet which was nothing but a failure. big deal!

india still has a significat trade with russia something we plan to double over the next few years which means that many more jobs for the russians, over 200 JVs/defence deals at various stages of execution, 16 nuke plants and all this will get them 10s of billions of dollars. all this assures them a lasting partnership for times to come with an economy which is growing at a rate of average 8% (+) for the past 5 years, and which is expected to hit a double digit figure this fiscal or next.

will the russians endanger all that for a country which is best known for its terror export, for a country which goes through a turmoil every now and then, a country which is a bankrupt state sustained by the USA? and the country which sustains pakistan, the USA, will they allow that entry to the russians, let alone the russians, even the chinese are not happy with them who till date have offered a partly 1.5 m usd aid which is much less to what india has offered.

on one hand there are 10s of billions today which will translate to 100s of billions tomorrow and on the other hand there is a parasite state, and i am pretty sure russians are much more wiser than what we are giving them credit for, and they pretty well know who is where amongst priority list and where their interests lie. there is only that much pakistan can offer, beyond that they are a burden, a burden only americans are ready entertaining.
Nobody said that it's a certainty,,we are just discussing on the possibility.
 

Yusuf

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Well TR just rightly elaborated on my thoughts. I had just dismissed them as lip service and not wasted further time on this. We create too many theories when non exist.
 

Logan

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Natwar singh was another good External affairs minister.whoes career was cut short by MMS just coz he was opposed to india voting against iran in IAEA under usa pressure.he was much experienced too right from indira gandhi's days.
In anyway i don't think MMS handles any external affairs,,,he hardly handles even internal affairs.He is just good giving speeches from time to time.
 

Rebelkid

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Nobody said that it's a certainty,,we are just discussing on the possibility.
Its an extremely far fetched possibility , nothing can really come out of this as Pakistan has nothing to offer
 

nitesh

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well comrade madadev said we have not forgotten nor forgiven :)
 

Logan

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Its an extremely far fetched possibility , nothing can really come out of this as Pakistan has nothing to offer
May be it's too far reaching but,,just who knows someday India might turn out to be a NATO ally,and Pakistan might switch place with India to be an ally of Russia.Because even Russia fears that India's growing economic and military ties with USA might take a toll on their relationship with India.Then they must have another alliance ready to counter what would be lost may be

JUST MAY BE!!
 

Phenom

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You know Russia is not betrothed to India, let them deal with Pakistan, trade with them. As long as it not defence related this shouldn't worry India. Considering the amount of money India is likely to invest in Russian defence projects, I can't see Russia moving towards Pakistan as far as defence is concerned as least in the near to medium future.
 

SHASH2K2

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May be it's too far reaching but,,just who knows someday India might turn out to be a NATO ally,and Pakistan might switch place with India to be an ally of Russia.Because even Russia fears that India's growing economic and military ties with USA might take a toll on their relationship with India.Then they must have another alliance ready to counter what would be lost may be

JUST MAY BE!!
In politics no one is real friend and enemy . Its all about intrests. As of now USA and India are in better positions to gain from each other . No one can predict Geopolitical scenario even 5 years from now.
 

ajtr

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oh please! we are painting the figure as if russia offered some fighter jet or a tank or a missile or some other defence deal to pakistan.

header says, russia hopes and there is a big difference between something happening and something being hoped for, and these are economic ties being discussed and not some strategic or defence deals.

and what did pakistan get at the end:

a trade delegation from pakistan which had no proper program charted out, where people were more interested in trying to figure out who will officially represent pakistan. the whole fiasco was taken as a rude gesture by the russians.
a president who was supposed to stay in moscow for two days, but who touched down in the morning and the moment the discussions between him and medvedev were over he left with out even a lunch, which the poor fellow had on flight back home.
what did russia have to offer pakistan on the floods, some sympathy and beyond that?
was there any discussion on afghanistan, and of what use could pakistan be to russia?
fighting terrorism, drug trafficking and international crimes are the three issues they discussed and the end result? any MoU signed?

last time musharraf went, he returned empty handed, this time zardari went and yet again returned empty handed. we are trying to make heads and tails of a meet which was nothing but a failure. big deal!

india still has a significat trade with russia something we plan to double over the next few years which means that many more jobs for the russians, over 200 JVs/defence deals at various stages of execution, 16 nuke plants and all this will get them 10s of billions of dollars. all this assures them a lasting partnership for times to come with an economy which is growing at a rate of average 8% (+) for the past 5 years, and which is expected to hit a double digit figure this fiscal or next.

will the russians endanger all that for a country which is best known for its terror export, for a country which goes through a turmoil every now and then, a country which is a bankrupt state sustained by the USA? and the country which sustains pakistan, the USA, will they allow that entry to the russians, let alone the russians, even the chinese are not happy with them who till date have offered a partly 1.5 m usd aid which is much less to what india has offered.

on one hand there are 10s of billions today which will translate to 100s of billions tomorrow and on the other hand there is a parasite state, and i am pretty sure russians are much more wiser than what we are giving them credit for, and they pretty well know who is where amongst priority list and where their interests lie. there is only that much pakistan can offer, beyond that they are a burden, a burden only americans are ready entertaining.
Thats the thing indians think relationship/partenership like typical bania in terms of trade and money.If trade would ve been such a corner stone of any relationship then india would not have been getting kicked around in afghanistan.What india can do for usa or for russia in afganistan which is becoming threat to their security .will india shed its blood in afghanistan to save nata and west??no india cant so inspite of india being attractive market for west india is not as important strategically for west as pakistan is.Can india become west rent boy like pakistan.Trade is one of the many reason for relationship but its not the only one
 

Logan

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In politics no one is real friend and enemy . Its all about intrests. As of now USA and India are in better positions to gain from each other . No one can predict Geopolitical scenario even 5 years from now.
Right said but i just hope that India stands to be a gainer in the end whatever be the relationship chemistry!!
 

Rebelkid

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You know Russia is not betrothed to India, let them deal with Pakistan, trade with them. As long as it not defence related this shouldn't worry India. Considering the amount of money India is likely to invest in Russian defence projects, I can't see Russia moving towards Pakistan as far as defence is concerned as least in the near to medium future.
Definitely not in the near future

http://english.ruvr.ru/2010/08/19/16444721.html

Russia is due to win another Indian order for 59 multi-purpose helicopters in addition to the 80 ordered earlier, something that will retain Moscow's traditionally dominant lead in selling military aircraft to India, the Indian Air Force chief has said.

In an interview with the India Strategic Defence magazine on Thursday, Marshal Pradip Vasant Naik explained that the delivery of the first lot of 80 Mi-17 helicopters, ordered in 2008, would begin from later this year.

He added that an estimated 20 billon dollars( :emot100: ) worth of contracts have been signed by Russian and Indian defence companies over the past seven months.

$$$$$$$$$$$$ :emot158:
 

thakur_ritesh

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Thats the thing indians think relationship/partenership like typical bania in terms of trade and money.If trade would ve been such a corner stone of any relationship then india would not have been getting kicked around in afghanistan.What india can do for usa or for russia in afganistan which is becoming threat to their security .will india shed its blood in afghanistan to save nata and west??no india cant so inspite of india being attractive market for west india is not as important strategically for west as pakistan is.Can india become west rent boy like pakistan.Trade is one of the many reason for relationship but its not the only one
AJ,

a certain obama is not planning to visit the very strategically located pakistan, a first. should tell a story.
yes trade is not every thing but things dont happen in isolation, things get weighed in and then decisions get taken. the same US is wooing india at the cost of pakistan which makes pakistan extremely offended.
it is the same US which is planning to cut a'stan and plan a role for india, along with it self, which by the way is a disaster for a certain very strategically located pakistan.
a certain civil nuke deal which finished off our isolation was thanks to a certain US, something the same US is not ready to offer a certain very strategically located pakistan.
the US is now being pushed by india on getting us various seats at various foras, the unsc permanent seat included, all of which is not being offered to a certian very strategically located pakistan.
 

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